For AWD owners wanting a P3D-

[Urbancowboy]

Well, the chances are slim to almost none. The chance is so slim there is no point in spending even a minute hoping - just buy the model you want from the get-go (or trade-in/sell your AWD for a Performance).

If you have data to support your position let’s see it. If all you have is opinions I’ll go with mine.

 

[Knightshade]

What data we DO have suggests it's as simple as flipping a switch to upgrade a 2018 (and some early months 2019) AWD cars to P3D- as the drive units (which include the motor AND inverter) are identical.

What's unknown is if the newer AWD models from this year with 990 drive units can be upgraded that way or not.

 

[ConcordeSST]

Well, the chances are slim to almost none. The chance is so slim there is no point in spending even a minute hoping - just buy the model you want from the get-go (or trade-in/sell your AWD for a Performance).

When I bought my AWD, it was an $11K price increase just to get to the level of the "Stealth P3D". Another $5K to get the performance package. Speaking only to my personal situation, it was fiscally irresponsible to spend $11K on just the faster motor. It would be even more irresponsible for me to sell a car less than a year after buying it and eat all that depreciation just to get a slightly faster vehicle. If I could have gotten one for the $2K price differential some were lucky enough to get recently, I would have done it in a heartbeat. Surely you realize that not everyone has the same financial situation you do?

 

[StealthP3D]

What data we DO have suggests it's as simple as flipping a switch to upgrade a 2018 (and some early months 2019) AWD cars to P3D- as the drive units (which include the motor AND inverter) are identical.

What's unknown is if the newer AWD models from this year with 990 drive units can be upgraded that way or not.

Not this again.

The available evidence tells us that the inverters/motors in Performance models must test to a certain threshold before being eligible for Performance levels of current. This is not a trivial thing.

While it's true that the earliest production Performance models had drive units with the same part numbers stamped on them, Tesla has now rectified that by giving them different part numbers. This is likely because the first Performance models were in response to the financial crunch experienced due to the slow ramp (production hell) and they took shortcuts to get the earliest Performance models to market. Not the kind of shortcuts that compromise product quality (they said they were testing and binning the drive units and only allowing the best ones to handle Performance levels of current). Just a shortcut to get the new model to market more quickly. This brought them a quick inflow of cash when they really needed it and allowed them the luxury of meeting "delivery hell" with a crop of cars that could be either AWD or Performance depending upon instantaneous market demand. They could flash any AWD car that tested high enough into a Performance model. But not every AWD was eligible.

Some people voiced opposition that they were binning at all because (so their reasoning went) every other manufacturer would give the higher binned drive units a different part number. Well people, fast forward a few months and that's exactly what they have done. Of course it removes a little flexibility they previously had in terms of being able to flash an AWD into Performance based on immediate market demand but it makes future service and replacement more straightforward.

I'm a little surprised that now that we have proof that Tesla is putting different drive units in Performance models that anyone believes the drive units were ever completely interchangeable in the first place. There is a reason why Tesla has never flashed a single AWD to Performance after the owner accepted delivery of an AWD model. Because not all AWD models are eligible to be flashed to Performance. And they can't just offer to flash the AWD's owned by those who were lucky enough to get an AWD that tested out to Performance standards. It has to do with how much heat the silicon carbide inverters create at high power levels. Some are inherently more efficient than others. This is the primary reason I bought a Performance model over an AWD (for the slightly higher efficiency). And the fact that the extra bit of money was fairly trivial to me. To be clear, they have the same EPA rating but it does vary from car to car depending upon inverter efficiency. If I bought an AWD model, I may have lucked out and got a Performance capable AWD with it's slightly higher inverter efficiency but I may have got one that tested at the bottom of the bunch. Now they actually mark the units with different part numbers. I suspect the change to different part numbers might also coincide with the manufacturer of the silicon carbide chips pre-binning them for Tesla. Tesla would still have to test each assembled unit but by matching the higher-performing SiC chips together, they can create Performance drive units in which almost 100% of them test adequately for performance levels of current.

I can't make this post too long but to fully understand what I'm saying here, you need to understand the performance characteristics of the power electronics and how it varies from chip to chip depending upon which part of the silicon ingot the chip was cut from (and other less tangible things). This is still a bit of a black art as there is quite a bit of variability in performance even using state of the art manufacturing techniques.

 

[StealthP3D]

If I could have gotten one for the $2K price differential some were lucky enough to get recently, I would have done it in a heartbeat. Surely you realize that not everyone has the same financial situation you do?

