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Finding it hard to remain passionate about Tesla

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#41
SO16 said:
Not really. Back when customer service was superb, the ratio of cars to service centers was probably much better in your area. The number of service centers haven’t kept pace with the number of cars on the road. How many service centers would be needed to keep that same ratio in your area along with expanding everywhere else? That would take major investment. And way back when, how did they get that money to setup that service center? If they weren’t making a penny, they had to get the money from borrowing/capital raise I would think.

Anyway...it doesn’t matter. I think we can both agree that Tesla does need more service centers in some extremely busy markets and should bring back the direct phone option.
Click to expand...

We do actually agree on several points but just disagree on the "why" of said points.

We both agree 100% that they should have ramped up customer service resources to more closely match the growth curve of sales. They did not. Not even remotely close in fact. What we're not in agreement with is "why" they didn't and I think it's a difficult conclusion to arrive at to say that they just didn't expect they would need customer service for all of those new sales for such a forward thinking company that seemingly is 7 steps ahead of everyone else in much more complex issues.

This oversight or (most likely) decision was also during a time they were trying to increase profitability ahead of schedule in an effort to make Wall Street investors happy. I'm assigning blame where the data supports it rather than simply saying that they just didn't know or because they didn't have the profit to pay for it. Did you see their profit numbers when they had good customer service? What about the last couple of years when they've been profitable while customer service is rapidly deteriorating? You can't have that kind of profit margin as an upstart when your customer service support is a nightmare all over the country. It's not actually profit if you're robbing Peter (the customer) to pay Paul (investors).

We also both agree that they need more service centers, better staffing of existing service centers (maybe not in that particular order, either) and to answer the phones again. This lack of customer service feels a lot more like a victim of not caring about the problem rather than not being able to solve the issue. If they truly cared about the problem they'd start with simply taking phone calls again until they work the kinks out of their "future" service solution plans.
 
#42
Ostrichsak said:
We do actually agree on several points but just disagree on the "why" of said points.

We both agree 100% that they should have ramped up customer service resources to more closely match the growth curve of sales. They did not. Not even remotely close in fact. What we're not in agreement with is "why" they didn't and I think it's a difficult conclusion to arrive at to say that they just didn't expect they would need customer service for all of those new sales for such a forward thinking company that seemingly is 7 steps ahead of everyone else in much more complex issues.

This oversight or (most likely) decision was also during a time they were trying to increase profitability ahead of schedule in an effort to make Wall Street investors happy. I'm assigning blame where the data supports it rather than simply saying that they just didn't know or because they didn't have the profit to pay for it. Did you see their profit numbers when they had good customer service? What about the last couple of years when they've been profitable while customer service is rapidly deteriorating? You can't have that kind of profit margin as an upstart when your customer service support is a nightmare all over the country. It's not actually profit if you're robbing Peter (the customer) to pay Paul (investors).

We also both agree that they need more service centers, better staffing of existing service centers (maybe not in that particular order, either) and to answer the phones again. This lack of customer service feels a lot more like a victim of not caring about the problem rather than not being able to solve the issue. If they truly cared about the problem they'd start with simply taking phone calls again until they work the kinks out of their "future" service solution plans.
Click to expand...


I just would like to know truly how systemic poor service truly is. I have had great service but I also don't live in a huge Tesla market. Many others have had great service. Not having the direct phone could be an annoyance but so far for me, it’s been fine. And when I did have some questions, they did call me. That was a few months ago. Evidently YMMV.
 
#43
ucmndd said:
They're not necessarily contradictory. In fact I've said several times that I think inconsistency is perhaps Tesla's biggest problem right now, and this can easily be an example of that.

I'm more suggesting that there are lots of posts about perfectly good (exceptional even) service experiences on this forum. I've had such experiences recently, others have, and apparently you have as well - "magic" even. Given that, I think your first post about Tesla's rampant service failings being the downfall of the company and indeed the entire EV industry are a tad hyperbolic.

