Disappointing range on new Tesla 3

[docdeb27]

Maybe some time ago but I don't think that's the case over the last few years.
I came from 4-door Wrangler that I specifically built how I wanted it (just like the Tesla) and had delivered in 5.5 weeks. Unfortunately I totaled it 27 months later but in that time I had zero issues with it. Just like on these forums there are tons of complaints about reliability and major issues all over the numerous Jeep sites. Unfortunately for Jeep this is their reputation so people cling on to that notion without really knowing anything. Hopefully the Model 3 can continue it's good reputation and spread to the masses

It's not just their reputation . My son-in-law is a master mechanic and a Jeep was my 2nd choice but he told me he would refuse to work on it if I purchased it. they have so many problems.

 

[JBare]

It's not just their reputation . My son-in-law is a master mechanic and a Jeep was my 2nd choice but he told me he would refuse to work on it if I purchased it. they have so many problems.

Maybe I just got lucky . As an ametuer mechanic who did all the maintenance and never had an issue in the 40k miles I owned it.

Anyways there are trade offs with all vehicle options. The sound system in the Jeep did sound better than my model 3 but I have to imagine that's partially due to a sedan vs "suv" and also a bigger sub. My '15 JKU didn't have auto wipers so can't comment on that. The nice thing is that our Tesla's can get better over time vs having to buy a new model year.

 

[bd7349]

Voice Commands, Bad.

This is actually one thing I'll have to go against as the voice commands in my 3 work extremely well, like significantly better than I thought it would. Hell, it understands me better than Siri does on my iPhone. "Navigate to..." pulls up the correct address of whatever place I ask nearly every time.

Even when I went to visit a friend in VT and I needed directions to a local bar, saying the name incorrectly (locals like my friend call it by a nickname, not the official name of the bar) the way my friend does resulted in it STILL being able to pull up the correct location and address. Both my friend and I were very surprised that it worked. I'm curious what issues you have with it?

 

[mswlogo]

A Jeep? Really? One of the most unreliable cars ever produced.

Do you really want to go down that path?

You do know where Tesla currently stands in the reliability catagory, right?

 

[mswlogo]

Maybe I just got lucky . As an ametuer mechanic who did all the maintenance and never had an issue in the 40k miles I owned it.

Anyways there are trade offs with all vehicle options. The sound system in the Jeep did sound better than my model 3 but I have to imagine that's partially due to a sedan vs "suv" and also a bigger sub. My '15 JKU didn't have auto wipers so can't comment on that. The nice thing is that our Tesla's can get better over time vs having to buy a new model year.

I bought the life time warranty on 5 Jeep’s and after 600,000 miles I never got to use it once. I did as much as I dared on maintenance as well. There were definitely some years to avoid. But gosh, the things just wouldn’t die.

I plan to buy any extended warranty Tesla offers on the model 3 as well and hope to never use it as well.

I expect the auto wipers and auto high beams will get better. But they might need the new AP3 computers to pull it off. It’s gonna need 5% of the new CPU for auto wipers and 5% for auto high beam. Except it will need AP4 computers if you want Auto wipers and auto high beams both to work at the same time.

 

[dhanson865]

They are all at 43 psi which i think is correct for my winter tires.

43 PSI at what temperature?

Saying a PSI without mentioning the temperature doesn't make it clear that you know about how PSI varies with temperature. It's a very important concept to include any time you are checking or discussing tire pressure.

And to be clear it's the temperature of the tires that matter. When you drive they heat up very quickly and take hours of not moving to get back down to the ambient temp.

 

[docdeb27]

Outside temps range from 30-45 ish. Who on earth takes the temp off the tires???

 

[coleAK]

43 PSI at what temperature?

Saying a PSI without mentioning the temperature doesn't make it clear that you know about how PSI varies with temperature. It's a very important concept to include any time you are checking or discussing tire pressure.

And to be clear it's the temperature of the tires that matter. When you drive they heat up very quickly and take hours of not moving to get back down to the ambient temp.

It should be measured “cold” so after your car hasn’t been driven for a while. And “cold” is whatever the temp is in your area during that time of year when you measure the psi.

 

[coleAK]

I know this has been beaten to death but I think had they marketed it as a floating range. Like 200-300 miles. Much like ICEs have with city/highway. And I’ve seen double use days, where my daily in town drive is >500 Wh/mi. It happens when: below 0 (F), >4” Fresh snow on unplowed roads, defrosters, 4 passengers, 3 seat heaters on, heat on 70F auto.