Of course, I realize everyone's financial situation is somewhat different. My premise is that Tesla would not upgrade AWD to Performance for less than the cost difference if you bought the Model you really wanted in the first place.

Those hoping for a cheap upgrade to Performance are being even more unrealistic than those who just want to upgrade for the original cost differential. It's not going to happen at any price, not even for the early AWD purchasers who may have a car capable of Performance levels of current for the very simple reason that Tesla can't do it for ALL AWD owners that might request it.

To add clarity to that last statement, I'm not saying Tesla COULDN'T load performance software into all AWD cars, they certainly could. But it would be problematic because they know a certain percentage of them would burn out the inverters. And Tesla as a car company is not much of a car company if they start burning up their power electronics at a higher rate. Their goal is zero failures.

 

[Knightshade]

Not this again.

What, sourced facts?

The available evidence tells us that the inverters/motors in Performance models must test to a certain threshold before being eligible for Performance levels of current. This is not a trivial thing.

It's also not an actual thing in evidence.

What we DO have in evidence is this:

Literally every single Model 3 made in 2018 had exactly the same rear drive unit by part number.

Which means they got exactly the same motor and same inverter.


Other than a single off-hand comment in a tweet made before the first P was ever sold, we have no evidence of any kind there's actually any testing of the sort you describe done in production, ever.

Which suggests in any testing that did happen pre-production found out all 980 DUs met whatever threshold is needed for a P... (because as covered exhaustively, it'd be insanely dumb to do binning of DUs and then not use different PNs to reflect the results.

While it's true that the earliest production Performance models had drive units with the same part numbers stamped on them, Tesla has now rectified that by giving them different part numbers.

Nope...that's not true at all.

Again- every single rear DU ever in 2018 had the same PN.

And for every single rear DU ever for ever RWD Model 3 still does have that same PN as the P cars. SR, MR, LR, doesn't matter.

In fact the only cars we have any evidence ever got any different DU are LR AWD cars, and only fairly recently

There's pics of LR AWDs in the US as late as April 2019 still getting 980 DUs.

This is likely because the first Performance models were in response to the financial crunch experienced due to the slow ramp (production hell) and they took shortcuts to get the earliest Performance models to market.

Utterly wrong.

P cars today are still getting the same PN DU they got at launch

The same one the LR RWD got months before that in fact.

Again, only LR AWD ever got a different rear DU, and only fairly recently.

I'm a little surprised that now that we have proof that Tesla is putting different drive units in Performance models

Except, again, that's simply wrong.

Ps are still get the 980 unit just like every single type of Model 3 ever made in 2017 or 2018 got... (and all RWD ones still get last I knew- P or not- and even AWDs in 2019 got through at least April)


You might want to go do some more research before talking further on this topic given your fundamental facts are incorrect.[/QUOTE]

 

[jebinc]

What, sourced facts?




It's also not an actual thing in evidence.

What we DO have in evidence is this:

Literally every single Model 3 made in 2018 had exactly the same rear drive unit by part number.

Which means they got exactly the same motor and same inverter.


Other than a single off-hand comment in a tweet made before the first P was ever sold, we have no evidence of any kind there's actually any testing of the sort you describe done in production, ever.

Which suggests in any testing that did happen pre-production found out all 980 DUs met whatever threshold is needed for a P... (because as covered exhaustively, it'd be insanely dumb to do binning of DUs and then not use different PNs to reflect the results.






Nope...that's not true at all.

Again- every single rear DU ever in 2018 had the same PN.

And for every single rear DU ever for ever RWD Model 3 still does have that same PN as the P cars. SR, MR, LR, doesn't matter.

In fact the only cars we have any evidence ever got any different DU are LR AWD cars, and only fairly recently

There's pics of LR AWDs in the US as late as April 2019 still getting 980 DUs.




Utterly wrong.

P cars today are still getting the same PN DU they got at launch

The same one the LR RWD got months before that in fact.

Again, only LR AWD ever got a different rear DU, and only fairly recently.




Except, again, that's simply wrong.

Ps are still get the 980 unit just like every single type of Model 3 ever made in 2017 or 2018 got... (and all RWD ones still get last I knew- P or not- and even AWDs in 2019 got through at least April)


You might want to go do some more research before talking further on this topic given your fundamental facts are incorrect.

[/QUOTE]

Just click "Ignore," and you will save yourself a lot of time and frustration down the road. TMC provided us all the "Ignore" function for a reason. Don't be bashful, use it (for your own sanity)!

 

[voip-ninja]

Not this again.

