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AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
Plus, Model S fits much better in the Oberklasse Segment. It is as big (size, weight) as the other models in that class, and it costs as much.
You can't really compare it with a 5 series, E-class or A6.
I sincerely disagree. The MS does not provide anywhere near the interior comfort and luxury that usually standard in the oberklasse. It doesn't even provide interior comfort on par with BMW 5, Mercedes E or Audi A6 in my opinion but due to size it belongs there anyway. I would actually compare it more to a Volvo V70...
As for weight, that's entirely because it's electric which is also why it has the high pricetag. And that's why most of us (incl me) bought it. If the MS would be like it is but with an ICE, no way even if it cost half...
Note about interior: some like it, some don't, it all comes down to taste, but to say that it matches the other cars in the oberklasse is to stretch it just a bit too far...
dirkhh
Middle-aged Member
Good luck with this argument. I've tried for the past year to get people to see that while the Model S might compare to A8, S Class and 7 series in price, it does not in level of fit and finish and available options.
But people don't like this argument. It means to have to compare yourself to A6, E Class and 5 series. Which makes the numbers for what is "winning" so much more challenging...
But people don't like this argument. It means to have to compare yourself to A6, E Class and 5 series. Which makes the numbers for what is "winning" so much more challenging...
Well I am in the silent majority that completely agrees with this. That being said I am pretty sure that Elon agrees with this and intends to drastically improve the interior now that they have access to all suppliers.
I think it's comparing apples with oranges.
The Model S doesn't have the lux plush or some of the safety features of the S Class, 7 series or A8. But those cars don't have the tech features of the Model S (huge center screen, OTA updates, smartphone app, dual screen navigation, and many more).
dirkhh
Middle-aged Member
Early on many suppliers were worried about Tesla's ability to survive and to live up to contractual obligations. This problem should be mostly history.
They've reportedly found it much easier to get suppliers interested for the Model X.
RobStark
Well-Known Member
How well a car measures up in its class is irrelevant to what class/segment it is in.
Class/segment is determined by exterior dimensions,weight, interior volume, trunk/storage volume and price.
Before the current revamp the Jaguar XJ was a complete POS. Didn't mean it was not in in the Oberklasse.
As the German Government determined, the Model S belongs in the Oberklasse.
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
StapleGun
Member
Care to elaborate? I didn't find the actual text but I read the Google translation of this article. It seems that the law would give EV's cheaper parking in some places and reserve spots for public charging.
The draft law regulates where to ride or park with an ev, means just the usage of such.
To qualify you would need a new and special license plate, "hey look at this car, it's a foolish ev driver"
- Definition of privileging E - vehicles ,
- Marking on the license plate ,
- Parking and stopping regulations ,
- Use of bus lanes , (big cities would not allow this).
- Repeal of Access Forbidden .
Under the scope of the Act is comprised of pure battery electric vehicles ,
environmentally friendly rechargeable external hybrid vehicles and fuel cell vehicles .
To qualify you would need a new and special license plate, "hey look at this car, it's a foolish ev driver"
- Definition of privileging E - vehicles ,
- Marking on the license plate ,
- Parking and stopping regulations ,
- Use of bus lanes , (big cities would not allow this).
- Repeal of Access Forbidden .
Under the scope of the Act is comprised of pure battery electric vehicles ,
environmentally friendly rechargeable external hybrid vehicles and fuel cell vehicles .
maxwell
Member
Yesterday i went with two of my buddies to the TESLA Store Stuttgart in Germany for a test ride. Unfortunately not to buy one, but to let my friend experience the so called "TESLA smile" and the technology. The friendly and young staff there was very competent. It was a pleasure and we felt no buying pressure or other arrogant behaviour like in other big car manufacturers stiff or formal stores. I asked how many cars they sell at the moment. Luckily the In Store Product Specialist told us, that they received more than ten cars that day and will receive more than ten on monday. Very busy times right now, he told me. IMHO compared to the totally new registered 520 Model S in 2014 (from January to August) that's a quite high rate just for one Store in the middle of Daimler- and Porsche-City. Interestingly the test ride led us infront of the Porsche Development Centre where we demonstratively turned around. Nice test route choice guys!