 

[golfpilot]

When I got mine in the summer, I got 225 Watts per mile. Now, during the winter, I am averaging about 275 watts per mile. Ya’ll getting your cars in the winter are going to think you got a battery boost in the spring

 

[dfwatt]

Even running AC?

Yes. AC uses less energy than what is involved in pushing colder denser air out of the way at highway speeds. Of course, AC does reduce range and increase Watt hours per mile somewhat but your summer mileage is going to vastly exceed your winter mileage. In warm weather I have easily been able to get 220 Watt hours per mile around town sometimes even dropping below 200. One of the things people need to understand is that an electric motor has none of the inefficiencies that internal combustion engines have at low speeds indeed the only time and internal combustion engine is remotely efficient is when it is in a very tall gear working against a load. That's simply not true for an electric motor The slower the car is driving the lower its watt-hours per mile. So if you tool around town, use just regen, keep your speed down, it's easy to hit 160-175 mpge. People get fixated on the Range issue, and are upset and feel ripped off when the car can't reach 300 miles of range driving at 85 miles an hour in 20 degree Fahrenheit weather! But around town your range is greater than rated range in warm weather. Worst case scenario is high speed driving in cold weather. That can easily cut your range in half

 

[Knightshade]

This is actually one thing I'll have to go against as the voice commands in my 3 work extremely well, like significantly better than I thought it would. Hell, it understands me better than Siri does on my iPhone. "Navigate to..." pulls up the correct address of whatever place I ask nearly every time.

Even when I went to visit a friend in VT and I needed directions to a local bar, saying the name incorrectly (locals like my friend call it by a nickname, not the official name of the bar) the way my friend does resulted in it STILL being able to pull up the correct location and address. Both my friend and I were very surprised that it worked. I'm curious what issues you have with it?

FWIW I agree the very few commands that exist work very well.

The issue is how few commands there are.

especially with the lack of physical buttons there's a TON of functionality that could/should be voice command enabled and isn't (climate control for example)

 

[StealthP3D]

So if you tool around town, use just regen, keep your speed down, it's easy to hit 160-175 mpge. People get fixated on the Range issue, and are upset and feel ripped off when the car can't reach 300 miles of range driving at 85 miles an hour in 20 degree Fahrenheit weather! But around town your range is greater than rated range in warm weather.

I totally agree with this. EV's are super efficient for the kind of driving most people do, errands, visits, etc. I love how efficient and convenient our Model 3's are for short trips with a lot of dinking around. In cold weather, not so much but in the mild months, your economy doesn't plummet when cruising around a city, even if you get caught waiting for lights, stuck in traffic, etc. This is the same kind of usage that causes most gas cars to fall to 15 mpg.

 

[dfwatt]

I totally agree with this. EV's are super efficient for the kind of driving most people do, errands, visits, etc. I love how efficient and convenient our Model 3's are for short trips with a lot of dinking around. In cold weather, not so much but in the mild months, your economy doesn't plummet when cruising around a city, even if you get caught waiting for lights, stuck in traffic, etc. This is the same kind of usage that causes most gas cars to fall to 15 mpg.

Or less! And when you add the inefficiencies of the warm-up cycle in Winter, an ICE car with a big engine doing short trips around town can drop below 5 miles per gallon. About the only issue is range in Winter on the highway. Otherwise as far as I'm concerned it's all upside. And since we were among the last Model 3s to get the free unlimited supercharging, I'll put up with frequent stops on trips in exchange for the free gas, err .... juice!! My wife just traveled with our 85 lb dog, a boatload of stuff, and our niece and while it took her longer to get to Florida from New Hampshire her net cash outlay was just for food. Not a dime for fuel. Pretty good deal I think. Best car ever!

 

[coleAK]

Yes. AC uses less energy than what is involved in pushing colder denser air out of the way at highway speeds. Of course, AC does reduce range and increase Watt hours per mile somewhat but your summer mileage is going to vastly exceed your winter mileage. In warm weather I have easily been able to get 220 Watt hours per mile around town sometimes even dropping below 200. One of the things people need to understand is that an electric motor has none of the inefficiencies that internal combustion engines have at low speeds indeed the only time and internal combustion engine is remotely efficient is when it is in a very tall gear working against a load. That's simply not true for an electric motor The slower the car is driving the lower its watt-hours per mile. So if you tool around town, use just regen, keep your speed down, it's easy to hit 160-175 mpge. People get fixated on the Range issue, and are upset and feel ripped off when the car can't reach 300 miles of range driving at 85 miles an hour in 20 degree Fahrenheit weather! But around town your range is greater than rated range in warm weather. Worst case scenario is high speed driving in cold weather. That can easily cut your range in half

Odd. My daily commute to and from work is about 16 miles round trip. 35-45 mph, 4 traffic lights, urban streets (for Alaska), almost no traffic I drive conservative. And on that drive even in the summer I haven’t seen <300 Wh/mi in 5 years in 2 differant Tesla’s (S then 3). No AC, Years go by when I don’t use AC, 75F is an extreme heat wave up here. I’ve seen 220-230 Wh/mi running 65 on the highway but never anything close to that in town.