I think a majority of people are having perfectly fine (if mediocre) experiences with Tesla service right now. Forums amplify the problems and bury the success stories.
Click to expand...

A company that can't provide satisfactory service to it's paying customers will surely suffer a demise at it's own shortcomings without getting into the details of what that shortcoming exists. If enough people have a bad experience a company will collapse under it's own negativity. This isn't something that's unique to Tesla either. It's safe to say that, in most markets, Tesla isn't meeting expectations of what customers look for in support after the sale. Word-of-mouth was their biggest asset but that wave is going to crash and go back the other way turning it into their biggest liability if they don't course correct sooner. It may already be too late as the negative tarnish is difficult to remove from a brand once it's there.

Tesla is the leader in EV car production & technology. The entire world is basically looking towards them to usher in the EV revolution almost single-handedly against established companies who want nothing more than for Tesla to fail. Tesla was all too quick to take on this role and now they have to deliver. Anything short of their own stated goals will be seen as a failure. If Tesla fails at their mission do you think that there is enough momentum to still force the hand of other manufacturers who claim to be working on EV now? If they do fail, given how much great engineering they had and great timing and all of the other things that came into play to put Tesla where they are now.. It would be a loooong time before anyone else though to try that again.

I wouldn't call that hyperole at all. It may be a worst case scenario but it certainly isn't unimaginable.
 
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#45
I totally understand. When I bought my used S in November 2017 the service center bent over backwards to address all the issues I had before the warranty expired, even the nit-picky ones. I was blown away by their service, so much so that I was outraged when Honda didn’t immediately fix the sliding door issue on our in-warranty Odyssey. Then they released the M3, and they could no longer afford to provide the same stellar level of service as when they were exclusively selling $80k vehicles.
 
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#48
Muhammad said:
Hey guys

I guess this post will be a half rant, half counseling session.

A little backstory: I purchased my first Tesla back when Tesla only made one car. The "sales" staff made a huge point at the time not to sell cars, but to act more like museum curators, explaining the technology and showing people around which made for the best car purchase experience I had ever been a part of. And while the car had flaws Tesla service would always go out of their way to pick up and drop off your car to you, give you a loaner, and ensure the process was as customer friendly as possible. Elon Musk was a humble visionary at the time, and it was easy to root for the company amidst the immense misinformation and naivety surrounding electric cars.

Fast forward to today and Tesla to me stands for everything antithetical to what I mentioned above. Good luck getting in contact with service. Tesla will screw over customers as much and as often as they can get away with it and I feel people are passionate about the company because they haven't had to experience this themselves. My 2015 car, despite only being supercharged on longer trips has been horribly throttled. FSD has been over promised time and time again. Tesla's recent successes and outrageously loyal fanbase seems to only reinforce the idea that Tesla can keep screwing customers over and keep getting away with it. Their CEO is childish and yet seems to be 100% supported in every dumb thing he says or does.

The only strong positive are the cars. I guess I am secretly waiting for another company to come with an electric car with the range, UI, and charging infrastructure Tesla has at a comparable price. Maybe I'll be waiting a long time but until then I don't see myself upgrading to the latest and greatest Tesla as I had envisioned. I would never believe I would be saying this 3 years ago when I was a strong advocate for the company and willing to wait in line for the model 3 (only to pay a higher price and have horrible quality control issues and UI bugs for a year). At this point, I wish the company would change its culture but I am not holding my breath. Until then, I am no longer passionate about the brand and have more disdain than admiration.

I miss the Tesla of past...
Click to expand...

I actually bought the stock in the early days because I thought it was a better investment than the car then I bought the car later on. I'm the proud owner of signature VIN number 162 but sadly I couldn't agree with you more It isn't the experience that it once was and my car also went through the throttling that you're talking about and is not anywhere near as capable as it was when I bought it but that said there still isn't a better alternative out there in terms of infrastructure range UI etc so here I sit waiting for something to happen either from Tesla or perhaps some other manufacturer.
 