The available evidence tells us that the inverters/motors in Performance models must test to a certain threshold before being eligible for Performance levels of current. This is not a trivial thing.

While it's true that the earliest production Performance models had drive units with the same part numbers stamped on them, Tesla has now rectified that by giving them different part numbers. This is likely because the first Performance models were in response to the financial crunch experienced due to the slow ramp (production hell) and they took shortcuts to get the earliest Performance models to market. Not the kind of shortcuts that compromise product quality (they said they were testing and binning the drive units and only allowing the best ones to handle Performance levels of current). Just a shortcut to get the new model to market more quickly. This brought them a quick inflow of cash when they really needed it and allowed them the luxury of meeting "delivery hell" with a crop of cars that could be either AWD or Performance depending upon instantaneous market demand. They could flash any AWD car that tested high enough into a Performance model. But not every AWD was eligible.

Some people voiced opposition that they were binning at all because (so their reasoning went) every other manufacturer would give the higher binned drive units a different part number. Well people, fast forward a few months and that's exactly what they have done. Of course it removes a little flexibility they previously had in terms of being able to flash an AWD into Performance based on immediate market demand but it makes future service and replacement more straightforward.

I'm a little surprised that now that we have proof that Tesla is putting different drive units in Performance models that anyone believes the drive units were ever completely interchangeable in the first place. There is a reason why Tesla has never flashed a single AWD to Performance after the owner accepted delivery of an AWD model. Because not all AWD models are eligible to be flashed to Performance. And they can't just offer to flash the AWD's owned by those who were lucky enough to get an AWD that tested out to Performance standards. It has to do with how much heat the silicon carbide inverters create at high power levels. Some are inherently more efficient than others. This is the primary reason I bought a Performance model over an AWD (for the slightly higher efficiency). And the fact that the extra bit of money was fairly trivial to me. To be clear, they have the same EPA rating but it does vary from car to car depending upon inverter efficiency. If I bought an AWD model, I may have lucked out and got a Performance capable AWD with it's slightly higher inverter efficiency but I may have got one that tested at the bottom of the bunch. Now they actually mark the units with different part numbers. I suspect the change to different part numbers might also coincide with the manufacturer of the silicon carbide chips pre-binning them for Tesla. Tesla would still have to test each assembled unit but by matching the higher-performing SiC chips together, they can create Performance drive units in which almost 100% of them test adequately for performance levels of current.

I can't make this post too long but to fully understand what I'm saying here, you need to understand the performance characteristics of the power electronics and how it varies from chip to chip depending upon which part of the silicon ingot the chip was cut from (and other less tangible things). This is still a bit of a black art as there is quite a bit of variability in performance even using state of the art manufacturing techniques.

We had multiple reports of owners who got a DM car and then AFTER DELIVERY had the car flashed to P3D if that's what they had paid for.

It's rather surprising you are insisting on the opposite considering how active you have been in these forums.

I don't recall a single case though of someone who paid for P3D-, got a 3DM and then was told they couldn't get the software "fix" to take it up to P3D- if that's what they had paid for.

Performance shows up as AWD | Tesla

dan1eld | September 30, 2018
Had the same experience... My DA went in the back when I asked about the 'red underline' and came back assuring me that I got a Performance model. He tried to tell me that red underline only came with the cosmetic package.

I tried every route of escalation after delivery. Nothing got a response or worked. Finally I got through to a service advisor who didn't believe my story until I told him that my acceleration modes where "Chill & Standard" not "Chill & Sport". That finally got him to dig in...

About 30 min later after he spoke to "engineering", my app and car had the red underline. Performance was night & day from the AWD version they delivered to me. I actually appreciate the P more now that I've experienced the jump in acceleration from before to after the SW upgrade.

Now, it's complete speculation on the reasons for the part change but I will assume that at this point in time drive units are being sorted/binned or manufactured for their specific application.

For the cars being rolled out last year that were being flashed up to P3D- we simply don't know what, if any, differences existed and I find your posts that make a lot of assumptions rather disingenuous.

 

[StealthP3D]

What, sourced facts?




It's also not an actual thing in evidence.

What we DO have in evidence is this:

Literally every single Model 3 made in 2018 had exactly the same rear drive unit by part number.

Which means they got exactly the same motor and same inverter.


Other than a single off-hand comment in a tweet made before the first P was ever sold, we have no evidence of any kind there's actually any testing of the sort you describe done in production, ever.

