It's shocking Tesla does not hand over direct control of their PW in the app.

[Jay Gatsby]

... not in something in Teslas control....

Thanks for the input to the discussion...
Sure.... there are many things not in Teslas control when it comes to a decision as to "the best time to charge a battery..."
This is entirely why it would be better to hand that control over to the end user...
To at least give them the option...
Cheers

 

[stopcrazypp]

^Utter humbug nonsense
Its an 8Kw solar array
So between midday and 3pm I generate 6-7kWhrs of power
It's a 13.5 Kwh battery that charges at a rate of 5kWhs
So I can charge the darn thing in under 2-3 hrs once a day for powering stuff overnight when the sun has gone down....
So I can get on use the solar I am generating for other loads like between 9am>12 and 2>6pm without pulling power from the grid on top of charging the battery during those times....
Perfect!
Let's keep things simple!!!!
(What's the big deal about that?)
All I want to do is charge the darn thing when I walk out of my back door look up at the sky notice no clouds and the sun is hi up in the sky , and I am measuring the sun is at maximum solar strength rather than some Electric Jesus telling me via a computer 15,000km away what's going on with local conditions at my little place on the planet...
Whoa stop right there... can't do that!!!!

Only Electric Jesus knows best!!!!

Its absolute bullshit I need some Electric Jesus 15000 Km away .. in a part of the world that has totally different environmental conditions to me, different housing, internet, wifi, business, local sales support, different energy companies and pricing models (All of which can change or go randomly wrong at any unpredictable time outside that EJ's control) .. different energy use culture - to tell me when it's best to use my battery...

Utter arrogant bulllshit...

All that is easy to say in a colloquial text way, but put it in a UI and you are guaranteed to have people asking for support because they don't understand the nuances of using it.

I have seen this all the time in the threads about using the timed scheduled charging functions for Tesla cars. There are multiple competing parameters: off peak time window, people don't want their battery to sit at high SOCs, beginning SOC which may vary, the target end SOC, the time of departure, preconditioning. The default suggestion is just to set a starting charge time and figure all that stuff yourself, but there's been so many complaints over the years that the car should be smart enough to figure it out themselves.

I suspect that is why Tesla ended up with this solution (where most people just pick their utility and it figures things out within the desired parameters). Most people don't want to do any calculations themselves.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Tesla has given a local energy company here direct control of the battery and the ability when to charge it or draw power from it - but they can't allow me to do that?

What absolute bullshit!

What makes you think that doesn't respect the same "smart" parameters that end users use? For example, if you set to 100% reserve, you are saying the utility can still force the battery to discharge?

Edit: A quick look at the program (the one for my local utility) says this is false. It will still respect your backup reserve and you can also opt out of events.

The way it works is you (and the Powerwall) is notified of the event ahead of time. The Powerwall will figure out the appropriate time to start charging (and how much), and how much to discharge. The Utility has no direct control over this, same as the end user UI!

Loading…

www.tesla.com

 

[Jay Gatsby]

The default suggestion is just to set a starting charge time....

Ok fair enough...
There is a default suggestion when to start charging a Tesla car battery is there?
It's the same capacity as a PW give or take right?
Could be bigger right?
It's parked in the garage... just like a PW..
Its' charged off the sun like a PW...
So there is a default start time (an end user can set) when to start charging a Tesla car battery, but no default starting time an end user can set to charge a PW?
Is that correct?
How so?
Why is that logical?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

I'd just be happy with a "default starting time" to charge my powerwall..

If that's no legal/engineering problem with a Tesla car battery... "parked" in the exact same garage as my powerwall...

Why is that a problem for Tesla to have that setting in the app for my powerwall?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

yep...

that pretty much ends the debate

I look forward to the new default starting charge time setting appearing in the next powerwall app firmware

Should be pretty easy for Tesla to add.

Let me know when it's added...



