Do you feel safe? [ Calling all HW2 EAP pilots.]

[arnis]

TACC uses radar, not camera. Camera is mostly used for lane markings and traffic signs.
Camera (non-stereoscopic camera) can not measure depth therefore unable to keep the
following distance well.

Radar can detect all dense objects, stationary or not.

This new crash clearly states that AP1 software is still not fully matured. AP1 can not be
allowed to swerve off the lane but it should be allowed to brake heavily. If Tesla is still unsure
they should have, at least by now, in "unresolvable radar situations" force driver to take control
immediately 3-5 seconds before possible collision.

Also Tesla should suck data from Waze server about construction zones. And also any construction sign
must force autopilot to give over the steering to the driver.

I'm not satisfied how fast things are progressing. At least not for AP1 vehicles. AP1 crashes into stationary vehicles
that are partly on the lane. Radar can detect those vehicles, I'm 100% sure. There are multiple instances:
Watch the horrifying moment a Tesla car crashes into a parked lorry

Tech is moving fast. Look what SOME vehicles could detect in 2014:

Tesla is actually catching up and is not the leader in AEB part.

 

[3Victoria]

Radar detect stationary objects. However, there are a multitude of stopped objects in front of the car at all times: street signs, light poles, pot-holes, etc. If the car braked for each, it wouldn't go anywhere. The problem is that the radar beam originally *only* indicated relative speed to the car, not location. That is why a sign over the road is detected as yet another stationary item. This is why the cars use multiple sensors. In addition, Tesla is modifying the radar to give them a lidar-like point cloud (ie information where the items are in 3d), so it can distinguish items better.

 

[OBX John]

Is there any state in the US where you can take your attention off the road legally while on Autopilot? Any difference whatsoever in the laws for drivers with Autopilot on or off anywhere in the world?

 

[DJ 240V]

How do you know that autopilot (TACC) is using the radar instead of the camera in stop and go traffic?

GSP

Think you are right. As per other threads conducting experiments on this topic, TACC uses camera in addition to radar. Back to the original topic , why did TACC not detect the obstacle ? Surely Tesla must get logs and shed some light.

 

[GSP]

Think you are right. As per other threads conducting experiments on this topic, TACC uses camera in addition to radar. Back to the original topic , why did TACC not detect the obstacle ? Surely Tesla must get logs and shed some light.

TACC does not detect non-moving obstacles. It can detect a moving car in front of you, and keep tracing that car when it stops and restarts, but if the car is stopped before TTAC detects it and starts tracking it, then it is up to the driver to spot the stopped traffic and apply the brakes. Just like plain old cruise control. If TTAC is tracking the car in front of you, it will be silver colored on the dash display, instead of dark colored.

This is why TTAC did not stop for the concrete barrier that was placed in the middle of the lane.

Automatic Emergency Braking (AEB) might detect stopped objects in time to reduce the speed of the collision, or it might not. AEB is just a backup to the driver, sometimes it can help, but it is not to be relied on. Others upthread have noted that Tesla's AEB is not as good as other automakers. This may be true, but no one offers AEB that is guaranteed to detect obstacles.

GSP

 

[OBX John]

TACC does not detect non-moving obstacles. It can detect a moving car in front of you, and keep tracing that car when it stops and restarts, but if the car is stopped before TTAC detects it and starts tracking it, then it is up to the driver to spot the stopped traffic and apply the brakes. Just like plain old cruise control. If TTAC is tracking the car in front of you, it will be silver colored on the dash display, instead of dark colored.

This is why TTAC did not stop for the concrete barrier that was placed in the middle of the lane.

Automatic Emergency Braking (AEB) might detect stopped objects in time to reduce the speed of the collision, or it might not. AEB is just a backup to the driver, sometimes it can help, but it is not to be relied on. Others upthread have noted that Tesla's AEB is not as good as other automakers. This may be true, but no one offers AEB that is guaranteed to detect obstacles.

GSP

Strange - my car has no problem detecting previously stopped traffic and stopping while on TACC, even when it wasn't following it previously.