Which suggests in any testing that did happen pre-production found out all 980 DUs met whatever threshold is needed for a P... (because as covered exhaustively, it'd be insanely dumb to do binning of DUs and then not use different PNs to reflect the results.






Nope...that's not true at all.

Again- every single rear DU ever in 2018 had the same PN.

And for every single rear DU ever for ever RWD Model 3 still does have that same PN as the P cars. SR, MR, LR, doesn't matter.

In fact the only cars we have any evidence ever got any different DU are LR AWD cars, and only fairly recently

There's pics of LR AWDs in the US as late as April 2019 still getting 980 DUs.




Utterly wrong.

P cars today are still getting the same PN DU they got at launch

The same one the LR RWD got months before that in fact.

Again, only LR AWD ever got a different rear DU, and only fairly recently.




Except, again, that's simply wrong.

Ps are still get the 980 unit just like every single type of Model 3 ever made in 2017 or 2018 got... (and all RWD ones still get last I knew- P or not- and even AWDs in 2019 got through at least April)


You might want to go do some more research before talking further on this topic given your fundamental facts are incorrect.

Your argument consists of the fact that the early AWD drive unit had the same part number as the Performance drive units. I recognize that same fact everytime I explain the situation but you keep repeating it over and over like a broken record. If that's the crux of your argument, and it is, then you have no argument and I'll leave you alone to ponder how the world can be so messed up.

BTW, nothing I said was inaccurate, my fundamental facts are all correct and you have not shown otherwise. When I said Tesla has now given the Performance drive units a different part number, I meant they have given the AWD and Performance models different part numbers that are different from each other, not that they changed the part number on the Performance units. But I can see how you thought that. It doesn't change my point which is that the AWD/P drive units are now differentiated by part number while previously they had the same part number.

 

[StealthP3D]

We had multiple reports of owners who got a DM car and then AFTER DELIVERY had the car flashed to P3D if that's what they had paid for.

It's rather surprising you are insisting on the opposite considering how active you have been in these forums.

I don't recall a single case though of someone who paid for P3D-, got a 3DM and then was told they couldn't get the software "fix" to take it up to P3D- if that's what they had paid for.

My car was flashed from AWD to Performance while I waited at the delivery center. They tried to deliver it with AWD software. So I am well aware of this and these examples do not conflict with anything I've said. Obviously, when matching a Performance buyer to a VIN #, they can only match them to an AWD if that VIN # is tagged with and identifier signaling it's eligible to be upgraded to Performance.

Of course, once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story. It's no longer eligible. Tesla can't allow some AWD owners to upgrade while telling other AWD owners their particular VIN # is not eligible.

I'm surprised people are still using this as a reason why ALL AWD's should be able to be upgraded. The world is not black and white, there are many shades of grey. I can't help people who can't see them all.

 

[Knightshade]

Your argument consists of the fact that the early AWD drive unit had the same part number as the Performance drive units. I recognize that same fact everytime I explain the situation but you keep repeating it over and over like a broken record. If that's the crux of your argument, and it is, then you have no argument and I'll leave you alone to ponder how the world can be so messed up.

Presenting specific facts disproving your statements is "no argument"?

I'm not sure you're clear on what an argument is

BTW, nothing I said was inaccurate, my fundamental facts are all correct and you have not shown otherwise.

Yes, I have. Right in my last post.

I cited specific claims you made which are factually untrue, and cited how we know they're untrue.

Not sure how you missed them.

Your claim the P is now getting a different DU than previous for example is flat out false.

ALL model 3s continue to get the same 980 DU they've gotten since launch.

Only the AWD non P has ever been seen with a different DU than that, and only recently.

Which ones When I said Tesla has now given the Performance drive units a different part number, I meant they have given the AWD and Performance models different part numbers that are different from each other, not that they changed the part number on the Performance units. But I can see how you thought that.[/QUOTE}

I mean, mainly because that's literally what you said is how I thought that.

Point being the RWD non-P cars still get the same rear DU as the Ps do- so the Ps again aren't somehow special.

It doesn't change my point which is that the AWD/P drive units are now differentiated by part number while previously they had the same part number.

Uh-- that was my actual point.

The one that in your first paragraph you claim is somehow not worth mentioning.


Hence why all the AWD owners from 2018 (and at least some of early 2019) could be flashed to a P, since they have the same DU (which includes both motor and inverter) that the P (and every other Model 3) has.


Which is what some folks in the thread are looking for, and nobody has given any reason why that can't happen.

