Coronavirus

[scottf200]

I kind of wonder about how the quadruple whammy may look by the end of January '22.

a) Thanksgiving, b) winter indoors in general, c) Christmas, and d) Omicron.

a) ...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468352855434313736

 

[Krugerrand]

The side effects IMO are more than worth the advantages. At worst, the side effects can knock you out of commission for a couple of days. That's well worth it for even a slight increase in protection. And since the J&J vaccine is an entirely different kind of vaccine than Pfizer & Moderna, I'd expect the improvement in protection gained by including it in the mix to be substantial.

Not actually true. It took me more than a month to recover fully from my second Moderna shot. Specifically, to recover my stamina and energy level, and the ability to return to my regular level of exercise.

I will get a booster, though not as soon as suggested, and I will go with a Pfizer to try and mitigate a repeat of the last and to hopefully get some crossover coverage.

Most people aren’t fully aware of their bodies and how they feel. They’ll notice a sore arm if they’re told they can expect one, but they won’t recognize more subtle changes. Since I have a very consistent and specific exercise routine, I was very aware of the differences.

 

[JRP3]

Maybe the recent dust up was because the conversation had some new people joining in

Specifically 2 low information commenters started spewing garbage. Previously this thread has been mostly informative and free of nonsense.

 

[ElectricIAC]

Most people aren’t fully aware of their bodies and how they feel. They’ll notice a sore arm if they’re told they can expect one, but they won’t recognize more subtle changes. Since I have a very consistent and specific exercise routine, I was very aware of the differences.

And therein lies the issue with a one size fits all solution and mandates for that matter. People should absolutely consult their doctor and be aware of their conditions to spot any subtle or overt anomaly.

Especially when you can’t sue for damages in the event of a severely adverse reaction.

 

[jerry33]

Since I have a very consistent and specific exercise routine, I was very aware of the differences.

I have a consistent and specific exercise routine as well (rowing), but I didn't notice any particular differences from before to after any of the shots. YMMV.

 

[daniel]

Got a holiday party in a poorly ventilated restaurant at the end of this week! Guess I'll be testing that booster!

Good luck. I hope you stay well. I'm fully vaccinated and boosted but I would not set foot in a restaurant, even a well-ventilated one that's not crowded. Indoors with unmasked people eating and shouting at each other.

Not actually true. It took me more than a month to recover fully from my second Moderna shot. Specifically, to recover my stamina and energy level, and the ability to return to my regular level of exercise.

I will get a booster, though not as soon as suggested, and I will go with a Pfizer to try and mitigate a repeat of the last and to hopefully get some crossover coverage.

Most people aren’t fully aware of their bodies and how they feel. They’ll notice a sore arm if they’re told they can expect one, but they won’t recognize more subtle changes. Since I have a very consistent and specific exercise routine, I was very aware of the differences.

I guess I need to change my position from "there's no downside" to "it's well worth the very small risk, given the benefit." A neighbor of mine with bad allergies had such a strong reaction to her first shot that she has not gotten another.

Like you, I have a regular exercise routine and am well aware when I'm a bit more tired than normal, or a bit stronger than normal. Given my very mild reactions to my three shots, I will continue to get all recommended vaccines, as soon as available. There are days when, for no reason I can determine, I'm more tired. And other days when I'm stronger. The shots had minimal if any effect on my energy level.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

I'm fully vaccinated and boosted but I would not set foot in a restaurant, even a well-ventilated one that's not crowded. Indoors with unmasked people eating and shouting at each other.

I think I am probably at about 30x lower risk than you (based on my recollection of your approximate age), so that makes sense. If I were over 60 I would not risk it.

This is just the second time I will have had an exposure like this since boosting (none before of course), and the restaurant will only contain people from our company (and staff of course). And these are people who I work with in the office a few days a week, so additional risk is small.

It is definitely a roll of the dice. However, the boosters work extremely well and it is likely (90%, maybe higher - I probably have high Ab levels but have not checked) I’d be protected against symptomatic infection.

 

[Krugerrand]

Good luck. I hope you stay well. I'm fully vaccinated and boosted but I would not set foot in a restaurant, even a well-ventilated one that's not crowded. Indoors with unmasked people eating and shouting at each other.



I guess I need to change my position from "there's no downside" to "it's well worth the very small risk, given the benefit." A neighbor of mine with bad allergies had such a strong reaction to her first shot that she has not gotten another.

Like you, I have a regular exercise routine and am well aware when I'm a bit more tired than normal, or a bit stronger than normal. Given my very mild reactions to my three shots, I will continue to get all recommended vaccines, as soon as available. There are days when, for no reason I can determine, I'm more tired. And other days when I'm stronger. The shots had minimal if any effect on my energy level.

Obviously, for the majority the side effects are negligible, but you can imagine how I or your neighbor wouldn’t be looking forward to the side effects every 6 months, with each subsequent boost increasing those effects. Indeed, your neighbor said no more.

I don’t want to ever get this virus, not even with mild symptoms, or being asymptomatic. Thus I will continue to get vaccinated and boosted, I’ll just be more judicious, and of course continue being cautious out and about in the world where many others seem to think it’s their right to endanger the lives of others; not that that’s anything new.

Stay safe and healthy.

 

[Krugerrand]

I think I am probably at about 30x lower risk than you (based on my recollection of your approximate age), so that makes sense. If I were over 60 I would not risk it.

This is just the second time I will have had an exposure like this since boosting (none before of course), and the restaurant will only contain people from our company (and staff of course). And these are people who I work with in the office a few days a week, so additional risk is small.

