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CowboyStateDaily: Why California’s Ban On Diesel Trucks Could Impact Wyoming

Why California’s Ban On Diesel Trucks Could Impact Wyoming

Tesla-semi-11.22.22.jpg

Why California’s Ban On Diesel Trucks Could Impact Wyoming​

Published on November 22, 2022November 22, 2022 in Energy/News

By Kevin Killough, energy reporter
[email protected]

California first banned gas-powered cars. Now it’s also targeting diesel-powered semitrucks.

And the charging stations needed for the electric trucks that would replace diesel trucks will require about the same amount of power of a small town.

The California Air Resources Board is proposing that after 2025, diesel-powered rigs with more than 800,000 miles on them not be allowed to operate at ports and railyards in the state. Additionally, CARB wants to require that starting in two years, all new vehicles be powered by “clean” fuels.

The goal of these proposals is to eliminate 30,000 diesel-powered trucks by 2035.

Wyoming Watches

Sheila Foertsch, managing director of the Wyoming Trucking Association, said the California proposal is so recent that she couldn’t comment on it. She doesn’t think many of the association’s members do a lot of work in California.

However, California’s policies often have a ripple effect across the country as other states consider or implement California’s rules. The federal Clean Air Act prohibits states from setting their own emissions standards, but a provision in the act authorizes the EPA to grant California a waiver from that restriction. Other states can then go along with California’s regulations without EPA review.

Power the Future, an energy industry advocacy group, estimated in a recent report that about 40% of the U.S. population is in states that follow California’s lead in setting emissions.

How the semitruck proposal will play out, Foertsch couldn’t say until she’s had time to look at the regulation.

“When states implement those kinds of broad-based requirements, it has a far-reaching effect on industries,” she said. “So, it’s something we’re watching.”

Tesla Semi

If the rules go into law and spread across the nation, compliance will be expensive. Smaller trucking companies and independent owner/operators would have a tough time surviving them.

Electric semitrucks retail for about $180,000, which is two to three times the cost of a new diesel truck. There are some tax breaks that would bring that price down.

Tesla claims its electric semis will save $200,000 in fuel costs in their first three years of ownership. The trucks also require less maintenance, meaning drivers will spend less time and money servicing their trucks.

The Wall Street Journal reports most electric trucks have a range of about 100 to 200 miles.

Tesla advertises its semi as having a range of 500 miles with a 40-ton load, with an acceleration rate comparable to that of a diesel-powered truck. It can charge to 70% in 30 minutes with special charging stations. So far, these special charging stations are few and far between, especially across Wyoming.

Lots of Power

California state officials, according to the Wall Street Journal, estimate the state will need 157,000 semitruck chargers by 2030 to support their proposed rules for electric semis.

The average cost of a high-level passenger charging station is about $500,000 each. At that rate, the state will need $78.5 billion to cover the cost of the chargers. Since large rigs will need a lot more power, it’s likely the stations will cost more.

National Grid, a northeast U.S. utility company, performed a study that estimated a single Tesla Semi charging station would require the same amount of power as a small town.

If the past is any indicator, these numbers won’t deter California from proceeding ahead with the plans. Last summer, CARB voted to require all new cars sold in California to be emissions free by 2035. Days later, state officials asked residents not to charge their cars as a September heat wave was stressing the state’s electrical grid.
 
Why California’s Ban On Diesel Trucks Could Impact Wyoming

Tesla-semi-11.22.22.jpg

Why California’s Ban On Diesel Trucks Could Impact Wyoming​

Published on November 22, 2022November 22, 2022 in Energy/News

By Kevin Killough, energy reporter
[email protected]

California first banned gas-powered cars. Now it’s also targeting diesel-powered semitrucks.

And the charging stations needed for the electric trucks that would replace diesel trucks will require about the same amount of power of a small town.

The California Air Resources Board is proposing that after 2025, diesel-powered rigs with more than 800,000 miles on them not be allowed to operate at ports and railyards in the state. Additionally, CARB wants to require that starting in two years, all new vehicles be powered by “clean” fuels.

The goal of these proposals is to eliminate 30,000 diesel-powered trucks by 2035.

Wyoming Watches

Sheila Foertsch, managing director of the Wyoming Trucking Association, said the California proposal is so recent that she couldn’t comment on it. She doesn’t think many of the association’s members do a lot of work in California.

However, California’s policies often have a ripple effect across the country as other states consider or implement California’s rules. The federal Clean Air Act prohibits states from setting their own emissions standards, but a provision in the act authorizes the EPA to grant California a waiver from that restriction. Other states can then go along with California’s regulations without EPA review.

Power the Future, an energy industry advocacy group, estimated in a recent report that about 40% of the U.S. population is in states that follow California’s lead in setting emissions.

How the semitruck proposal will play out, Foertsch couldn’t say until she’s had time to look at the regulation.

“When states implement those kinds of broad-based requirements, it has a far-reaching effect on industries,” she said. “So, it’s something we’re watching.”

Tesla Semi

If the rules go into law and spread across the nation, compliance will be expensive. Smaller trucking companies and independent owner/operators would have a tough time surviving them.

Electric semitrucks retail for about $180,000, which is two to three times the cost of a new diesel truck. There are some tax breaks that would bring that price down.

