Model 3 slow charging

[MDJ101]

Hi All

I’ve recently taken delivery of a long range Model 3 (‘21) after backing an e-tron (that’s a whole other story)

Tonight was the first time I’d taken it along to the local dealer who has a bank of fast-chargers (250kw) I was the only person there.

I plugged in the car and the most it got to was about 63kw

Any ideas why?

 

[run-the-joules]

Hi All

I’ve recently taken delivery of a long range Model 3 (‘21) after backing an e-tron (that’s a whole other story)

Tonight was the first time I’d taken it along to the local dealer who has a bank of fast-chargers (250kw) I was the only person there.

I plugged in the car and the most it got to was about 63kw

Any ideas why?

To max out the speed you need:

1. a hot battery
2. A battery with a low state of charge

 

[Zoomit]

To max out the speed you need:

1. a hot battery
2. A battery with a low state of charge

Indeed, see also these threads:

Supercharging not up to hype?

2021 LR not getting 250 kw at V3?

Supercharger Charging Speed SLOW

 

[MDJ101]

OK, how long does pre-conditioning the battery take? It was doing this on the way to the dealer (about 10 minutes drive) and charge was about 20%

 

[run-the-joules]

OK, how long does pre-conditioning the battery take? It was doing this on the way to the dealer (about 10 minutes drive) and charge was about 20%

In winter, in the UK? Without knowing what the weather was like there the last few days, probably 45 minutes of moderately quick driving if the car was parked for days and it's 5-10C out.

even so, my car starts dropping down from 250kW at around the 20% mark.

 

[jjrandorin]

OK, how long does pre-conditioning the battery take? It was doing this on the way to the dealer (about 10 minutes drive) and charge was about 20%

10 minutes likely isnt enough to warm up the battery sufficiently for max supercharging rate. When I drive into the office, its 40 miles each way. My car is parked in a enclosed, drywalled garage, and I live in southern california. The garage is never at any point colder than about 50 degrees inside.

When I get in the car to drive the 40 miles 1 way to work, I have regen dots showing my battery can not accept full regen even though its only 90% full. The dots do not go away until I have driven approximately 25 ish miles or so, at freeway speeds of 75-85 MPH (meaning the battery takes that long to get warm enough for the regen dots to go away).

The root of the question is likely "is this normal, or is there something wrong with my car" and without a lot more data it sounds very normal.

 

[Zoomit]

The preconception of many new EV owners is that the battery heats up at a similar rate as an internal combustion engine.

It does not, for two simple reasons: 1) the battery is more than 5 times more massive than an engine and 2) the energy going into heating the battery is much much less than that available to heat an engine.

 

[JCtx]

Hey guys, a related question: How do you know what's the kW rating of a supercharger??? I've read about V1, V2, and V3, but no idea what is that, and how to tell. I also read most superchargers are 150kW or 75, depending if 1 or 2 cars are charging at the same time (A and B). Are those V2s? And how can you tell before hooking the car up, and seeing the rate of charge on the screen? Thank you.
JC

 

[WarpedOne]

>> How do you know what's the kW rating of a supercharger???

You do not care, they are all Good Enough.

>> I've read about V1, V2, and V3, but no idea what is that, and how to tell.

You can read what is written on the cabinets.

>> I also read most superchargers are 150kW or 75, depending if 1 or 2 cars are charging at the same time (A and B).

V1 and V2 have two cables per cabinet. If one cable is free, the other gets full power.

>> And how can you tell before hooking the car up, and seeing the rate of charge on the screen?

You use SC if you need it.
If you need it, what difference does it make?
If you don't need it, what difference does it make?

Batteries in winter seldomly reach temperature that enable full charging power >200kW as their temperatures needs to be above 320 Kelvins.
It takes about 2 kWh of energy for battery to heat up to required temps up from freezing.
That is 4% SR-SOC or 3% LR-SOC ignoring losses due to cold outside air.
It would be plain stupid if car actively used energy just to heat up the battery. It would also take about an hour to do so.
"Preconditioning for supercharging" thus only reduces/elimintaes battery cooling allowing battery temperature to rise a bit (faster).
I suspect it doesn't really do anything in cold conditions as there is no need for cooling anyway.