 

[StealthP3D]

Just click "Ignore," and you will save yourself a lot of time and frustration down the road. TMC provided us all the "Ignore" function for a reason. Don't be bashful, use it (for your own sanity)!

I would like that so I wouldn't have to keep explaining the variability of Silicon Carbide power transistors and how they need to be sorted when pushing them to their thermal limits at high current levels. Plus that Tesla told us the drive units were sorted. But some people never listen. So, yes, put me on ignore so I don't feel like I need to explain it simply and logically one more time.

 

[voip-ninja]

My car was flashed from AWD to Performance while I waited at the delivery center. They tried to deliver it with AWD software. So I am well aware of this and these examples do not conflict with anything I've said. Obviously, when matching a Performance buyer to a VIN #, they can only match them to an AWD if that VIN # is tagged with and identifier signaling it's eligible to be upgraded to Performance.

Of course, once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story. It's no longer eligible. Tesla can't allow some AWD owners to upgrade while telling other AWD owners their particular VIN # is not eligible.

I'm surprised people are still using this as a reason why ALL AWD's should be able to be upgraded. The world is not black and white, there are many shades of grey. I can't help people who can't see them all.

You are still presenting your supposition as facts. We in fact don't "know" that Tesla was matching special VINs for P3D- buyers or if they were just matching with the closest available dual motor and then updating it.

You also claim "once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story" which as I've demonstrated is patently false.

I can't recall the specific instance but I know of at least one forum post from a member who rejected their P3D- due to cosmetic defects and then they found another available dual motor and flashed it to P3D-... which would shoot your assumption in the foot.

It's possible that Tesla just took non binned motors, pushed them to P3D- performance levels for those owners who paid for it and used the money to offset future warranty costs.

It's possible Tesla briefly built ALL of the dual motor rear motors to meet P3D- performance levels and just did a software unlock on the ones that paid for it.

It's possible that Tesla did bin/sort the motors, and only those with "good enough" motors (same part #) were able to be used as P3D- drive units. In my opinion this is the least likely scenario since if they had been doing this it would have been trivial to assign a new part # to these binned motors.

Only engineers and execs at Tesla know the real story and they aren't talking. They certainly aren't talking to you about it so stop presenting your opinion of it as if it's the final word.

If my car has a "good enough" motor for P3D- for Tesla to just flash it up to that performance level and they want $2,000 to do it I'll happily fork the money over... today. If that chaps the asses of people who paid more, well, my ass is already raw from the price cuts on these cars.

 

[Knightshade]

Of course, once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story. It's no longer eligible. Tesla can't allow some AWD owners to upgrade while telling other AWD owners their particular VIN # is not eligible.

Of course they can.

It wouldn't even be the first time they offered a build-date dependent performance upgrade for money- they did this on the Model S at one point.

 

[voip-ninja]

My car was flashed from AWD to Performance while I waited at the delivery center. They tried to deliver it with AWD software. So I am well aware of this and these examples do not conflict with anything I've said. Obviously, when matching a Performance buyer to a VIN #, they can only match them to an AWD if that VIN # is tagged with and identifier signaling it's eligible to be upgraded to Performance.

Of course, once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story. It's no longer eligible. Tesla can't allow some AWD owners to upgrade while telling other AWD owners their particular VIN # is not eligible.

I'm surprised people are still using this as a reason why ALL AWD's should be able to be upgraded. The world is not black and white, there are many shades of grey. I can't help people who can't see them all.

Also, please find a single example of someone who bought and paid for a P3D-, received an AWD and Tesla refused to flash the car to the P3D- they paid for citing that the car didn't have the right motor.

"nope, sorry mr customer we're going to have to get you a completely new car now"

We'll all be waiting.... a long time probably because I'm pretty sure it never once happened but if what you say is true then at least once someone paid for a P3D-, got an AWD and it couldn't be flashed because the motor wasn't the right one.

 

[StealthP3D]

You also claim "once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story" which as I've demonstrated is patently false.

There are no documented cases of someone who bought an AWD being able to change their purchase to a Performance after the fact. I'm not sure why you make that claim.

If my car has a "good enough" motor for P3D- for Tesla to just flash it up to that performance level and they want $2,000 to do it I'll happily fork the money over... today. If that chaps the asses of people who paid more, well, my ass is already raw from the price cuts on these cars.

Please note, it's not so much the "motor" that needs to be good enough, it's the drive unit, mostly the silicon carbide power transistors. But, yes, they test the entire drive unit so it must pass as a unit.

Even if yours passed with flying colors you are dreaming if you think Tesla will flash you to Performance after the purchase. Even if they would (they won't) it wouldn't be as cheap as $2,000!

