Lane Positioning for Autopilot/Autosteer

[camalaio]

Hi folks,

I'm wondering if this is something common, or an issue with my Model 3. If it matters, I'm in BC, Canada. The behaviour described is much more noticeable on highways, but can be observed in town on main roads as well.

Ever since we got the car, Autosteer has seemed to prefer the left side of the lane I'm in. In a country where we drive on the right, this is of course a bit unnerving at best, and dangerous at worse times. It also makes the driver look ridiculous and causes others to pass a bit more recklessly to "get out of the way", I imagine.

I pride myself in knowing where my wheels are at all times, so I waited until my wife followed in a different vehicle to confirm for certain that I'm not crazy and it is actually hugging the left side of the lane. Turns out I'm not crazy about this specific point.

It's worth mentioning it hugs the left the majority of the time. Going straight it's a bit more centred, but around here roads aren't perfectly straight for very long. On rightward curves, it begins the turn very late and stays that way, so my nose is nearly on the left line throughout the corner. On leftward curves, it begins the turn early and still hugs that left line, though generally does not cross it.

Also worth a mention is that the car "knows" it's doing this, as the road lines displayed on the screen indeed show the car hugging the left line (and even crossing it sometimes on rightward curves).

I know AP can't handle tight curves very well yet and tends to cut the corner, that's somewhat expected (and is how people actually drive to a degree). But these are _not_ strong curves in the road. This behaviour is the same whether the lane to my left is opposing traffic or a lane going the same direction as me. If a car is passing by I need to often take over as it is much too close for comfort.

Is this just how autosteer works for others as well, or is something wrong?

 

[earthwormjim]

My car would hug the left when I first got it. I also noticed the steering wheel was 1 degree clockwise off center. Had the car aligned (for free obviously) at the local Tesla Service Center, steering wheel was nicely centered now, and autopilot stopped favoring one side.

See about having your car aligned, might fix the issue.

 

[jdcollins5]

After an update, about two updates ago, I noticed a slight shift to the left, where it has always been centered before.

It is not an alignment problem since it tracks straight and true in manual driving.

 

[Silicon Desert]

My car would hug the left when I first got it. I also noticed the steering wheel was 1 degree clockwise off center. Had the car aligned (for free obviously) at the local Tesla Service Center, steering wheel was nicely centered now, and autopilot stopped favoring one side.

See about having your car aligned, might fix the issue.

Two unrelated things. Coincidence

 

[camalaio]

My car would hug the left when I first got it. I also noticed the steering wheel was 1 degree clockwise off center. Had the car aligned (for free obviously) at the local Tesla Service Center, steering wheel was nicely centered now, and autopilot stopped favoring one side.

See about having your car aligned, might fix the issue.

Huh. So I know it has poor alignment (since delivery, annoyingly), but I don't think (hope?) that's the case for two reasons:

• If I'm centred and I engage autosteer, it somewhat violently "corrects" to hugging the left side. You can feel it wanting to steer over, not just drifting.
• I _assume_ autosteer is able to deal with non-perfect alignment, since it's a reality of all 4-wheeled vehicles. They would simply have to design the system such that it can account for drift. In fact this is so common in the automation industry that there's no way they haven't accounted for this.

You say "for free obviously", and I'm actually curious, why was this obvious to you? Many Model 3's around here were being delivered with poor alignment, and it's just considered a problem we have to fix ourselves as far as I've heard.

 

[KenC]

I'd take it to a SC and get the cameras re-calibrated. It shouldn't hug the left.

 

[MexiCanuck]

I too find that my Model 3SR+ (June 2019 delivery) tracks further to the left than my liking. I only use it on highways where there is either a concrete median or a centre boulevard.

A few days ago I made an error. I had it engaged in a location where there is no median, but the centre line has plastic posts about a metre high. (At the bottom of the Malahat for those who know south Vancouver Island.).

It was very disconcerting having my car centimetres from those posts until I realized what I was doing and disengaged the autopilot.

 

[srs5694]

Mine was perfectly centered for a couple of months, then began working more erratically -- at different times, it would be centered or stray a bit to the left, but seldom to the point where I'd say it was hugging the left side of the lane. Sometimes it'll drift between centered and left-centered over the course of just a few seconds, similar to the "ping-pong effect" people complain about in some other manufacturers' LKA systems. Once or twice I've disengaged Autopilot because it's been far enough to the left in heavy traffic that I've felt uncomfortable, but for the most part it's been a minor annoyance at worst.

Is there a user-accessible way to force Autopilot to recalibrate itself? The owner's manual mentions an initial Autopilot calibration, but I don't recall anything about forcing a recalibration. For me, I don't think it's worth taking the car to a service center, but if there's something I could do to force a recalibration, I might give it a try.

 

[jdcollins5]

24.4 seems to have moved my car back closer center!

 

[Uncle Don]

I also find the car likes to hug the left line. I only experienced it during my Autopilot trial. It's one of the reasons I haven't purchased Autopilot. As stated in another comment, I could feel the car turn left, but just drift over. That's not the way I drive so I don't want my car to drive that way either. If things like that get fixed I may buy Autopilot.

