Gen 3 Wall Connector

[miimura]

I live in Italy and was just about to order a Gen 2 wall charger when I saw that the new gen 3 model had come out. However, after reading the specs, I have some concerns. Any advice would be much appreciated.

I recently upgraded my house mains to 3 phase (240v) in anticipation of installing an EV charger that would at least support the the 11.5Kw max. charge rate of the Tesla Model 3/Y and ideally 22KW. I had ordered a Tesla Model 3 but am now likely to buy a Model Y instead. I run an AirBnb vacation house and a key priority is having a destination charging service for my guests with any Electric car (All are type 2 in EU) as well as for charging my own Tesla. Here are my concerns:

1. The new wall charger states compatible with Tesla Model S/X/3, but not model Y. Is this just an oversight or will there be a compatibility issue with the Model Y?
2. The manual (US model only available now) states that the Gen 3 charger is single phase only. Is this just a US thing, or has the 3 phase connectivity been removed from the EU versions?
3. The EU installation model (Gen 2 only available now) states that for the 240v 3 phase configuration, "Note: This configuration should only be used with Tesla vehicles." Can anyone confirm if this is the case? I understood that if it has a type 2 connector then it should charge any EV with the same connector.

I had looked other EV wall chargers on the market, but decided to go with Tesla due to brand reputation and confidence that documentation will be in the local language for the electrician who does not speak any English. However, if this won't work with other EVs then it wouldn't work as a generic chargers for my guests.

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

This Gen 3 model is specifically for single phase and North American Tesla connector type. I'm sure you can still buy the Gen 2 3-phase version, or wait for a Gen 3 3-phase version with the Type-2 style connector.
The Gen 2 European model has a switch inside that allows it to work better with non-Tesla vehicles. Tesla doesn't state it clearly in the documentation, but I have read on the forum that it does exactly that.

 

[GenSao]

I live in Italy and was just about to order a Gen 2 wall charger when I saw that the new gen 3 model had come out. However, after reading the specs, I have some concerns. Any advice would be much appreciated.

I recently upgraded my house mains to 3 phase (240v) in anticipation of installing an EV charger that would at least support the the 11.5Kw max. charge rate of the Tesla Model 3/Y and ideally 22KW. I had ordered a Tesla Model 3 but am now likely to buy a Model Y instead. I run an AirBnb vacation house and a key priority is having a destination charging service for my guests with any Electric car (All are type 2 in EU) as well as for charging my own Tesla. Here are my concerns:

1. The new wall charger states compatible with Tesla Model S/X/3, but not model Y. Is this just an oversight or will there be a compatibility issue with the Model Y?
2. The manual (US model only available now) states that the Gen 3 charger is single phase only. Is this just a US thing, or has the 3 phase connectivity been removed from the EU versions?
3. The EU installation model (Gen 2 only available now) states that for the 240v 3 phase configuration, "Note: This configuration should only be used with Tesla vehicles." Can anyone confirm if this is the case? I understood that if it has a type 2 connector then it should charge any EV with the same connector.

I had looked other EV wall chargers on the market, but decided to go with Tesla due to brand reputation and confidence that documentation will be in the local language for the electrician who does not speak any English. However, if this won't work with other EVs then it wouldn't work as a generic chargers for my guests.

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

1) Listed comparability are for models available now. Future models such as the Y and cybertruck will be supported.

2) In the US, residential voltage is single phase up to 240 V. Three phase connectivity should be available for regions that require it (such as the EU).

3) I can not confirm this. Though for an AirBnb vacation house, consider a more universal EV charging solution that helps you monitor/control usage such as: Simple Plug & Charge Solution for Electric Vehicles — EO Charging | Smart electric vehicle charging

 

[Zaxxon]

I'd like to know more about the network part and if the network fails does that affect the charging. The last thing I need is call-backs for customers wifi issues.

Same. It seems that since there is no comm wire, the HPWC units must default down to their minimum charge capacity if network connectivity is down, else risk blowing the circuit. Unless the plan is to have them revert to some private Tesla-configured wireless network if the host connection goes down. That'd be technically feasible.

