Climate Change / Global Warming Discussion

[mspohr]

Not so clean.
Ohio House Republicans overhaul ‘clean-energy’ bill to focus on nuclear, coal subsidies
COLUMBUS, Ohio—Ohio House Republicans on Wednesday dramatically transformed a controversial “clean-energy” subsidy bill, turning it into a bailout plan for both nuclear and coal power plants owned by Ohio companies.

 

[mspohr]

Geez - you guys are dense.

Meanwhile I need to deal with the terrible "atmospheric convulsion" and "historic disaster" that your alarmist heroes warned us about last week!

Missouri: destructive tornado leaves three people dead and severe damage

Missouri: destructive tornado leaves three people dead and severe damage
A series of devastating storms hit the area on Wednesday night leading to multiple tornadoes. The region has already endured days of torrential rain and flooding.

 

[mspohr]

Republicans aren’t just climate deniers. They deny the extinction crisis, too

Republicans aren’t just climate deniers. They deny the extinction crisis, too

Maybe you’ve read King Lear and remember this famous line: “‘Tis the time’s plague when madmen lead the blind.” The words were written more than 400 years ago as a comment on the deadly consequences of greed, delusion and political folly, but they could serve just as well as a Republican party slogan today. They’re a fitting description of the Republican party’s delusional campaign to deny the environmental crises that threaten our planet and our civilization.

 

[S'toon]

Trump’s EPA is ‘cooking the books’ to justify its attack on clean air rules

 

[S'toon]

Chile's 12,000-square kilometre Southern Patagonia Ice Field has split in two and is likely to continue to fracture amid climate change, according to a team of Chilean scientists who were in the region in March.

Gino Casassa, chief of the Snow and Glacier Division of Chile's DGA water authority, told Reuters increasing temperatures along the Andes Mountains in southern Chile and Argentina have meant less snow and ice to replenish the region's abundant glaciers.

"What occurred is a fracture as the ice has retreated, Casassa said.

The chunk of ice that split off from the main glacier was estimated at 208 square kilometres, a relatively small part of the ice field.

But Casassa said it may be a sign of things to come.


<snip>
Scientists say Chile's Southern Patagonia Ice Field has 'split in two'

 

[mspohr]

Meat is a big problem

The next global agricultural revolution

 

[mspohr]

Geez - you guys are dense.

Meanwhile I need to deal with the terrible "atmospheric convulsion" and "historic disaster" that your alarmist heroes warned us about last week!

In the Midwest, Heavy Rains, Devastating Floods and Then Sirens Missouri Tornadoes: Rain, Floods and ‘Then the Sirens Go’

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. — It has been a relentless storm season in the Midwest.

First came flooded farm fields and roads across Nebraska and Iowa. Then the Mississippi River rose and rose, threatening towns along its banks. And on Wednesday night, a series of violent tornadoes tore through the region, ripping apart buildings and darkening whole neighborhoods.

Even then, another threat was looming: rising waters. In Tulsa, Okla., and surrounding suburbs it was a tense evening on Thursday as water levels steadily rose and officials braced for some of the worst flooding in decades along the Arkansas River after the Army Corps of Engineers increased the flow of releases from Keystone Dam.

And officials were warning of swollen waters along the Mississippi, the Missouri and the Illinois Rivers.

All of it was bringing a new level of exhaustion to a region that has found itself fighting multiple crises through a wet and battering spring.

 

[S'toon]

In the Midwest, Heavy Rains, Devastating Floods and Then Sirens Missouri Tornadoes: Rain, Floods and ‘Then the Sirens Go’

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. — It has been a relentless storm season in the Midwest.

First came flooded farm fields and roads across Nebraska and Iowa. Then the Mississippi River rose and rose, threatening towns along its banks. And on Wednesday night, a series of violent tornadoes tore through the region, ripping apart buildings and darkening whole neighborhoods.

Even then, another threat was looming: rising waters. In Tulsa, Okla., and surrounding suburbs it was a tense evening on Thursday as water levels steadily rose and officials braced for some of the worst flooding in decades along the Arkansas River after the Army Corps of Engineers increased the flow of releases from Keystone Dam.

And officials were warning of swollen waters along the Mississippi, the Missouri and the Illinois Rivers.