Tesla claims its electric semis will save $200,000 in fuel costs in their first three years of ownership. The trucks also require less maintenance, meaning drivers will spend less time and money servicing their trucks.

The Wall Street Journal reports most electric trucks have a range of about 100 to 200 miles.

Tesla advertises its semi as having a range of 500 miles with a 40-ton load, with an acceleration rate comparable to that of a diesel-powered truck. It can charge to 70% in 30 minutes with special charging stations. So far, these special charging stations are few and far between, especially across Wyoming.

Lots of Power

California state officials, according to the Wall Street Journal, estimate the state will need 157,000 semitruck chargers by 2030 to support their proposed rules for electric semis.

The average cost of a high-level passenger charging station is about $500,000 each. At that rate, the state will need $78.5 billion to cover the cost of the chargers. Since large rigs will need a lot more power, it’s likely the stations will cost more.

National Grid, a northeast U.S. utility company, performed a study that estimated a single Tesla Semi charging station would require the same amount of power as a small town.

If the past is any indicator, these numbers won’t deter California from proceeding ahead with the plans. Last summer, CARB voted to require all new cars sold in California to be emissions free by 2035. Days later, state officials asked residents not to charge their cars as a September heat wave was stressing the state’s electrical grid.
People keep saying they were told not to charge their EVs. Truth is they were asked to not charge from 4 pm to 9 pm if it was an option. Many EV owners charge overnight at home or during the day at work. eVs use about 2% of electricity in California.
 
The Freightliner Semi EV is around 400K. Found this information on possible costs. I wonder if California has taken into consideration Large Semi Tow Trucks or Ambulances that are based off of a Semi. Or any Diesel Ambulances. Even Semis with sleepers.

Information on real-world electric truck prices is notoriously difficult to come by. This is especially true for biggest and baddest of them all: the electric semi. While there have been several high-profile deliveries of electric semi-trucks in the past few years, their purchase price has largely been kept under wraps as the market scales up. The trouble is, the cost calculus for fleet owners hinges on exactly how much more it costs to buy an electric truck than a diesel truck—and how fuel and maintenance savings may make up the difference.

We can glean a few ballpark numbers from press releases. For example, the Port of Oakland recently acquired 10 Peterbilt 579EVs at a cost of $5.1 million. If this represents the true upfront purchase price—not including a maintenance contract, for example—it would translate to $510,000 per semi-truck. Another example: back in 2020, Lion Electric received a $20 million order for 50 8T electric trucks, working out to $400,000 per truck. Meanwhile, Tesla has been advertising a mind-bogglingly low price of $180,000 for their yet-to-be-delivered 500-mile electric semi.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: cleverscreenam

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
8,807
11,501
Boise, ID
California state officials, according to the Wall Street Journal, estimate the state will need 157,000 semitruck chargers by 2030 to support their proposed rules for electric semis.
I get pretty frustrated seeing such crazy aggressive timelines for things like this, when the supposed products to do it are basically still in development and not even out in the market yet. It's doing this terrible thing, where it is making the first impression to the public as a negative one. There could have been the chance for these products to become available and companies who see possible TCO savings to choose to try them and then see them be a success. But instead, it's being pushed really hard as not a choice, and without products or supply available yet, so it seems like this impending doom of an upcoming hardship, where companies will have to buy them, but can't because the manufacturers can't scale up fast enough or whatever.

They don't need to force it so hard and fast that it is viewed as a negative like this.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: KBF

MP3Mike

Well-Known Member
Feb 1, 2016
20,445
51,938
Oregon
I get pretty frustrated seeing such crazy aggressive timelines for things like this, when the supposed products to do it are basically still in development and not even out in the market yet. It's doing this terrible thing, where it is making the first impression to the public as a negative one. There could have been the chance for these products to become available and companies who see possible TCO savings to choose to try them and then see them be a success. But instead, it's being pushed really hard as not a choice, and without products or supply available yet, so it seems like this impending doom of an upcoming hardship, where companies will have to buy them, but can't because the manufacturers can't scale up fast enough or whatever.

They don't need to force it so hard and fast that it is viewed as a negative like this.
Well, there are products available, just not enough quantity of them yet. Though I expect quantity will ramp up fairly quickly in the next year or two.

I would assume they have taken ramp into account, and know that charging really should be installed before the trucks are sold. But 157k chargers installed in 3 years seems ridiculous, unless they are counting "normal" outlets/EVSEs that you can plug a truck into. (I assume they aren't expecting 157k CCS/MCS chargers to be installed in California in a 7 year timespan.)
 
  • Helpful
Reactions: KBF
Elon cares absolutely nothing about what California thinks or does. Why do you think he had the mega pack plant in Lathrup ? because Tracy is a good starting point to start putting mega packs in that will easily handle 100 semis charging at the same time ..this guy land's a rockets..this is like so easy to him its just installing mega packs .its not rocket science to do this
 
One Mega pack is around one million dollars. Enough Megapacks to charge 100 Semis at once would be close to 200 million dollars. In seven years California would have to spend over 1 billion dollars for electric Semi charging. California has already spent over 100 billion on a Train that still may be years away from operating.
 

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