FSD v12.x (end to end AI)

[OldManCan]

I mean I guess in the same way that vision based autowipers is a new technology, sure.

But practically, people expect working autowipers on a tech leading car.

I think we should have a class action started to demand fresh wiper blades every 6 months until the autowipers are made to work well. My wipers dry-hump my windshield so often that the wiper blades are already toast.

 

[JulienW]

Worth noting that Tesla is included in the "Hands-free driving technology" ride-and-drive for regulators today. Either Tesla has a hands-free build of 12.3, or they're demoing 12.4 to regulators:

What regulators are being shown this? Federal like NHTSA or are there also state regulators there too? Is it at a conference of regulators? I don't use My Space so can't see replies as to what this is.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Not sure how people use v11 in traffic on the freeway. If someone in front of you jams on the brakes, so does v11. Unusable. Who does this?

Fortunately rarely a use case for me. But alleged to be one of the good uses for FSD. Not recommended!

 

[Twiglett]

In desperation, due to the promised better calculations of range, we downloaded 2024.3.25 in order to get FSD V12.3.6 while we were away. It appears to be worse than what we had before 12.3.3 for our use case but we really can't tell because we still can't use it for most of our twice monthly summer drive. Sigh... Currently, the car overestimates the range left after the 3 hours drive by 15%. Which is why I have such range anxiety with the car (this is an ongoing issue but recently I've started to document it when I'm the passenger by taking photos of the screen during the drive.)

It still thinks Highway 60 is a 60kph road so that big issue isn't fixed (that's 2/3, two hours, of each drive.) AP is fussy about going more than 10kph over the limit (which it also thinks is 60kph) so the workaround, after switching profiles to non-FSD, is to single-pull for TACC, set the speed at 85kph (still annoyingly slow for other drivers but we need to conserve range because this is an L3-absent route), then double-pull for Autosteer. Then it will slow when it gets to towns (very nicely, I might add), and allow the speed to be dialed back up when exiting the town.

Worse, in the last hour, while on FSD on a controlled access highway, we had our first "Autosteer aborted due to system error". It occurred as we went under an underpass. We think it was the driver's steering wheel torque that pulled the car to the right dramatically the moment FSD aborted. Thankfully we were already in the right lane and so moved partly onto the shoulder before control was regained.

The screen never went black but the speed display part of the screen didn't look normal until the system restarted. When we attempted to use FSD the system kept beeping every few systems due to weather degradation of FSD (steady but moderate rain) so we switched to AP which only allowed 5kph over the speed limit of 100 kph (far slower than other traffic around us - FSD had been going 110kph when it aborted which is why we were in the right lane.)

We switched to TACC only (single pull), scrolled up to 110 kph, then double-pulled for TACC + Autosteer which worked but the system dropped the speed back to 105kph after a few miles and that trick didn't work a second time so the rest of the drive was manual driving.

Not impressed. Especially with the work-arounds we have to do to just get a basic ADAS of cruise control and lane-keep on this drive.

It will be a long summer of being constantly reminded of the bugs in AP and FSD. We usually make this trip 2x a year so already knew of the problem with highway 60 signs, this has been present since our first time driving it in 2021. Think of all the updates done since then, none of which resolved this issue. I had great hope when V12 came out and others started to complain on forums about the issue, but we are now 3 updates into V12 and no fix yet.

This year it will be a minimal of 12 trips so many more reminders of why I have such a hate for tesla. I know, this is all my fault for renting a summer home that is both in an L3 desert (which makes each trip well planned for since there is no way to fast charge without a long detour) and a problematic highway number (seriously?????) On the plus side, since it takes 48 hours to get enough charge to get back home, I "have" to stay up at the cottage for at least 2 nights and not go anywhere. (My family have been informed in an emergency, I can detour on the way home to get a charge but it will add a third to the length of the return trip.)

Wait, FSD changed lanes and it was halfway onto the shoulder before you "regained control"????
I've been using FSD since v10 and Autopilot before that and never once has my car made it even over the line without me stopping it. Never once have I needed to "regain control" - because I understand that I must always be in control.

For range anxiety just follow Tesla's advice and switch to percentage instead of range. The range indicator is a guess based on a moderately informed list of criteria. Just like a stock picks and nobody expects them to be accurate.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The range indicator is a guess based on a moderately informed list of criteria

Specifically it is just a quite accurate measure of remaining usable energy. It does not have units of distance. Rated miles are units of energy (different units for every car model).

 

[willow_hiller]

What regulators are being shown this? Federal like NHTSA or are there also state regulators there too? Is it at a conference of regulators? I don't use My Space so can't see replies as to what this is.