 

[voip-ninja]

There are no documented cases of someone who bought an AWD being able to change their purchase to a Performance after the fact. I'm not sure why you make that claim.

Ah but I'm not making that claim... this is a case of you twisting the facts.

The facts are that we know, for a fact, that owners bought P3D-, were given the key cards to a dual motor car (in some cases with a dual motor window sticker and matching price tag) and then after the sale with no change of car or parts Tesla presto chango turned the car into a P3D-.

We know of zero cases where someone bought a P3D-, got a dual motor and were told the car they bought didn't have the right hardware and needed to be replaced. In 100% of cases the problem was fixed with a software update.

That blows your entire insistence that the inverters were physically different apart.

I think it's funny that you think it's impossible that Tesla wouldn't offer a discounted upgrade to P3D- for existing AWD owners when they've already discounted other software deliverables like EAP, FSD, etc., on whatever whim or cash crunch they are currently facing.

I don't even need the P3D-, my car is already absurdly fast, especially at 6,000 ft altitude where most "fast" cars are down on horsepower.... I would do it for the fun factor if I could do it on the cheap, that is all.

 

[Swampgator]

My car was flashed from AWD to Performance while I waited at the delivery center. They tried to deliver it with AWD software. So I am well aware of this and these examples do not conflict with anything I've said. Obviously, when matching a Performance buyer to a VIN #, they can only match them to an AWD if that VIN # is tagged with and identifier signaling it's eligible to be upgraded to Performance.

Of course, once it's been delivered as an AWD, end of story. It's no longer eligible. Tesla can't allow some AWD owners to upgrade while telling other AWD owners their particular VIN # is not eligible.

I'm surprised people are still using this as a reason why ALL AWD's should be able to be upgraded. The world is not black and white, there are many shades of grey. I can't help people who can't see them all.

Stealth, It seems to me you want to justify the premium you paid for your P3D- by telling yourself that you save special, binned parts. I get that.
But all of the accumulated data points to you being incorrect on this issue. That said, Tesla will not simply give a P3D- upgrade away for free. My guess is if they offer it will be 5-6K. I'm not sure I would spring that much, but maybe I would. 3K I'm giving them my money today.

 

[StealthP3D]

Also, please find a single example of someone who bought and paid for a P3D-, received an AWD and Tesla refused to flash the car to the P3D- they paid for citing that the car didn't have the right motor.

"nope, sorry mr customer we're going to have to get you a completely new car now"

We'll all be waiting.... a long time probably because I'm pretty sure it never once happened but if what you say is true then at least once someone paid for a P3D-, got an AWD and it couldn't be flashed because the motor wasn't the right one.

They only match Performance buyers with AWD VIN #'s that are Performance rated. So I would only expect to see such an example if Tesla somehow overlooked that. And it's probably happened, there are a lot of examples of people who ordered a Performance model being told their VIN # was no longer theirs and they had to issue them a different VIN #. But I wouldn't expect this to happen too often as long as the person matching the VIN # to the order was doing their job properly.

 

[StealthP3D]

The facts are that we know, for a fact, that owners bought P3D-, were given the key cards to a dual motor car (in some cases with a dual motor window sticker and matching price tag) and then after the sale with no change of car or parts Tesla presto chango turned the car into a P3D-.

Agreed.

We know of zero cases where someone bought a P3D-, got a dual motor and were told the car they bought didn't have the right hardware and needed to be replaced. In 100% of cases the problem was fixed with a software update.

Agreed. Because they only match Performance buyers with Performance rated AWD's.

That blows your entire insistence that the inverters were physically different apart.

They are manufactured to the same spec - they test to different specs.

I think it's funny that you think it's impossible that Tesla wouldn't offer a discounted upgrade to P3D- for existing AWD owners when they've already discounted other software deliverables like EAP, FSD, etc., on whatever whim or cash crunch they are currently facing.

I analyze different upgrades taking into account their differences (as I'm sure Tesla does). Upgrades are different, particularly the Performance upgrade because it pushes the hardware near the thermal limits so the hardware requirements come into play (as Elon Musk himself has told us).

I don't even need the P3D-, my car is already absurdly fast, especially at 6,000 ft altitude where most "fast" cars are down on horsepower.... I would do it for the fun factor if I could do it on the cheap, that is all.

I don't harbor any ill will or disrespect that you WANT the upgrade. I'm just saying that from a practical standpoint, it's not going to happen (even though it's physically possible).