 

[dfwatt]

Odd. My daily commute to and from work is about 16 miles round trip. 35-45 mph, 4 traffic lights, urban streets (for Alaska), almost no traffic I drive conservative. And on that drive even in the summer I haven’t seen <300 Wh/mi in 5 years in 2 differant Tesla’s (S then 3). No AC, Years go by when I don’t use AC, 75F is an extreme heat wave up here. I’ve seen 220-230 Wh/mi running 65 on the highway but never anything close to that in town.

That certainly is very strange particularly your report that you get 220 watt hours on the highway, even if you're keeping your speed down. I'd love to see that number!. We don't even get close to that and only around town can we hit 220. The model S is another story because it uses a less efficient type of AC induction motor so the model 3 is going to get a lower watt hour per mile figure even the performance version. I'd be stunned if you could get 220 Watt hours per mile in the model S? Which model S do you have? And when you say you can hit 220 Watt hours per mile are you talking about steady-state consumption or your overall average for a trip? The former might be possible in a Model S and a model 3 but the latter I think is impossible on the highway

 

[StealthP3D]

Odd. My daily commute to and from work is about 16 miles round trip. 35-45 mph, 4 traffic lights, urban streets (for Alaska), almost no traffic I drive conservative. And on that drive even in the summer I haven’t seen <300 Wh/mi in 5 years in 2 differant Tesla’s (S then 3). No AC, Years go by when I don’t use AC, 75F is an extreme heat wave up here. I’ve seen 220-230 Wh/mi running 65 on the highway but never anything close to that in town.

That's not normal and doesn't make a lot of sense. I get fantastic numbers in urban driving.

 

[coleAK]

That certainly is very strange particularly your report that you get 220 watt hours on the highway, even if you're keeping your speed down. I'd love to see that number!. We don't even get close to that and only around town can we hit 220. The model S is another story because it uses a less efficient type of AC induction motor so the model 3 is going to get a lower watt hour per mile figure even the performance version. I'd be stunned if you could get 220 Watt hours per mile in the model S? Which model S do you have? And when you say you can hit 220 Watt hours per mile are you talking about steady-state consumption or your overall average for a trip? The former might be possible in a Model S and a model 3 but the latter I think is impossible on the highway

Again Almost never run the AC. We had a ‘13 S85, sold it to get the LR AWD 3. I said “I have seen 220-230”. It was once or twice going between Anchorage and Girdwood ~50 miles with a 40-60+ mph tail wind in the summer durring the 4 month RV parade called the Seward highway. My “lifetime average” with the S was ~330 wh/mi but my wife only drove it about half of the time durring the winter. We are sitting at 380 lifetime average on the 3 but I got it late September so the heat has been on pretty much non stop.

 

[adw0mack]

Pretty much or you measured tank to tank? When you’re working with small numbers like that it’s very easy to miss a 20% change in economy if you aren’t measuring full tanks on a regular basis.

This is different in an electric car, particularly when you’re new to driving one, because range is always front and center.

This line of explanation is not very useful. Even if an ICE does not do what it says a user can easily stop at 1 of a million gas stations that fill every corner of the blocks we drive down. We cannot do that for an EV. So comparing the two based on range is not overly useful.

 

[mtndrew1]

This line of explanation is not very useful. Even if an ICE does not do what it says a user can easily stop at 1 of a million gas stations that fill every corner of the blocks we drive down. We cannot do that for an EV. So comparing the two based on range is not overly useful.

The intent of the comparison was to demonstrate that efficiency loss in cold weather happens in all vehicles and that it’s likely there is nothing mechanically wrong with their new Model 3.

Furthermore the poster hadn’t made any mention of running out of charge or cutting it close or any lack of usability, only that they’re concerned something is broken or they’re using the car incorrectly due to the efficiency drop.

As these were the concerns I feel my post was in fact useful and the replies seem to corroborate that. Had the OP been coming up short on energy to do the tasks they bought the car for then, yes, speed with which they could replenish an energy source in any kind of car would have been a focal point. It’s not here.

There’s nothing wrong with their car and all cars lose efficiency in the winter (EVs somewhat more dramatically due to a lack of waste heat).