All of it was bringing a new level of exhaustion to a region that has found itself fighting multiple crises through a wet and battering spring.

Fire-driven weather is 'new reality' for Canada and elsewhere, expert cautions

 

[jrad6515]

In the Midwest, Heavy Rains, Devastating Floods and Then Sirens Missouri Tornadoes: Rain, Floods and ‘Then the Sirens Go’

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. — It has been a relentless storm season in the Midwest.

First came flooded farm fields and roads across Nebraska and Iowa. Then the Mississippi River rose and rose, threatening towns along its banks. And on Wednesday night, a series of violent tornadoes tore through the region, ripping apart buildings and darkening whole neighborhoods.

Even then, another threat was looming: rising waters. In Tulsa, Okla., and surrounding suburbs it was a tense evening on Thursday as water levels steadily rose and officials braced for some of the worst flooding in decades along the Arkansas River after the Army Corps of Engineers increased the flow of releases from Keystone Dam.

And officials were warning of swollen waters along the Mississippi, the Missouri and the Illinois Rivers.

All of it was bringing a new level of exhaustion to a region that has found itself fighting multiple crises through a wet and battering spring.

Lol, so this somehow is related to the myth of AGW? Missouri had an F3 tornado this week that killed 3 people. So what? Here in Texas we have had at least 30-40 tornadoes that were stronger and killed more people since 1900. It's called "normal weather" and has nothing to do with "climate change". Nice try though. Thanks for playing!

 

[jrad6515]

How little you understand. Given that the earth is warming, the null hypothesis is already rejected.

So because the earth has warmed recently after decades of extreme cooling the null hypothesis is rejected? You are either really clueless or scientifically illiterate. Probably both. Obviously you have no training in science or you would know that the null hypothesis is that the climate we are experiencing right now is due to normal factors. YOU need need to prove otherwise but of course you can't.

 

[jrad6515]

We will work through it scientifically. I won’t just lift up an curtain and go “see?!” Because that’s not how science works. Science is a process. It’ll be a multi part discussion during which you will have the opportunity to provide any well sourced objections to the methodology, and we can test both of the methodologies on a manufactured data set to see which properly cleanses it and which doesn’t.

It will absolutely include validating the temperature record.

As a quick initial napkin scribble, I see the parts breaking down something like this:

1. Land temperature changes with validation methodology
2. Ocean temperature and acidification changes with validation methodology (might be worth splitting into two parts)
3. Historical recap of carbon levels and temperature fluctuations from the fossil record
4. Review of atmospheric carbon levels in the Industrial Age contextualized within the results from our earlier studies
5. Probability analysis for anthropogenic carbon’s effect on global land and ocean temperature and acidification changes. (Your favorite part!)

As you can see, the parts all fit together. There’s no way to “skip to the end.” That is not how we do science. I’m absolutely eager and looking forward to doing this so let me know when it works for you.

Gee thanks for the lesson on science! Since you are the great science expert and apparently have proof that no one else has, lay out your proof here and I will be happy to take a look and critique your work. You have been stalling for months now and I'm tiring of all the dancing around so I'm done until you post some solid proof of AGW. PM me when you post your work and I will respond.

 

[mspohr]

EU ignoring climate crisis with livestock farm subsidies, campaigners warn

EU ignoring climate crisis with livestock farm subsidies, campaigners warn

The EU is disregarding the climate emergency by continuing to give out billions of euros in subsidies to climate-intensive livestock farms at the same time as promising to cut emissions, say campaigners.

Under the Paris climate agreement, the EU and its member states have committed to reduce emissions in the European Union by at least 40% by 2030. The EU’s farming sector has shown no decline in emissions since 2010, with meat and dairy estimated to be responsible for 12-17% of total greenhouse gas emissions.

 

[mspohr]

Reuters published the results of a government study indicating that Climate Change would lead to increased costs for farmers, where Scientists call climate change a supporting factor in water logged midwest.

Wehner said the flooding was consistent with projections in a government report issued last November, the National Climate Assessment Volume II, that said climate change would boost costs in industries from farming to fisheries and energy production by increasing the frequency of powerful storms.

That report, mandated by Congress, was compiled by 13 federal departments and agencies, but was called inaccurate by the White House.