 

[BioSehnsucht]

Any word on whether it supports 120V operation? Could wire it to an exciting normal circuit for now then run a higher amp 240V circuit later. It goes down to 15A setting, and the terminals are labelled L1 and L2/N ... and some of the tables are "at 240V" or something, but no mention I saw anywhere in the install guide about 120V one way or the other.

It would be nice to leave the mobile connector in the car instead of using it for home charging.

 

[seangoggin]

I hope eventually the wi-fi will allow people to share their home publicly accessible wall connectors and bill back usage.
This could encourage thousands of neighbourhood destination chargers.

I have a setup in a remote cottage which could be helpful since there is not much in the area.

 

[COlsen1]

Any word on whether it supports 120V operation?

As much as I'd think it would work, the specs on the unit show 200-240VAC input so I'm thinking that 120v is out. I'm surprised since I think there are at least a few people who would use 120v on them for just as you described. The L2/N terminal is most likely for other countries where their power grid is different. In a lot of countries the normal line voltage is 220-240 volt on the hot wire (vs our 120v) so this could be used in those countries as well.
I am surprised that the max voltage is 240v. The Gen2 wall connector supported a higher voltage so you could use one phase of a 480v 3 phase system (which is 277v) to connect to a charger. Makes for additional charging options for commercial facilities.

I hope eventually the wi-fi will allow people to share their home publicly accessible wall connectors and bill back usage.
This could encourage thousands of neighbourhood destination chargers.

I have a setup in a remote cottage which could be helpful since there is not much in the area.

I would love to see this as well. I don't know how many residential customers would like to have strangers charging at their homes but I can see it for commercial locations. I have had commercial customers balk at installing destination charging because they didn't want to foot the bill for the electricity if someone charges there and doesn't visit the establishment. This would be great if businesses could recoup the $ for electricity if they so desired.

 

[wayner]

My theory is that in the future when there are lots of EVs we will want to create randomized start times for chargers. Assuming that you pay the same rates between 11pm-7am it would make sense to start charging at some random time, as long as it has your car fully charged by 7am. You don't want everyone with an EV to start charging at the same time, say 5am, or you could be creating new peak demand times. Would this new charger allow for this?

 

[eevee-fan]

My theory is that in the future when there are lots of EVs we will want to create randomized start times for chargers. Assuming that you pay the same rates between 11pm-7am it would make sense to start charging at some random time, as long as it has your car fully charged by 7am. You don't want everyone with an EV to start charging at the same time, say 5am, or you could be creating new peak demand times. Would this new charger allow for this?

Bolt EV has a departure scheduled charging. So it kind of already does this... You set the target SOC %, and based on your EVSE charging speed and your battery SOC %, it decides when to start charging. Too bad Tesla only has delayed charging (you set the start time).

 

[Mokuzai]

Too bad Tesla only has delayed charging (you set the start time).

Tesla does scheduled departure now. It may need additional settings for some but for my use since I leave by 6am it works well. My car is charged, battery is warm, it warms up the cabin and starts up my navigation to work without me doing anything every morning.

 

[wayner]

Scheduled departure is probably worse than setting a start time as this causes almost everyone to charge in the late morning - like 5-7am. So that would create higher demand on the grid on that time. I wrote a routine in Python that uses the Tesla API to do a scheduled departure charge for 7am.

But that is the optimal way to charge, especially when you live in a cold weather spot as your want your battery to be warm when you leave so that you don't have limited regen. I needed that this morning in Toronto as we had our first very cold day of the year at -14C. And that is nothing compared to Western Canada where the temps have been more like -30 and the newly opened V3 Superchargers aren't operating due to the cold.

 

[eevee-fan]

Scheduled departure is probably worse than setting a start time as this causes almost everyone to charge in the late morning - like 5-7am. So that would create higher demand on the grid on that time. I wrote a routine in Python that uses the Tesla API to do a scheduled departure charge for 7am.

But that is the optimal way to charge, especially when you live in a cold weather spot as your want your battery to be warm when you leave so that you don't have limited regen. I needed that this morning in Toronto as we had our first very cold day of the year at -14C. And that is nothing compared to Western Canada where the temps have been more like -30 and the newly opened V3 Superchargers aren't operating due to the cold.

