I don't know. People make it sound complicated and come up with all sorts of reasons why it won't work for them, but for the normal case it's quite simple and basically just like the Model S. You walk up to the car and it unlocks, and when you walk away it locks. My wife's Honda has a system that sounds like the Prius. It works fine for unlocking, but you still need to do something manually to lock it.
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I don't know. People make it sound complicated and come up with all sorts of reasons why it won't work for them, but for the normal case it's quite simple and basically just like the Model S. You walk up to the car and it unlocks, and when you walk away it locks. My wife's Honda has a system that sounds like the Prius. It works fine for unlocking, but you still need to do something manually to lock it.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Can't be NFC type either. NFC type systems have a max theoretical range of 20 cm (7.87 in) and practical range of 10 cm (3.93 in). There is no way your fob will be that close to the sensor unless you move your pocket toward the sensor (which the @T34ME didn't say he did).
Near field communication - Wikipedia
Given you say it is a Prius key, @cella appears to be correct.
The older key is from the original 2001-2003 and one is 315 MHz (AKA standard keyless system):
Prius Key Fob Study
2008 - 2013 OEM for Toyota Smart Key Remote (315 Mhz) / FCC HYQ14ACX | eBay
The newer version is also in the 315 MHz class if you look up the FCC ID:
TOYOTA Prius 2016 - 2017 Smart Key 3-Btns / HYQ14FBC -OEM | eBay
FCC ID HYQ14FBC Electronic Key by Denso Corporation
NFC uses 13.56 MHz.
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T34ME
Active Member
I am confused about that. Doesn't that mean you have to be carrying a smartphone? If you want that type of functionality (hands off) does that mean you are required to have a smartphone on your person?
On the Prius you have to touch the sensor on the door handle. The sensor has a couple of slight ridges so you can easily find it in the dark. If the car is locked, two chirps and the car unlocks. If the car is unlocked, one chirp and the car locks. If the car is unlocked in the garage, just don't touch the sensor and climb in! So easy, even a cave man can do it!
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
The card doesn't actually have to be taken out of the wallet. I use a NFC card practically everyday and it only needs to be hovered near the sensor to make the connection, so card never leaves my wallet.
The only consideration is how the cupholder area sensor works (does it need constant connection to keep car on or only once to turn on).
T34ME
Active Member
That is correct, I don't make any effort to move my pocket closer to the door handle sensor. It is usually a couple of feet away. Tomorrow I'm going to test the range of my keyfob just out of curiosity.
T34ME
Active Member
GREAT, I'm understanding more with each post. Thank you everyone for your patience. But how is carrying a Bluetooth 4.0 device less cumbersome than carrying a fob in my pocket? I just measured my fob, it is 1.5" x 2.5" x 0.5" thick. Are there any Bluetooth 4.0 devices that size or smaller? I'm a neophyte at this stuff!
Tesla has a much larger gameplan and its very long term and way beyond what the competition is capable. I posted a member article on the topic that you can find here.
If you're in the vast minority who don't carry a cellphone, then you will be inconvenienced compared to a traditional key fob.
To be frank, the choices are:
- Get a phone and carry it with you all the time. Entry and exit should be seamless.
- Use the NFC card, which will need to be swiped against the door and placed in the cup holder
- Look elsewhere for a vehicle (if either option is a deal-breaker)
T34ME
Active Member
Okay, now we're making progress. So I will now keep a credit card size keycard in my wallet (which I keep in my front pocket) instead of a key fob. But another question, the videos I've seen show the keycard sensor on the car is on the B pillar at about chest level. That is certainly a lot more than ~ 4 - 8" from my front pocket. The day is drawing nigh when I will no longer have need for a wallet and it can't come soon enough!
@stopcrazypp I'm going to owe you a couple of cervezas for your patience with me and give you good reason for your screen name!