#49
Muhammad said:
Hey guys

I guess this post will be a half rant, half counseling session.

A little backstory: I purchased my first Tesla back when Tesla only made one car. The "sales" staff made a huge point at the time not to sell cars, but to act more like museum curators, explaining the technology and showing people around which made for the best car purchase experience I had ever been a part of. And while the car had flaws Tesla service would always go out of their way to pick up and drop off your car to you, give you a loaner, and ensure the process was as customer friendly as possible. Elon Musk was a humble visionary at the time, and it was easy to root for the company amidst the immense misinformation and naivety surrounding electric cars.

Fast forward to today and Tesla to me stands for everything antithetical to what I mentioned above. Good luck getting in contact with service. Tesla will screw over customers as much and as often as they can get away with it and I feel people are passionate about the company because they haven't had to experience this themselves. My 2015 car, despite only being supercharged on longer trips has been horribly throttled. FSD has been over promised time and time again. Tesla's recent successes and outrageously loyal fanbase seems to only reinforce the idea that Tesla can keep screwing customers over and keep getting away with it. Their CEO is childish and yet seems to be 100% supported in every dumb thing he says or does.

The only strong positive are the cars. I guess I am secretly waiting for another company to come with an electric car with the range, UI, and charging infrastructure Tesla has at a comparable price. Maybe I'll be waiting a long time but until then I don't see myself upgrading to the latest and greatest Tesla as I had envisioned. I would never believe I would be saying this 3 years ago when I was a strong advocate for the company and willing to wait in line for the model 3 (only to pay a higher price and have horrible quality control issues and UI bugs for a year). At this point, I wish the company would change its culture but I am not holding my breath. Until then, I am no longer passionate about the brand and have more disdain than admiration.

I miss the Tesla of past...
Click to expand...

Hi Muhammad,
I agree. Tesla Sales and Service communication is the worst (though the actual service is pretty good). And I also understand diminished enthusiasm for Tesla, the company. But as a fellow owner of 2015 MS, FSD was never an option for us (so how does that harm you?), and I supercharge (for free of course) all the time: What do you mean you’ve been “horribly throttled?”
 
#50
Muhammad said:
Hey guys

I guess this post will be a half rant, half counseling session.

A little backstory: I purchased my first Tesla back when Tesla only made one car. The "sales" staff made a huge point at the time not to sell cars, but to act more like museum curators, explaining the technology and showing people around which made for the best car purchase experience I had ever been a part of. And while the car had flaws Tesla service would always go out of their way to pick up and drop off your car to you, give you a loaner, and ensure the process was as customer friendly as possible. Elon Musk was a humble visionary at the time, and it was easy to root for the company amidst the immense misinformation and naivety surrounding electric cars.

Fast forward to today and Tesla to me stands for everything antithetical to what I mentioned above. Good luck getting in contact with service. Tesla will screw over customers as much and as often as they can get away with it and I feel people are passionate about the company because they haven't had to experience this themselves. My 2015 car, despite only being supercharged on longer trips has been horribly throttled. FSD has been over promised time and time again. Tesla's recent successes and outrageously loyal fanbase seems to only reinforce the idea that Tesla can keep screwing customers over and keep getting away with it. Their CEO is childish and yet seems to be 100% supported in every dumb thing he says or does.

The only strong positive are the cars. I guess I am secretly waiting for another company to come with an electric car with the range, UI, and charging infrastructure Tesla has at a comparable price. Maybe I'll be waiting a long time but until then I don't see myself upgrading to the latest and greatest Tesla as I had envisioned. I would never believe I would be saying this 3 years ago when I was a strong advocate for the company and willing to wait in line for the model 3 (only to pay a higher price and have horrible quality control issues and UI bugs for a year). At this point, I wish the company would change its culture but I am not holding my breath. Until then, I am no longer passionate about the brand and have more disdain than admiration.