View attachment 60130
Link to German car registration agency, if you want to follow the monthly numbers (English version is not that detailled):
Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt - 2014
August statistics (sorted after brands and its models):
http://www.kba.de/SharedDocs/Publikationen/DE/Statistik/Fahrzeuge/FZ/2014_monatlich/FZ10/fz10_2014_08_pdf.pdf?__blob=publicationFile&v=2
Newb also got his numbers from here.
View attachment 60130
Link to German car registration agency, if you want to follow the monthly numbers (English version is not that detailled):
Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt - 2014
August statistics (sorted after brands and its models):
http://www.kba.de/SharedDocs/Publikationen/DE/Statistik/Fahrzeuge/FZ/2014_monatlich/FZ10/fz10_2014_08_pdf.pdf?__blob=publicationFile&v=2
Newb also got his numbers from here.
Well question is, is it true, you dont tell customer "Nobody wants one", strange they suddenly sell almost the monthly number within a week at just one location, we will see in few weeks, would imply sales of over 200 units for germany, still far cry from "expected" 1000 a month in Spiegel interview year ago.
I was offered to choose from pool of more then 10 "loaners" some with less then 200 miles on them to be picked up, it was 06.09.2014 at Tesla Düsseldorf, not all cars were on-site though.
I was offered to choose from pool of more then 10 "loaners" some with less then 200 miles on them to be picked up, it was 06.09.2014 at Tesla Düsseldorf, not all cars were on-site though.
These last few days before the end of the quarter will undoubtedly be busy. They want to push as much of the inventory as they can out the door, to make the 3rd quarter numbers look good. After the end of quarter rush, the pipeline will be empty, so October will be very quiet, while they wait for new cars to make their way from the factory.
RobStark
Well-Known Member
Tesla,currently, does not have have the production to supply 1000/month to Germany even if the demand was there.
When Elon was in Germany to deliver the first Model S in Germany he said he hoped for 300-400 per month.
Even if it takes 2-3 years to get there it is fine as long as overall global demand exceeds production.
I attended boh town hall meetings with Elon in Munich, Oct 2013 and Jan 2014. I personally heard Elon talk about 200 to 300 cars a week, delivery within a fortnight. The auditorium reacted with a sharp inhalation. The general consensus seemed: impossible, but if someone tackles impossible things, it is Elon.
Asides from that, I agree that German market response doesn't move a comma in Tesla's sales numbers.
Asides from that, I agree that German market response doesn't move a comma in Tesla's sales numbers.
maxwell
Member
I have to add that my numbers (...receive more than ten cars on friday and monday) were a little conservative and not precise, i don't remember exactly, might be he talked about 15 and 17. But it sounded more like a peak situation, not that this would be daily business.
Also interesting news few days ago is that the Stuttgart regional politian Nicola Schelling earned criticism after she chose to have a Model as a business car. Other politicians found it insensitive to not choose a car from Stuttgart car makers. According to them she would have found comparable cars there. She could have chosen a Mercedes B class electric for example (ironically also Tesla tec inside i remember). But the great range convinced her to choose Model S. In the end, she chose to lease the Model S privately to avoid further discussions. Another good example where public people like her stand up for somthing they believe is simply the best solution that is available at the moment. And generate another free marketing for TESLA too
The German articles of the local Stuttgart news:
Dienstwagen nicht aus Stuttgart: Starke Frau der Region eckt mit US-Dienstauto an - Stuttgart - Stuttgarter Nachrichten
Dienstwagen: Regional-Chefin fährt Tesla statt Mercedes - Stuttgart - Stuttgarter Nachrichten
Also interesting news few days ago is that the Stuttgart regional politian Nicola Schelling earned criticism after she chose to have a Model as a business car. Other politicians found it insensitive to not choose a car from Stuttgart car makers. According to them she would have found comparable cars there. She could have chosen a Mercedes B class electric for example (ironically also Tesla tec inside i remember). But the great range convinced her to choose Model S. In the end, she chose to lease the Model S privately to avoid further discussions. Another good example where public people like her stand up for somthing they believe is simply the best solution that is available at the moment. And generate another free marketing for TESLA too
The German articles of the local Stuttgart news:
Dienstwagen nicht aus Stuttgart: Starke Frau der Region eckt mit US-Dienstauto an - Stuttgart - Stuttgarter Nachrichten
Dienstwagen: Regional-Chefin fährt Tesla statt Mercedes - Stuttgart - Stuttgarter Nachrichten
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