 

[NerdUno]

TACC does not detect non-moving obstacles. It can detect a moving car in front of you, and keep tracing that car when it stops and restarts, but if the car is stopped before TTAC detects it and starts tracking it, then it is up to the driver to spot the stopped traffic and apply the brakes.

Not sure you're correct about that with the latest releases of TACC and AP2 firmware. Our vehicle routinely stops for already stopped vehicles at traffic signals now. Of course, it will jam on the brakes for an overhead sign once in a while, too.

It would be enormously helpful and much safer if Tesla would document for its owners what works and what doesn't work.

 

[DJ 240V]

Strange - my car has no problem detecting previously stopped traffic and stopping while on TACC, even when it wasn't following it previously.

Same here.

@GSP are you talking about HW1? The HW2 with EAP ( which is the only combination I have known) has no problem detecting stopped cars. Works like a charm.

 

[GSP]

Same here.

@GSP are you talking about HW1? The HW2 with EAP ( which is the only combination I have known) has no problem detecting stopped cars. Works like a charm.

Yes, I am talking about HW1 and that is what my car has. However, I thought HW2 had not caught up with HW1 capabilities yet, much less added new skills like recognizing stopped cars.

I also think it would be enormously helpful if Tesla clearly explained to owners what their autopilot is capable of and what it is not. I am just doing my best to figure it out, with help from other owners here at TMC.

Drive carefully,

GSP

 

[essmd]

I'm amazed at all the comments I read about people using auto steer on city roads. IT ISN"T MEANT FOR THAT. Divided highways only and you'll have a happier life.

I disagree with that from the perspective that even on residential roads, the activation of AP adds an element of safety and reduced stress even at speed limits under 40 MPH, especially in residential and school zones area.

Having electronic sensor oversight is an added safety benefit, especially with auto-braking being activated.

Not only does it keep me from speeding on roads that suddenly drop the speed limit, but the use of AP in heavy traffic is such a stress reliever during stop & go traffic.

I use my AP as much as possible, and for that I believe I am a safer driver because of that.

 

[Jim Holder]

I disagree with that from the perspective that even on residential roads, the activation of AP adds an element of safety and reduced stress even at speed limits under 40 MPH, especially in residential and school zones area.

Having electronic sensor oversight is an added safety benefit, especially with auto-braking being activated.

Not only does it keep me from speeding on roads that suddenly drop the speed limit, but the use of AP in heavy traffic is such a stress reliever during stop & go traffic.

I use my AP as much as possible, and for that I believe I am a safer driver because of that.

I agree totally! Having great expereince with TACC and AS here in NY. Yes, sometimes it makes a wrong determination and tries to run into a curb or hug the right to closely for comfort, or take a turn too late, but on the whole it's an enjoyable driving experience. I ran some errands earlier and didn't have to press the Go pedal or breaks for most of the trip(!). I did have to keep alert and mindful of what AP was choosing to do (alert means hands on wheel, feet near pedals, eyes and attention ahead...).

It should only get better from here!

 

[DJ 240V]

Not only does it keep me from speeding on roads that suddenly drop the speed limit, but the use of AP in heavy traffic is such a stress reliever during stop & go traffic.

.

Are you talking about AP1? AP2 doesn't auto drop speed limit yet and more over its capped at 35mph for now.

 

[essmd]

Are you talking about AP1? AP2 doesn't auto drop speed limit yet and more over its capped at 35mph for now.

Yes, referring to AP1, which soon AP2 will have the equivalent functionality if not more so in time.
The comment I was responding to is posted below, and the same "intended for divided highway, not residential use..." was also implied for AP1.

I soon will be moving into a AP2, and will continue to use AP on all types of roads, again convinced that overall the vehicle is overall being driven more safely

Unfortunately, even AP1 does not auto reduce the set AP speed setting on highways as it does on restricted streets, which is something I wanted for when traveling on rural highways. Municipality income is generated by speed traps when you miss that first reduced speed limit sign. I would hope Tesla would add this feature even before self-driving is engaged...as I could use the extra pair of "eyes" to avoid future tickets.

Cosmacelf said: ↑
I'm amazed at all the comments I read about people using auto steer on city roads. IT ISN"T MEANT FOR THAT. Divided highways only and you'll have a happier life.