They're from the UNECE, so they make regulations that affect Europe. They're meeting in Michigan today; presumably because many of the driver-assistance technologies they're demoing only work in the US due to their regulations:

Tesla to showcase FSD v12 at UNECE event in Michigan

Tesla’s push to launch Full Self-Driving (FSD) in Europe could take a significant step this week as the United Nations Economic Commission for Europe (UNECE) will get to experience the self-driving technology first hand at […]

driveteslacanada.ca

 

[JulienW]

They're from the UNECE, so they make regulations that affect Europe. They're meeting in Michigan today; presumably because many of the driver-assistance technologies they're demoing only work in the US due to their regulations:

Damn, was hoping it was something to benefit us selfish Americans.

 

[Yelobird]

Not sure how people use v11 in traffic on the freeway. If someone in front of you jams on the brakes, so does v11. Unusable. Who does this?

Fortunately rarely a use case for me. But alleged to be one of the good uses for FSD. Not recommended!

So…. If a person in front of you slams on the brakes you prefer slamming into them to make a point?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

So…. If a person in front of you slams on the brakes you prefer slamming into them to make a point?

No. I want the car to slow down like a normal person would, obviously. It’s not a crisis.

It doesn’t even take slamming, as we all know. Really annoying and pretty inconsistent but generally poor.

 

[Dewg]

No. I want the car to slow down like a normal person would, obviously. It’s not a crisis.

It doesn’t even take slamming, as we all know. Really annoying and pretty inconsistent but generally poor.

^^^ This. I completely agree. If everyone just slowed down like a normal person when the car in front of them slams on the brakes, we'd get rid of multi-car pile ups, and insurance rates would drop.

 

[Yelobird]

No. I want the car to slow down like a normal person would, obviously. It’s not a crisis.

It doesn’t even take slamming, as we all know. Really annoying and pretty inconsistent but generally poor.

Guess I’m not a normal driver. If someone jams on the brakes in front of me I tend to react the same vs calmly entering his/her trunk.

 

[JulienW]

Guess I’m not a normal driver. If someone jams on the brakes in front of me I tend to react the same vs calmly entering his/her trunk.

My next car will be a Roadster with the SpaceX package and will just go OVER them.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Guess I’m not a normal driver. If someone jams on the brakes in front of me I tend to react the same vs calmly entering his/her trunk.

Perhaps consider your following distance (actually time)? I’m not saying you follow too closely but clearly just because somebody in stop-and-go traffic suddenly slams on their brakes and goes from 10mph to 0 in a moment, there is no reason at all for you to do the same. You’ve got at least a couple seconds to come to a stop!

This is not complicated to grasp.

 

[Yelobird]

My next car will be a Roadster with the SpaceX package and will just go OVER them.

Or through them if you can achieve 88 MPH.

 

[Dewg]

Guess I’m not a normal driver. If someone jams on the brakes in front of me I tend to react the same vs calmly entering his/her trunk.

No need to calmly enter their trunk, just slow down gracefully and smoothly. It's incredibly easy to do.

 

[Yelobird]

Perhaps consider your following distance? I’m not saying you follow too closely but clearly just because somebody in stop-and-go traffic suddenly slams on their brakes and goes from 10mph to 0 in a moment, there is no reason at all for you to do the same.

This is not complicated to grasp.

It’s not complicated granted your detail and story has now changed. Now it’s “stop and Go” traffic and going 10 mph. Different story evolving.

 

[Dewg]

So…. If a person in front of you slams on the brakes you prefer slamming into them to make a point?

I think you missed the critical point of Alan's post - he was talking about heavy traffic, where people are going 10MPH. There's no need to slam on the brakes at 10MPH if the guy in front of you slams on his.

 

[Yelobird]

I think you missed the critical point of Alan's post - he was talking about heavy traffic, where people are going 10MPH. There's no need to slam on the brakes at 10MPH if the guy in front of you slams on his.

Fair enough. Didn’t see “stop n go” or “10 mph” in his highway statement. That’s a different case and agree proper follow distance and slow down process is different.

 

[gottagofast]

My next car will be a Roadster with the SpaceX package and will just go OVER them.

That is probably how it will be revealed, they will have a model 3 on stage then the roadster will come out and hover over the top of the model 3 then land beside it

 

[JulienW]

That is probably how it will be revealed, they will have a model 3 on stage then the roadster will come out and hover over the top of the model 3 then land beside it

News flash: The Roadster was revealed on Nov 16, 2017. So it should be in full production "by the end of the year".