Cheers

 

[jgleigh]

the other solution (adding a wifi sensor at the main switchboard would be flaky as there is not good wifi at the front of the house)

I went back and read some of your other threads. Why isn't this a solution? It really sounds like you need a current transformer on your other phase. Solving a weak wifi signal is much easier than having Tesla implement a whole new mode.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Ok fair enough...
There is a default suggestion when to start charging a Tesla car battery is there?
It's the same capacity as a PW give or take right?
Could be bigger right?
It's parked in the garage... just like a PW..
Its' charged off the sun like a PW...
So there is a default start time (an end user can set) when to start charging a Tesla car battery, but no default starting time an end user can set to charge a PW?
Is that correct?
How so?
Why is that logical?

The difference is the Powerwall is always connected, while the car is mobile. So other than satisfying off-peak rates, there isn't much of a reason to set a specific charge time. And Tesla does provide for setting that via rate plans.

So, my question is, as suggested earlier in the thread, why doesn't setting a custom rate schedule not achieve what you are looking for? Have you tried doing that?

You will probably instead be waiting forever waiting for that specific toggle, given there isn't demand for it.

 

[Matt-FL]

I'm using the 'dummy' system - I've got a Unifi EV Station, that I set to allow charging from 1:30pm to 5:30pm daily. Typically by 1:30pm my 4 PWs are full and I start exporting. However, if it is a cloudy day, I have this automated process that disconnects the car (it's called 'sneaker-net').

 

[Jay Gatsby]

So, my question is, as suggested earlier in the thread, why doesn't setting a custom rate schedule not achieve what you are looking for? Have you tried doing that?

Sure Ive tried doing that. But how does this give me the specific charge control I need?

The sun is highest in the sky at 12>3pm. The orientation of my panels gives me the greatest collection between those times. It takes 2-3 hrs to charge my battery and i want it to charge between those times specifically - so that if it does pull a bit of power off the grid to "top up" ie to meet it;s 5kwhr charge rate when solar doesn;t quite match it - say a cloud goes over (again Tesla doesn't allow us to drop that max charge rate) I need to specifically charge between those times and definitely stop charging at 3pm. Why? Because over here Maximum Tariff rates kick in at 3pm.

My off peak rates are different to the time when it's best to charge! When is that? When the sun is highest in the sky between 12 and 3pm!

There is no specific "off peak rate" schedule that kicks in at midday...

How do I "set a custom rate schedule" to get it to charge only between 12 and 3pm, if the power companies "rate schedule" never is that specific time? That is Hi tariff is between 3pm and 9pm the following day? Where is the "custom rate schedule" I can set that gives me specific charge only between 12 midday and 3pm?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

I went back and read some of your other threads. Why isn't this a solution? It really sounds like you need a current transformer on your other phase. Solving a weak wifi signal is much easier than having Tesla implement a whole new mode.

Thanks for taking the effort to do that and help out.. but

Seriously?

It would be that hard for Tesla to :"implement a whole new mode"...

To get the app team to just add a manual control option...

If customer wants to switch on battery themselves between 12 midday and 3pm set 1200<>1500 in the app.

Sure.. real hard to do that via software...

"Set charge rate 50%"... yep again... real hard...

Yep us humans are so daft

Lets just let the robots run our lives - they know what's best!

 

[stopcrazypp]

Sure Ive tried doing that. But how does this give me the specific charge control I need?

The sun is highest in the sky at 12>3pm. The orientation of my panels gives me the greatest collection between those times. It takes 2-3 hrs to charge my battery and i want it to charge between those times specifically - so that if it does pull a bit of power off the grid to "top up" ie to meet it;s 5kwhr charge rate when solar doesn;t quite match it - say a cloud goes over (again Tesla doesn't allow us to drop that max charge rate) I need to specifically charge between those times and definitely stop charging at 3pm. Why? Because over here Maximum Tariff rates kick in at 3pm.

How do I "set a custom rate schedule" to get it to charge only between 12 and 3pm, if the power companies "rate schedule" never is that specific time? That is Hi tariff is between 3pm and 9pm the following day? Where is the "custom rate schedule" I can set that gives me specific charge only between 12 midday and 3pm?

Don't use the power company's rate schedule at all! Make your own custom utility and choose the times that are most suitable for your setup.
From here, it shows you if chose "custom rate plan" you can set a custom time period, custom rates, seasons, etc.
https://www.tesla.com/support/energy/powerwall/mobile-app/utility-rate-plans

Set a fake rate plan that makes the system trigger charging/discharging at the times you want.