Per CAISO, net demand yesterday... the fixed 6am departure currently seems beneficial for the SW USA. And avoid EV charging between 6am - 8am.

 

[wayner]

Interesting. Any idea how much of this demand comes from EVs? That would be interesting to know. In the future with smart HPWCs Tesla should know the demand coming from Teslas.

 

[eevee-fan]

No breakdown... just overall.

California ISO

 

[Glamisduner]

Very cool.

It's for sale right now: Wall Connector

I like the new styling, but I don't see any reason to upgrade from a 24' Gen 2 connector. At this point I'm not sure what advantages the WiFi offer, can't the current connectors loadshare via a physical connection?

To me it sounds much more like a downgrade for home use. This might be better for businesses but at home I'll take my 24' cable over an 18' cable, and the ability to support higher current pass through to a second wall connector will be much better than having a limited 48 amps between wall connectors. I don't need wifi to adjust my charge rate at home. I have only set it twice. Once when I upgrade from a 14-50, due to having a 50 amp breaker, and then when I put the 60 amp breaker in I changed from 40 maxium to 48 amps. The next time I change it will be when I get a second tesla and charger and that maybe replacing my wiring, although I'm pretty sure I can put in a 70 amp breaker with 4awg thhn which is rated for 95 amps.

70x 1.25 (for continuous load) = 87.5 amps which is less than the 95 amp rating.

 

[wayner]

What is the price difference between this unit and the previous one? IMHO the longer cable is only of benefit if you need it. If you don't it is a hinderance as you have more cable to be on the ground getting dirty in melting snow/sludge. I installed my HPWC in the center of my two car garage so that it could reach both stalls. The stall that I use is the "longer" one as the HPWC is on the passenger side of my car and the cable is much longer than I need. Using the other stall I would need an even shorter cable.

 

[eladts]

To me it sounds much more like a downgrade for home use. This might be better for businesses but at home I'll take my 24' cable over an 18' cable, and the ability to support higher current pass through to a second wall connector will be much better than having a limited 48 amps between wall connectors.

Power sharing for Gen 3 works differently than Gen 2. With Gen 2, one Wall Connector act as master and the rest are slaves, sharing the same circuit. With Gen 3, each Wall Connector has its own breaker but you set a limit to the total draw. For example you can have six wall connectors with 60A breaker for each in a 200A panel.

 

[Glamisduner]

Power sharing for Gen 3 works differently than Gen 2. With Gen 2, one Wall Connector act as master and the rest are slaves, sharing the same circuit. With Gen 3, each Wall Connector has its own breaker but you set a limit to the total draw. For example you can have six wall connectors with 60A breaker for each in a 200A panel.

So that will help commercial installs, but is slower for most peoples home use unless they have 6 cars they need to charge at the same time. In other words, it will allow additional wall connectors to be installed without overloading the panel.

 

[eevee-fan]

So that will help commercial installs, but is slower for most peoples home use unless they have 6 cars they need to charge at the same time. In other words, it will allow additional wall connectors to be installed without overloading the panel.

Did you know newer Tesla can only take 48A? No point having a 80A EVSE when each car can only take 48A.

 

[Glamisduner]

Did you know newer Tesla can only take 48A? No point having a 80A EVSE when each car can only take 48A.

Sure when you connect more than one wall connector and don't want to make a separate run of wire.

For example if my wife were to get a model Y and I have a model 3, and I want to wire up a second charger for her car, I can simply extend my current run to a second V2 charging station. With V3 I have to run another circuit from the back of my house to the front for the second wall connector. Thats like $1000 + materials vs only the cost of material to DIY a second V2 charger.

I guess I could convert the V2 charger to a sub panel, then connect two V3 chargers to the sub panel... That would be an another option. But the V3 setup would be allot more expensive with little gain. I'd ratehr have 2 V2 stations, and 24' of cord.

For commercial applications V3 totally makes sense.

 

[eevee-fan]

Wifi controlled, great opportunity to introduce V1G (Smart Charging). Set your departure time and let the utility decide when to charge your car.

Vehicle-to-grid - Wikipedia