I miss the Tesla of past...
Click to expand...
My 2015 85D works fine. Service is great. Maybe more here than the manufacturer.
 
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#51
My 2018 X100D works way better than “fine”. It is far and away the best car we have ever experienced. We have been in for service. And once, we got a flat tire. Our service experience was not the same as the old ICE dealer model. However, it was excellent! The interface is more efficient, but changed. There is an awful lot of unwarranted whining going on in this thread.
 
#53
I love the vehicles but there is something seriously wrong with the culture at Tesla. When I bought my Model S in 2018, I had multiple people in delivery and registration lie to me multiple times. It was a nightmare experience and their attitude was like "Take it or leave it."

Many of these vehicles are $100k+ and if you compare the service to other luxury carmakers or even Toyota, you won't find the same level of service. I think they used to wash your car when you brought it in for service, but that went away a while ago. I don't think they ever vacuumed your vehicle, something that I know Lexus does. Also, the idiotic situation with loaner cars being replaced by Uber vouchers...ridiculous. When you charge this much for a car, and $195/hr for service, the quality of the experience needs to be much better.
 
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#54
I got my Roadster in 2013. At that time, they required you leave the car with the service for 2 weeks so they could go through it and replace things that were marginal. When they finally delivered the car, my wheels were gone and replaced with a different model wheel. The store did some research and told me that they had "accidentally" been placed on the Roadster of an employee. I am not making this up. They tried to get me to keep the wheels because they were suppposedly an upgrade and cost $5000 (and were also very ugly). No one was willing to help me get mine back so I had to arrange to have the employee come down to San Diego myself so I could get my wheels back. I spent the next year calling Tesla service trying to get someone to do something about the stolen wheels. Mostly no one called me back. I was offered a hat and a t-shirt. The only way I got anything done was to write directly to Musk. All this time, the company was protecting their employee and saying it was unintentional (if my $5000 wheels were missing from my car after it was in the service, I would be calling them, wouldn't you?). And, apparently, they never did anything in the 2 weeks they had the car because I needed new brakes and tires less than one year after I bought the car. I love my Roadster but the service is terrible and it was terrible in 2013 too (although back then, they at least had cookies in the waiting area :) ) They have kept my car for weeks with no update while waiting for the special Roadster mechanic to come to the service (you would think they would only make the appointment when the special mechanic was coming... but no....). When my struts went out, they kept the car while waiting for the parts from Norway until I asked if I could bring my car home until the parts came in (it took 2 months). Thank goodness I don't have to go to the service very often, because it is never a happy experience. My friend who bought a Model S said if he had known the service was so bad, he would never have bought the car. You aren't going to increase sales that way! But I love my car so I put up with it and try to be proactive in my dealings with the service. And maybe that is what a lot of people do.
 
#55
Car is amazing, but service has much to be desired. It is horribly difficult to speak with service if there is an issue. My most recent attempt with service was done through the app as they request. Tesla service ended up text messaging me a few days later so we could further discuss. I responded multiple times and they never responded once over a one week period. I then got an email to approve an invoice... They never answered multiple questions I had.
 
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#56
I'm with you Muhammad. I bought a 2017 MS when I retired in 2017. I said it would be our forever car. We don't drive a lot (less than 20k miles now) and in fact both my wife and I used to travel a lot by air prior to Covid. Anyway, I thought I was in a dream the first year after my purchase. I'd contact service via the app; and got immediate responses, would call the service center; same thing. Now I just get phone ringing off the hook and if I bring up an issue via the app, the response is usually them trying to figure out a way not to address than to put my mind at ease. Haven't received any updates at all in at least 3 months and I have no idea how long it would take if I needed a supercharger. I have free supercharging for as long as I own the car but only heard about people being throttled when they use the SC. Who wants be traveling and have to wait an hour or better to charge the car.
Musk has take a great car and poisoned the mind of the owners for his own greed. Capitalism I guess. SMH!
 
#57
Muhammad said:
Hey guys

I guess this post will be a half rant, half counseling session.