You may have to choose "start over" to clear out your existing utility plan settings. Note however, if you want to keep your current settings or if you have customized it, you may want to take note of what is currently set, so you can go back to previous settings if necessary.

 

[Jay Gatsby]

^Ok thanks for that..

So I set up a fake rate plan using time of use...

I only want it to charge between 12midday and 3pm

I only want it to discharge when the sun is down

I set the low tarrif between when.... and the high tarrif between when?

How do I precisely do that?

(Wouldn't it be easier for just Tesla to add a specific time setting?)

Why the heck to we have to "fake a rate plan" just to plicate some darm robot in the app just because Tesla "thinks" Ai and robots know best> ?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

Set a fake rate plan that makes the system trigger charging/discharging at the times you want.

ok

What specific settings do I enter to trigger the battery to only switch on at 12 midday and off at 3pm and Battery can only discharge when there is no solar power?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

Set a fake rate plan that makes the system trigger charging/discharging at the times you want.

I understand your approach and appreciate the help
what fake rate plan would you set up to do what I want?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

See everyone - the problem here is sensing

It's a fundamental law of computer science and robotics. Garbage in garbage out

If the sensor is feeding the wrong info - the robotics and AI won't work...

Maybe you all think I'm daft...that in my set up I don;t have sensing on the main switchboard...

Oh I do .... just not Tesla sensing

I've got Solar edge sensing. (very robust but only variables provided every 15 min all via the cloud) and I've got more accurate Rainforest sensing providing me power data at the main meter every 10 secs.... but here is the thing...

I can't get that sensing data into the Tesla echo system..

Got it?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

Think of the problem like this.

Where is Tesla's "back up" solution for all their customers - each and everyone one of you all...

If Tesla sensing goes down?

(Without a manual override setting in the app....)

How will you all then control your batteries?

 

[Jay Gatsby]

See where I am coming from here... I just can't believe this...
That such a clearly fantastic, innovative company...full of so many smart people hasn't considered that maybe.. just maybe there is a flaw in "that approach"...
That approach?
(well just like Boeing and the 747Max)
You've got to have a suitable manual option if the sensing is inadequate .....
Heck! Tesla would well know this already with their cars!
So why not with their solar and batteries?

 

[stopcrazypp]

^Ok thanks for that..

So I set up a fake rate plan using time of use...

I only want it to charge between 12midday and 3pm

I only want it to discharge when the sun is down

I set the low tarrif between when.... and the high tarrif between when?

How do I precisely do that?

(Wouldn't it be easier for just Tesla to add a specific time setting?)

Why the heck to we have to "fake a rate plan" just to plicate some darm robot in the app just because Tesla "thinks" Ai and robots know best> ?

When does your existing rate plan do charge and discharge and what are the rates? Just emulate that and use that as a template and offset the times so that it fits your schedule. I'm just giving you an idea to how to get the existing tool to achieve as close to what you want as possible (other way is, as others mentioned, use something like Home Assistant and the API to mess with the reserve percentage and whatever other parameters to trigger charge/discharges).

As I noted, the reason is because probably 99% of the applications is to react to off and on peak of the utility, so the best you can do at the moment is work within that design. You can try doing a feature request (maybe in service section of the app), but most likely that won't go anywhere. There just isn't high demand for your specific application (or installers would be requesting those toggles).

 

[ucmndd]

ok

What specific settings do I enter to trigger the battery to only switch on at 12 midday and off at 3pm and Battery can only discharge when there is no solar power?

Time Based Control

I’d start with setting an Off-peak period between 12-3, which should result in excess solar being stored by the battery until it’s full.

Setting a Peak period from 3pm to 12pm the next day should result in the powerwall discharging to cover house loads. Solar produced during that period will go to house loads first, back to the grid second if the powerwall is full.

In your rate plan set a fairly large difference between peak and off peak buy rates. If you want to prioritize your house loads at all times and minimize energy that goes back to the grid, set your sell price to zero.