 

[Knightshade]

It's pretty funny... tons of people complain AP is "too centered" and they want it to shy away from a truck in the middle lane when they pass by hugging the left line.

Then tons of other peopel complain it's "not centered enough" and they don't like how it hugs the left line.

 

[Joshan]

It's pretty funny... tons of people complain AP is "too centered" and they want it to shy away from a truck in the middle lane when they pass by hugging the left line.

Then tons of other peopel complain it's "not centered enough" and they don't like how it hugs the left line.

Truth.... you will never please everyone.

One a side note. I have a freind with a Model S and he got a alignment at a non tesla shop and the car started nont centering any longer. He made a SC appt and the tech told him you have to do every alignment with Tesla as they also adjust the camera at the same time and if you adjust the alignment without adjusting the camera it can cause bad behavior.

So if you alignment is "off" it could cause you to not be centered.

 

[lampcord]

It's pretty funny... tons of people complain AP is "too centered" and they want it to shy away from a truck in the middle lane when they pass by hugging the left line.

Then tons of other peopel complain it's "not centered enough" and they don't like how it hugs the left line.

I agree. In my case it is dead center. I kind of wish there was a setting for this. Hug left, hug right or centered. But I've had very few problems with it being centered and if a car to the right of me get's closer than I'm comfortable with I simply steer a little to the left and disengage till I've passed.

 

[camalaio]

I too find that my Model 3SR+ (June 2019 delivery) tracks further to the left than my liking. I only use it on highways where there is either a concrete median or a centre boulevard.

A few days ago I made an error. I had it engaged in a location where there is no median, but the centre line has plastic posts about a metre high. (At the bottom of the Malahat for those who know south Vancouver Island.).

It was very disconcerting having my car centimetres from those posts until I realized what I was doing and disengaged the autopilot.

Right? It's very unnerving. I wonder if this is somehow a Canadian AP thing...

Mine was perfectly centered for a couple of months, [...] Once or twice I've disengaged Autopilot because it's been far enough to the left in heavy traffic that I've felt uncomfortable, but for the most part it's been a minor annoyance at worst. [...]

And this is just the thing, I find myself having to disable it whenever another car is passing by (whether that's the same direction of traffic passing on my left, or if the lane to the left is opposing traffic). Around a corner it's simply likely to cause an issue if I don't take over, so what's the point in using it?

24.4 seems to have moved my car back closer center!

Interesting if true, this has not been the case for us so far. Apologies, I may file this one under the common "update placebo" but if it truly helped you, then great!

I also find the car likes to hug the left line. I only experienced it during my Autopilot trial. It's one of the reasons I haven't purchased Autopilot. As stated in another comment, I could feel the car turn left, but just drift over. That's not the way I drive so I don't want my car to drive that way either. If things like that get fixed I may buy Autopilot.

I can tolerate the car driving a bit unlike I do (e.g. keeping more centred instead of "cutting" the inside of a corner like most people do) as long as it's safe and not alarming to other road users. I didn't have the option to skip buying AP, I assume you were an early order/delivery?

It's pretty funny... tons of people complain AP is "too centered" and they want it to shy away from a truck in the middle lane when they pass by hugging the left line.

Then tons of other peopel complain it's "not centered enough" and they don't like how it hugs the left line.

Truth.... you will never please everyone.

One a side note. I have a freind with a Model S and he got a alignment at a non tesla shop and the car started nont centering any longer. He made a SC appt and the tech told him you have to do every alignment with Tesla as they also adjust the camera at the same time and if you adjust the alignment without adjusting the camera it can cause bad behavior.

So if you alignment is "off" it could cause you to not be centered.

I sincerely hope this isn't hand-waving of "not being able to please everybody". Of course no one would be happy with a car nearly driving into the other lane around corners?? It's an objectively incorrect way to drive and there's no local precedent for this driving behaviour.

Anyhow, the note regarding third-party alignment is odd. I know there were issues with Honda vehicles (and likely many others) that had windshield glass replaced -- the cameras needed calibration to detect road line positions correctly again. But wheel alignment? Hasn't been a problem with any other manufacturer that I'm aware of.

Again, my car "knows" it's hugging the left of the lane via the display. It is somehow quite happy being there. Interesting that no one chimed in saying that theirs hugs the right side, only centre and left?

So all this said, I'll finally book my first service appointment for the many small issues since delivery. Hopefully I don't have to drive 5h to the SC for this (again, alignments are a very common task, hopefully I have not signed up to throwing away a weekend every year to get a Tesla SC to do my alignment when a local tire shop could just as effectively do it while mounting/swapping tires...).

Thanks for the input everyone. I'll update based on results from the service.

 

[camalaio]

I probably should have mentioned earlier: When I am the one in a passing lane, it still hugs left. That is, I can very comfortably pass people that are in the right lane since it still hugs the left side. It's the common scenario of being in the rightmost or centre lanes where this is more uncomfortable/dangerous.

 

[Joshan]

I sincerely hope this isn't hand-waving of "not being able to please everybody". Of course no one would be happy with a car nearly driving into the other lane around corners?? It's an objectively incorrect way to drive and there's no local precedent for this driving behaviour.