 

[Marius A]

OK, how long does pre-conditioning the battery take? It was doing this on the way to the dealer (about 10 minutes drive) and charge was about 20%

Currently there's a shortcoming in the heat pump programming, so it will drain too much heat from the battery, making it almost impossible to precondition properly in the winter as long as the heater is on.
That said, preconditioning for 250kW would probably take something like 40+ minutes, and the state of charge would need to be below 20%

With EVs it's almost always "the best possible number" for all stats. Range, charging, performance, etc, so it's no wonder people have too high expectations.
It's the same with ICE vehicles, but they've been around so long that when you see "2.5 litres per 100 kilometers" everyone knows those are optimistic numbers.
EVs are still semi-new so people aren't used to that mental correction yet. "500bhp" probably means above 80 or even 90% SoC. 580km rated range is 100% charge and no spirited driving. 250kW charging is optimal temperature and low SoC.

 

[Gasaraki]

Hey guys, a related question: How do you know what's the kW rating of a supercharger??? I've read about V1, V2, and V3, but no idea what is that, and how to tell. I also read most superchargers are 150kW or 75, depending if 1 or 2 cars are charging at the same time (A and B). Are those V2s? And how can you tell before hooking the car up, and seeing the rate of charge on the screen? Thank you.
JC

V1 - 120KW (Shared between 1A and 2A, etc)
V2 - 150KW (Shared between 1A and 1B, etc)
V3 - 250KW (Not Shared)

You can see that on your map in the car.

 

[M3 203XXX]

When traveling with multiple Tesla Superchargers on your route, select the highest KW (Version) for the fastest charge.
Since charging rate diminishes as battery is charged, don't go out of your way to find higher versions. It is fun to watch charging speeds near 900 miles per hour, but not worth a diversion.

 

[GtiMart]

Note that even when there are no regen dots, the battery is still not hot enough for max supercharging. Dots disappear when the battery reaches around 21 C. Supercharging fast will need a 40-50C battery.

 

[MDJ101]

Thanks for the info. Coming from an e-tron you just plugged it in and got 120kw straight away! Didn’t matter how hot or cold it was or how much charge there was. Tesla are obv. A lot more tech savvy

 

[stopcrazypp]

Thanks for the info. Coming from an e-tron you just plugged it in and got 120kw straight away! Didn’t matter how hot or cold it was or how much charge there was. Tesla are obv. A lot more tech savvy

I don't believe that's true of the E-tron either, 78 kW in the cold:

 

[JulienW]

Hey guys, a related question: How do you know what's the kW rating of a supercharger??? I've read about V1, V2, and V3, but no idea what is that, and how to tell. I also read most superchargers are 150kW or 75, depending if 1 or 2 cars are charging at the same time (A and B). Are those V2s? And how can you tell before hooking the car up, and seeing the rate of charge on the screen? Thank you.
JC

V3s are easy to identify. They don't have a Number/Letter circled near the bottom of the pedestal.



V3

V1 or V2

 

[iamnid]

Let's not forget the Urban Superchargers which provide up to 72kW (but don't have to share with any other units around them). They look like this:

 

[Gasaraki]

Thanks for the info. Coming from an e-tron you just plugged it in and got 120kw straight away! Didn’t matter how hot or cold it was or how much charge there was. Tesla are obv. A lot more tech savvy

Totally not true. Stop spreading lies.

 

[drtimhill]

Hey guys, a related question: How do you know what's the kW rating of a supercharger??? I've read about V1, V2, and V3, but no idea what is that, and how to tell. I also read most superchargers are 150kW or 75, depending if 1 or 2 cars are charging at the same time (A and B). Are those V2s? And how can you tell before hooking the car up, and seeing the rate of charge on the screen? Thank you.
JC

You really dont need to know, they aren’t that much different in real world charge times .. however, you can find out in the car by locating a supercharger and tapping on it. The screen shows details including charge rate.

 

[Cybr.Myk]

I picked up my 2021 an 800km drive from me in -20 degree weather and I had to supercharge twice. I plugged the super chargers into the nav and it automatically started preconditioning about 30 - 40 minutes from the destination. I was surprised it was that early but it did it at that time before both superchargers.