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Reminder that some people actually paid for this. "In the future, Model 3 will be capable of conducting trips with no action required by the person in the driver's seat."Reminder of Level 5:
Level 5: Full Automation. Level 5-capable vehicles are fully autonomous. No driver is required behind the wheel at all. In fact, Level 5 vehicles might not even have a steering wheel or gas/brake pedals.
Website statements & printed contract words are not sufficient to legally get offI think it is pretty obvious that Elon's claims about FSD have been misleading. He's made a lot of claims over the years about FSD being solved, about our cars being L5, about doing cross country FSD etc.. that have not happened. But Tesla was careful to put the usual legal disclaimers on the website about the software not being autonomous, needing regulatory approval etc... If you ignore Elon's claims and only look at the official marketing on the website, Tesla can probably get off.
Actually he stated it would be by 2017But full autonomy is Level 5. Which the CEO of Tesla stated, would be a capability of all Tesla's with FSD, by 12/31/2021.
Deceiving consumers, thousands of them, is a real problemWe can argue amongst us all day but please tell me why this ice cream truck driver of a senator has it out for Tesla? Go after real problems.
We can argue amongst us all day but please tell me why this ice cream truck driver of a senator has it out for Tesla? Go after real problems.
Deceiving consumers, thousands of them, is a real problem
Except for that last paragraph, you might have a case. And when specifically is "in the future?"Reminder that some people actually paid for this. "In the future, Model 3 will be capable of conducting trips with no action required by the person in the driver's seat."
I guess we can debate what a "trip" is. Elon could add an automatic LSD dispenser and say he met the goals.
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I don't think Ohio has any regulations, local or state wide, on self driving cars do they? If "in the future" is beyond the life of the car could that be considered deceptive?Except for that last paragraph, you might have a case. And when specifically is "in the future?"
Perhaps. It's a more nuanced issue when disposing a vehicle with FSD paid for, especially after several years. Not based on fraud or deception per se, but on an equity principle broadly called unjust enrichment, where one party profits without actually delivering its obligation during a relevant period.I don't think Ohio has any regulations, local or state wide, on self driving cars do they? If "in the future" is beyond the life of the car could that be considered deceptive?
I think it is pretty obvious that Elon's claims about FSD have been misleading. He's made a lot of claims over the years about FSD being solved, about our cars being L5, about doing cross country FSD etc.. that have not happened. But Tesla was careful to put the usual legal disclaimers on the website about the software not being autonomous, needing regulatory approval etc... If you ignore Elon's claims and only look at the official marketing on the website, Tesla can probably get off.
Very strongly considering CA small claims here. 90% sure I want to, but the issue is timing and doing the research.n For those talking class action suits, you might want to check your sales contract that precludes class action lawsuits and requires arbitration. That is, unless you opted out within 30 days as now is permitted.
Small Claims Court is excluded, however. I'm still waiting for the first brave soldier to sue in SCC and report back on your results. And just think, the class attorneys won't take 33% like in a class action. In fact, no attorneys are permitted in SCC (at least in California), and most states have a $10,000 limit on SCC claims.
So, who's up for proving fraud? For the record, I don't think fraud can be proven, but I'm happy if someone proffers the claim in SCC and wins. That would then encourage others to do the same. If it turns into a movement, Tesla won't be happy about this, but you'll have their attention for sure.
FSD is just EAP right now. You knew that when you leased the car.Very strongly considering CA small claims here. 90% sure I want to, but the issue is timing and doing the research.
One of my Tesla’s is a June 2019 lease with FSD.
In less than a year it goes back, with or without the FSD I paid for delivered to me. And if it gets activated a month before return, I don’t know if that counts.
FSD is just EAP right now. You knew that when you leased the car.
That is why I emailed them and demanded arbitration. I finally got the form to fill out and opened a case with AAA at adr.org.For those talking class action suits, you might want to check your sales contract that precludes class action lawsuits and requires arbitration. That is, unless you opted out within 30 days as now is permitted.
Small Claims Court is excluded, however. I'm still waiting for the first brave soldier to sue in SCC and report back on your results. And just think, the class attorneys won't take 33% like in a class action. In fact, no attorneys are permitted in SCC (at least in California), and most states have a $10,000 limit on SCC claims.
So, who's up for proving fraud? For the record, I don't think fraud can be proven, but I'm happy if someone proffers the claim in SCC and wins. That would then encourage others to do the same. If it turns into a movement, Tesla won't be happy about this, but you'll have their attention for sure.
Let us know how that turns out for you.That is why I emailed them and demanded arbitration. I finally got the form to fill out and opened a case with AAA at adr.org.
My whole argument might be different than others on here as I definitely wasn't expecting L5 autonomy anytime soon, but I was expecting access to the software as it was released in a timely manner.
Will do. I don't have high expectations, but we'll see. Unless I'm under a gag order when it's done. Then I'll just share videos if FSD beta, and you'll know how it turned out.Let us know how that turns out for you.