Not what I was saying at all, do you drive with many people while you are in the passenger seat? Do they all drive the same way you do? Do any of them even drive similar at all to you?

Not really for me. My wife is always in the lane that is the farthest away from people she can get. On a highway with more than 2 lanes, she will only get comfortable in the most inner or outer lane. Needless to say she drives the line at the farthest point from other cars.

I tend to drive right in the middle, on corners I likely tend to hug the inside line, but on most roads I see to be centered up.

Its pretty easy for us to see as the lane assist on our Audi yells at her constantly and never chirps at me.

Our son on the other hand rides the middle line in 2 lane rorads (I think we dropped him on his head as baby...) So he also gets yelled at by the Audi lane assist but to move AWAY.

Just because of personal preferences like this, some people will not like how AP drives. They do not feel comfortable unless the car is in the position on the road that it would be if they were driving.

 

[brandonee916]

I wish I had that issue.... mine always stays centered in the lane so if it widens (for example an onramp) my car will go to the right to stay centered.... drives me crazy! So I tend to stay out of the right lanes so it doesn't do this

 

[lampcord]

I wish I had that issue.... mine always stays centered in the lane so if it widens (for example an onramp) my car will go to the right to stay centered.... drives me crazy! So I tend to stay out of the right lanes so it doesn't do this

I get that too. Seems better with latest update but still annoying. Good thing I don't drive in the right lane much. Hate dealing with all the merging traffic.

 

[camalaio]

Not what I was saying at all, do you drive with many people while you are in the passenger seat? Do they all drive the same way you do? Do any of them even drive similar at all to you?

Not really for me. My wife is always in the lane that is the farthest away from people she can get. On a highway with more than 2 lanes, she will only get comfortable in the most inner or outer lane. Needless to say she drives the line at the farthest point from other cars.

I tend to drive right in the middle, on corners I likely tend to hug the inside line, but on most roads I see to be centered up.

Its pretty easy for us to see as the lane assist on our Audi yells at her constantly and never chirps at me.

Our son on the other hand rides the middle line in 2 lane rorads (I think we dropped him on his head as baby...) So he also gets yelled at by the Audi lane assist but to move AWAY.

Just because of personal preferences like this, some people will not like how AP drives. They do not feel comfortable unless the car is in the position on the road that it would be if they were driving.

Thanks for the clarification, understood. I was perhaps over-reacting to some of the recent more crazy themes on this board that drive me nuts (e.g. the anger to the price of the car going down -- like every car ever made!). Apologies.

If my Model 3 drove like any other driver I see on the highway (or know), I think I'd be much happier. I'm a lane centrist myself, tending to the right as I get tired (probably a "safety" reaction). If both the car (via display) and my wife (via driving behind me) had not confirmed the leftward tendency to the point of being on the line, I'd probably still be questioning my habits versus making this thread. The part where the Model 3 drives very differently from a human is with the adaptive cruise/TACC. My goodness is that jerky, at all but the longest (7?) follow distance. Anyhow...

I wish I had that issue.... mine always stays centered in the lane so if it widens (for example an onramp) my car will go to the right to stay centered.... drives me crazy! So I tend to stay out of the right lanes so it doesn't do this

Ok yeah, I think everyone gets this behaviour unfortunately. It came up in a recent meeting where Elon (maybe someone else?) mentioned they're tackling the idea of space-you-can-drive-in-if-emergency and space-you-should-drive-in, with this scenario being an example of where the two concepts aren't equal (as well as road shoulders etc.). There's quite a few of those cases around here and I'm very glad I knew what the car would do prior to testing it myself, because it would have been quite surprising.

EDIT: That may sound like it contradicts the leftward hug, but it doesn't quite in my opinion. This is <1% of the range covered by Autosteer, and it's also difficult to judge if it's still left-of-center during this short period.

 

[srs5694]

It's pretty funny... tons of people complain AP is "too centered" and they want it to shy away from a truck in the middle lane when they pass by hugging the left line.

Then tons of other peopel complain it's "not centered enough" and they don't like how it hugs the left line.

It's about context -- in this case, not the context of the posts, but of the driving. Sure, hugging the left of the lane is appropriate when you're in the leftmost lane, and especially when passing a truck (or anything else), as you describe. Now imagine you're in the rightmost lane and a truck is passing you! That's the situation I was in when I became so uncomfortable with the right-of-lane hugging (which was unusually bad by my car's standards) and disabled Autopilot, so I could get a little further from that huge 18-wheeler that was passing me literally inches from my car.

Keeping the car exactly centered in the lane is a reasonable compromise for most situations, but when Autopilot deviates from that -- hugging either the left or the right of the lane -- it will become unnerving, and possibly unsafe, for some situations, even if that exact behavior is better for others. The best solution would include better context awareness, so that the car might keep towards the left of the lane when passing or the right of the lane when in the rightmost lane (or on a 2-lane divided highway). Autopilot isn't that advanced yet, of course, so keeping the car exactly centered is the best compromise -- but it's not doing so quite reliably enough in at least some cars.