 

[SageBrush]

you would know that the null hypothesis is that the climate we are experiencing right now is due to normal factors. YOU need need to prove otherwise but of course you can't.

::sigh::
Description
In inferential statistics, the null hypothesis is a general statement or default position that there is no relationship between two measured phenomena.

Since CO2 rise is not in doubt (right ?) and you now accept that the earth is warming and the two data sets are correlative the H0 hypothesis is rejected.

You do not understand the difference between rejecting the H0 hypothesis and proof of an alternative. Your misunderstanding of the difference between hypothesis and theory stems from similar ignorance.

 

[ohmman]

Gee thanks for the lesson on science! Since you are the great science expert and apparently have proof that no one else has, lay out your proof here and I will be happy to take a look and critique your work. You have been stalling for months now and I'm tiring of all the dancing around so I'm done until you post some solid proof of AGW. PM me when you post your work and I will respond.

Weren’t you the one who called me a coward? You know it’s too much information to put here, which is why I offered to do a multi-hour discussion with you. But you’ve shown everyone your true colors, so I’ll merely respond with a link back to your cowardice if you insist on returning to this thread.

I suggest growing up or shutting up.

 

[S'toon]

::sigh::
Description
In inferential statistics, the null hypothesis is a general statement or default position that there is no relationship between two measured phenomena.

Since CO2 rise is not in doubt (right ?) and you now accept that the earth is warming and the two data sets are correlative the H0 hypothesis is rejected.

You do not understand the difference between rejecting the H0 hypothesis and proof of an alternative. Your misunderstanding of the difference between hypothesis and theory stems from similar ignorance.

Hmmm. Claims to have a PhD in Chemical Engineering. Doesn't understand the different between hypothesis and scientific theory...

 

[S'toon]

Reuters published the results of a government study indicating that Climate Change would lead to increased costs for farmers, where Scientists call climate change a supporting factor in water logged midwest.

Wehner said the flooding was consistent with projections in a government report issued last November, the National Climate Assessment Volume II, that said climate change would boost costs in industries from farming to fisheries and energy production by increasing the frequency of powerful storms.

That report, mandated by Congress, was compiled by 13 federal departments and agencies, but was called inaccurate by the White House.

Senate hearing on agriculture and climate change featured industry speakers, no climate scientists

 

[SR22pilot]

I see jrad6515 is at it again. Notice the Merchants of Doubt methodology. He tries to appear as someone interested in an honest debate but accepts nothing; even when it is solid science. He insists people "PROVE" things because he knows science only verifies rather than proves. He offers no contrary "proof." In real science there are competing hypotheses with scientists looking to see which is better supported by the data. Jrad6515 avoids this by offering no hypothesis at all. He hides behind his fallacious use of the null hypothesis. This is precisely how big tobacco fought off attacks for years. Think about it. No matter what data was presented showing smoking was unhealthy, it was really "proof"as far as big tobacco was concerned. Big tobacco kept asking scientists to prove tobacco was dangerous but they never "proved" tobacco was safe. Similarly, jrad6515 will never offer "proof" that man has had no effect on the long term climate.

 

[mspohr]

Flooding in the Midwest: 4 Rivers Surge, Along With Residents’ Worries

The punishing rains are consistent with the effects of climate change, since warmer atmosphere can hold more moisture — and release it.

ALTON, Ill. — To say that there is a powerful river in the Midwest that is threatening to flood communities nearby hardly narrows it down.

The Illinois, the Missouri, the Arkansas and the Mississippi Rivers were all at risk of spilling over in the coming days. The prospect put a patchwork of local and state officials on high alert on Friday, as they prepared sandbags, assembled barriers and nervously eyed the rising waters.

This spring has been a season of record-breaking floods across the Midwest, submerging farms, businesses and houses. Scientists have predicted that the flooding this year could be worse than the historic floods of 1993, which devastated the region.

 

[mspohr]

Unfortunately, the weather service prediction of severe climate crisis driven weather is continuing.

Oklahoma: two dead after possible tornado as storms death toll climbs

Oklahoma: two dead after possible tornado as storms death toll climbs

The storm came after a week of tornados, severe rain and flooding in southern plains and midwest states, including a tornado that hit Jefferson City, Missouri. The region’s most recent spate of bad weather and flooding has been blamed for at least nine deaths.