A little backstory: I purchased my first Tesla back when Tesla only made one car. The "sales" staff made a huge point at the time not to sell cars, but to act more like museum curators, explaining the technology and showing people around which made for the best car purchase experience I had ever been a part of. And while the car had flaws Tesla service would always go out of their way to pick up and drop off your car to you, give you a loaner, and ensure the process was as customer friendly as possible. Elon Musk was a humble visionary at the time, and it was easy to root for the company amidst the immense misinformation and naivety surrounding electric cars.

Fast forward to today and Tesla to me stands for everything antithetical to what I mentioned above. Good luck getting in contact with service. Tesla will screw over customers as much and as often as they can get away with it and I feel people are passionate about the company because they haven't had to experience this themselves. My 2015 car, despite only being supercharged on longer trips has been horribly throttled. FSD has been over promised time and time again. Tesla's recent successes and outrageously loyal fanbase seems to only reinforce the idea that Tesla can keep screwing customers over and keep getting away with it. Their CEO is childish and yet seems to be 100% supported in every dumb thing he says or does.

The only strong positive are the cars. I guess I am secretly waiting for another company to come with an electric car with the range, UI, and charging infrastructure Tesla has at a comparable price. Maybe I'll be waiting a long time but until then I don't see myself upgrading to the latest and greatest Tesla as I had envisioned. I would never believe I would be saying this 3 years ago when I was a strong advocate for the company and willing to wait in line for the model 3 (only to pay a higher price and have horrible quality control issues and UI bugs for a year). At this point, I wish the company would change its culture but I am not holding my breath. Until then, I am no longer passionate about the brand and have more disdain than admiration.

I miss the Tesla of past...
Click to expand...
 
#58
Muhammad said:
Hey guys

I guess this post will be a half rant, half counseling session.

A little backstory: I purchased my first Tesla back when Tesla only made one car. The "sales" staff made a huge point at the time not to sell cars, but to act more like museum curators, explaining the technology and showing people around which made for the best car purchase experience I had ever been a part of. And while the car had flaws Tesla service would always go out of their way to pick up and drop off your car to you, give you a loaner, and ensure the process was as customer friendly as possible. Elon Musk was a humble visionary at the time, and it was easy to root for the company amidst the immense misinformation and naivety surrounding electric cars.

Fast forward to today and Tesla to me stands for everything antithetical to what I mentioned above. Good luck getting in contact with service. Tesla will screw over customers as much and as often as they can get away with it and I feel people are passionate about the company because they haven't had to experience this themselves. My 2015 car, despite only being supercharged on longer trips has been horribly throttled. FSD has been over promised time and time again. Tesla's recent successes and outrageously loyal fanbase seems to only reinforce the idea that Tesla can keep screwing customers over and keep getting away with it. Their CEO is childish and yet seems to be 100% supported in every dumb thing he says or does.

The only strong positive are the cars. I guess I am secretly waiting for another company to come with an electric car with the range, UI, and charging infrastructure Tesla has at a comparable price. Maybe I'll be waiting a long time but until then I don't see myself upgrading to the latest and greatest Tesla as I had envisioned. I would never believe I would be saying this 3 years ago when I was a strong advocate for the company and willing to wait in line for the model 3 (only to pay a higher price and have horrible quality control issues and UI bugs for a year). At this point, I wish the company would change its culture but I am not holding my breath. Until then, I am no longer passionate about the brand and have more disdain than admiration.

I miss the Tesla of past...
Click to expand...
 
#59
Muhammad,
I strongly agree with your assessment!
Tesla is trying to screw me over on my 2019 Tesla Model 3, they are lowballing me on the trade in value and offering me 19000 on a basically brand new car and that's on a confirmed order for a Model Y.
I will give Lucid Air a try, they have a great product and probably the type of care and customer service that Tesla had in their early days.

In the End, its about passion, innovation and making an attempt to save the planet, not profits and growth.
 
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