Here is a list of 14 DC fast chargers (ChaDeMo) located in Washington and Oregon.
West Coast Green Highway - Electric Highways
There are two DC fast Chargers in the San Francisco Bay area. One is in Belmont the other in San Ramon.
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Here is a list of 14 DC fast chargers (ChaDeMo) located in Washington and Oregon.
West Coast Green Highway - Electric Highways
There are two DC fast Chargers in the San Francisco Bay area. One is in Belmont the other in San Ramon.
As I understand it, it includes some beefier internal cabling as well as some relays.
Actually at least 3 in the Bay Area - there is also one at Stanford Shopping center in Palo Alto. And more on the way soon.
(Edit: I now see twisti already responded)
I just got conformation that the next fast chargers in the Netherlands will do 50kW CHAdeMO and 3x63A 44kW AC (Type 2 connector).
So this will allow cars like the Renault ZOE to charge with 44kW on regular AC.
Now, since the specs of the 3-phase charging for the Model S haven't been revealed yet it's still speculating, but I wouldn't be surprised if they went with:
- SuperCharging (Teslas own)
- J1772 DC / "Mennekes" DC
- 3-phase AC 44kW (EU only)
Since regulations in the EU might prohibit a CHAdeMO adapter it could be that Tesla will be going for "Mennekes" DC and 3-phase 63A.
At the Geneva Motor Show the Tesla rep told me that it would probably be 3x63A, but at the time I didn't really believe him. However, the more I think of it, the more logical it seems.
We won't know for sure until Tesla releases information regarding this. I'm setting my hopes for the IAA in September (Hannover, Germany).
So this will allow cars like the Renault ZOE to charge with 44kW on regular AC.
Now, since the specs of the 3-phase charging for the Model S haven't been revealed yet it's still speculating, but I wouldn't be surprised if they went with:
- SuperCharging (Teslas own)
- J1772 DC / "Mennekes" DC
- 3-phase AC 44kW (EU only)
Since regulations in the EU might prohibit a CHAdeMO adapter it could be that Tesla will be going for "Mennekes" DC and 3-phase 63A.
At the Geneva Motor Show the Tesla rep told me that it would probably be 3x63A, but at the time I didn't really believe him. However, the more I think of it, the more logical it seems.
We won't know for sure until Tesla releases information regarding this. I'm setting my hopes for the IAA in September (Hannover, Germany).
I'm going to bet it will be 3x32A (22kW) using a pair of modified 10kW chargers... if I'm wrong I'll buy you a beer :smile:
That was the point I was making here.
You may be right, but you'd hope Tesla would make the Model S able to charge at least as fast as a Zoe.
with the Tesla's substantial capacity and the expanding network of L3 along the west coast, it's really the CHAdeMO adapter that is key. It seems to me that S owners will have very little need for public L2 charging. anyone seen or heard any info on a CHAdeMO adapter. One of the things that convinced us to go with the reservation was that the CHAdeMO adapter was reportedly "a month away", about a month ago.
Can you please elaborate? Were you merely reacting to the speculation that characterizes this forum, or do you have an authoritative source?
Thanks.
Larry
AndyM
Member
I'm interested, as well. I had been told CHAdeMO was simply not an charging method for Model S, since it isn't electrically compatible. Maybe through the UMC, it could work.
I would much rather hear about Tesla's official position on this charging capability that lighted vanity mirrors. But, CHAdeMO is not a standard, so I completely understand why Tesla is taking a 'divert' approach to CHAdeMO support.
I don't see how the UMC would help there.
CHAdeMO *is* a standard. Just not an *open* standard. And primarily a Japanese standard.
In theory, Tesla could join the CHAdeMO group, and get access to the specs.
AndyM
Member
Excellent point (in re the use of standard).
I was thinking that the UMC would be able to do the signalling translations needed between the Model S on-board chargers and CHAdeMO stations, while no such translations are needed for J1772 stations.
The UMC provides the signalling to the on-board chargers when connecting to "dumb" power sources, such as NEMA 14-50 or common 120V outlets, right?
Perhaps I grossly misunderstand the role of the UMC... Perhaps "U" should not stand for "universal" in the acronym?
Nope. The UMC is strictly Level 2 (and Level 1) AC and is limited to 10 kW, not the DC 50 kW of current CHAdeMO stations. The signaling is very different too. CHAdeMO uses CAN, and we believe the Model S DC signaling uses PLC.
As and aside, the U in UMC (Universal Mobile Connector) grew out Tesla's early offerings for the Roadster. The MC120 had a NEMA 5-15 end, and the MC240 had a NEMA 14-50 connector. The UMC was universal in that you could use it with a variety of "dumb" wall sockets via adapters. Nothing is truly universal.
Another way to put it:
The UMC has a very simple circuit to generate a pilot signal that the car can use to know how much power to draw based on what type of wall plug is on the end. It is almost certainly the same sort of signal that J1772 already uses.
A CHAdeMO adapter would require a more complicated bit of hardware to have a bi-directional communication path between the car and the CHAdeMO charger. Also, either such an adapter would need to speak "CHAdeMO" protocol, or the car would have to have firmware that could send CHAdeMO compatible messages through this bi-directional communication path. It is uncertain if the car is already able to send CHAdeMO type commands. At this point, I doubt it.
The UMC & J1772 are fairly "dumb". The EVSE (including UMC) just send a constant / fixed signal to say how much power is available. CHAdeMO is much more dynamic with car communicating things such as battery pack fulness back to the off-board charger.
The UMC has a very simple circuit to generate a pilot signal that the car can use to know how much power to draw based on what type of wall plug is on the end. It is almost certainly the same sort of signal that J1772 already uses.
A CHAdeMO adapter would require a more complicated bit of hardware to have a bi-directional communication path between the car and the CHAdeMO charger. Also, either such an adapter would need to speak "CHAdeMO" protocol, or the car would have to have firmware that could send CHAdeMO compatible messages through this bi-directional communication path. It is uncertain if the car is already able to send CHAdeMO type commands. At this point, I doubt it.
The UMC & J1772 are fairly "dumb". The EVSE (including UMC) just send a constant / fixed signal to say how much power is available. CHAdeMO is much more dynamic with car communicating things such as battery pack fulness back to the off-board charger.
The problem with Chademo from what I remember reading is that Chademo protocol controlls the charging cycle rather than the car. Tesla does not want to allow someone elses protocol to charge their batteries. An intermediary would have to be constructed to simulate a charging battery allowing the car to continued to dictate the charge, and tell Chademo when to ramp down and finish charging.
Anyone correct me if this is incorrect.
Anyone correct me if this is incorrect.
I think that the car has some say in it. For instance, I am fairly sure the car could send a "please stop charging me now" command.
What I wonder is if all of the CHAdeMO chargers are capable of creating high enough DC voltage for the Model S pack?
Not sure if the voltage range of a Tesla Supercharger is the same as a CHAdeMO charger.
Tesla might have decided to use higher voltage so that they could use thinner wire and still get 90kW.
But, I am really just making idle speculation here.
What I wonder is if all of the CHAdeMO chargers are capable of creating high enough DC voltage for the Model S pack?
Not sure if the voltage range of a Tesla Supercharger is the same as a CHAdeMO charger.
Tesla might have decided to use higher voltage so that they could use thinner wire and still get 90kW.
But, I am really just making idle speculation here.
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