It is definitely a roll of the dice. However, the boosters work extremely well and it is likely (90%, maybe higher - I probably have high Ab levels but have not checked) I’d be protected against symptomatic infection.

Good luck! Hope everyone stays safe and healthy.

 

[ohmman]

Moderator Note: We have a Climate Change Denial thread in order to keep the Climate Change thread informative and cooperative. Do we need to create a similar neighboring thread here so that discussions about COVID can continue without disruption? I'm pretty close to taking that step if members cannot focus on the topic.

 

[JRP3]

Actually a good idea. Especially as the "Ignore" feature isn't working very well.

 

[EVNow]

Some good news about Pfizer booster & Omicron.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468548928564084745

Covid news: UK reports 51,342 new infections; vaccines protect against new variant – as it happened

Latest figures come amid concern over spread of Omicron variant; Pfizer says third jab increased antibodies by factor of 25

www.theguardian.com

 

[TespaceX]

Signs of Omicron found in California wastewater, suggesting variant is widespread

Looks like Omicron will become dominant variant pretty soon in CA.

 

[XLR82XS]

Not actually true. It took me more than a month to recover fully from my second Moderna shot. Specifically, to recover my stamina and energy level, and the ability to return to my regular level of exercise.

I will get a booster, though not as soon as suggested, and I will go with a Pfizer to try and mitigate a repeat of the last and to hopefully get some crossover coverage.

Not a good idea.

30 facts you NEED to know: Your Covid Cribsheet

Kit Knightly We get a lot of e-mails and private messages along these lines “do you have a source for X?” or “can you point me to mask studies?” or “I know I saw a gra…

off-guardian.org

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Some good news about Pfizer booster & Omicron.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468548928564084745

Covid news: UK reports 51,342 new infections; vaccines protect against new variant – as it happened

Latest figures come amid concern over spread of Omicron variant; Pfizer says third jab increased antibodies by factor of 25

www.theguardian.com

Yep, lots of tentatively good news today on vaccines & also the trajectory of cases in South Africa looks like it is leveling off a bit.

Still early to know for sure exactly how things are going to turn out. Boosters seem good, and natural infection followed by vaccination appears that it will be quite effective against Omicron. Time will tell, though. Just random speculation, but I definitely expect to see a higher breakthrough rate with three doses, especially a few months after the booster, but I'm hopeful that we'll see less than we did with Delta with two doses. Hopefully will be enough to tide people over until boosters for Omicron are available, assuming they are needed. And then we'll have to wait and see if the virus has any further room to wiggle.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468520424409419776

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468569718420389891

 

[EVNow]

Hopefully will be enough to tide people over until boosters for Omicron are available, assuming they are needed. And then we'll have to wait and see if the virus has any further room to wiggle.

We'll probably need a booster every 3 months from now on

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

We'll probably need a booster every 3 months from now on

Haha. I keep on thinking that the virus won't change much more, and I keep being wrong.

I will say that modeling teams had predicted previously that this particular combination of mutations would be particularly bad. And they didn't predict something else. So that gives me hope that this is some sort of "optimum" and there'd have to be a more dramatic shift to get immune escape from here.

So I still think there's some hope that the antigenic drift will taper off for this coronavirus. It really is nothing like flu. Antigenic drift and antigenic shift are complicated topics, but there are things that differ between the influenza and coronavirus that make them distinctly different and I'm not sure that we should expect annual boosters long term.

If we do, so be it. But I think it's going to be a bit different than influenza once things settle out. At a minimum, it seems that efficacy will likely be much better than it is for the influenza vaccine.

All speculation though. It's very hard to get a deep dive from an expert, in layman's terms, into the ways in which these viruses differ, but one difference we've discussed previously is the segmented influenza genome. Is reassortment still possible with coronavirus? Maybe. But it's not as common or likely as I understand it (it can happen though: Co-infection of MERS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 in the same host: A silent threat).

Again, from Wikipedia, SARS-CoV-2 does not have a segmented genome (it has a "has a linear, positive-sense, single-stranded RNA genome about 30,000 bases long"), and it has a proofreading mechanism ("One of the proteins specified by the coronavirus genome is a non-structural protein, nsp14, that is a 3’-to-5’ exoribonuclease (ExoN). This protein resides in the protein complex nsp10-nsp14 that enhances replication fidelity by proofreading RNA synthesis, an activity critical for the virus life cycle."):

RNA Virus Reassortment: An Evolutionary Mechanism for Host Jumps and Immune Evasion

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

For influenza:
"reassortment accelerates the rate of acquisition of genetic markers that overcome adaptive host barriers faster than the slower process of incremental increase due to mutation alone. The emergence of new influenza genes in humans and their subsequent establishment to cause pandemics have been consistently linked with reassortment of novel and previously circulating viruses"

 

[ohmman]

Fine. 13 posts moved to Coronavirus Denial. Future posts that are not discussions about the actual virus and its effects will be moved there. Sorry, but it wasn't going to end.

 

[TespaceX]

Obviously, more time needs to pass to know more about full spectrum of lab studies and clinical manifestations of omicron’s effect on vaccines.

Here’s the in-vitro results from a study out of Germany (similar to what was done in SA).
That drop.

 

[madodel]

COVID Surge: Pennsylvania Hospital Chain Runs Out of Beds

Geisinger is a large hospital network and health insurance conglomerate north of my county that is the main provider for most of the rural counties in North Eastern Pennsylvania. They said on the news that because of COVID they are at over 100% capacity and their ERs have 10-20 hour waits to be seen. They are putting people on gurneys with O2 in the hallways because there are no beds left. And over 90% of those COVID patients are unvaccinated.