T34ME
Active Member
Yes, @Alketi I read your article when you first posted and I found it inspirational. I do think that there is another option that would be a subgroup of your first - a miniature Bluetooth 4.0 device that is smaller than a fob. It will happen! As far as option 3, it is never going to happen for me, the Model 3 is my dream car.
Before punching a hole in the card, please check you are not punching a hole in the antenna embedded in the card !
(You generally can see the antenna wire by shining a bright light through the card, see attached image. Or just google "how to disable NFC in credit cards" and do the opposite of what they are saying !)
If the card is in your wallet the you will need to take the wallet out of your pocket and hold it near the B pillar. But there shouldn’t be a need to take the card out of your wallet (unless your name is George Castanza).Okay, now we're making progress. So I will now keep a credit card size keycard in my wallet (which I keep in my front pocket) instead of a key fob. But another question, the videos I've seen show the keycard sensor on the car is on the B pillar at about chest level. That is certainly a lot more than ~ 4 - 8" from my front pocket. The day is drawing nigh when I will no longer have need for a wallet and it can't come soon enough!
@stopcrazypp I'm going to owe you a couple of cervezas for your patience with me and give you good reason for your screen name!
My ID card for work is NFC. We have two types of readers for it - interior (which unlock doors and clock us in/out) and exterior (opening gates). The interior ones require that the card be very close (maybe 1-3 centimeters?) but the exterior ones have pretty good range. I can have my card in my purse and just generally wave my purse near the pad, and it opens. If I drive right next to the curb at the gate, I can open the gate without even rolling my window down - I hold my card up to the glass and it can read the card despite both an air gap (say, 15-20 centimeters?) and the glass being in the way.
diamond.g
Active Member
Just because the Model 3 only comes with a NFC card and we've been told we can use our cell phone to unlock the car doesn't mean that these are the only things that will work. The Model X uses a bluetooth fob. Why couldn't it also work with a Model 3? Tesla added cell phone bluetooth capability to make it more convenient for the 90% of their customers who already carry one at all times and they aren't including a fob to save money. So I wouldn't be surprised if you could buy a fob from Tesla to use on your Model 3.
I am considering the current iPod Touch to operate the Model 3, assuming that works. It is an iOS device, runs the Tesla app, has Wi-Fi and Bluetooth 4.1. The base version costs $199 (32GB), likely cheaper than any optional fob that Tesla may eventually sell for the M3. You can get cases for it with belt clips. It also does other things, of course (photos, videos, music, Facetime over wi-fi, etc.). It's much smaller than the typical smart phone at 4.86" x 2.31" x 0.24" thick. 4" screen.
I want something that will pop the frunk from outside the car; the NFC card will not do that.
I want something that will pop the frunk from outside the car; the NFC card will not do that.
I think you are missing that Tesla hasn't released any details on how the system will work. Hotels that have implemented a phone key using BT still require an active Internet connection to verify that you are still authorized before unlocking the door/parking garage gate. I would think that Tesla will do the same thing, otherwise if someone steals your phone you have no way to stop them from stealing your car other than a remote phone wipe, assuming that they haven't pulled the SIM already.
So don't just assume that you can use a phone without an Internet connection to start/control your Model 3.
Wow, I just realized if somebody steals my car keys I have no way to prevent them from stealing my car!
With a hotel the point of requiring an internet connection is to disable your ability to unlock the door when you check out, not to protect against somebody stealing the phone. Also, I'll just point out that disabling the ability for the phone to unlock the car has nothing to do with wiping the phone or somebody removing the SIM, it's the car you need to contact to not allow the phone to unlock it. Not that Tesla will probably have such a feature, but it's something you couldn't do with a traditional key.
The phone doesn't need the Internet connection. The car already has one.
The "paired" phone's will likely be listed on your MyTesla page, and you'll be able to de-activate them as needed. Tesla will then send this information to the car.
This system will also work seamlessly for a future ride-sharer, who's credentials are sent by Tesla to a certain vehicle, which grants them temporary access.
