New M3P vs.Used P85D+

[Sappy02]

Hello,

Currently a Model X owner. Wanted to see what you guys thought if you had an option to get the new M3 Performance or a used P85D+ as follows:

M3 P

• Performance drive with Enhanced Autopilot
• Ordered before performance upgrade was included (hence may be able to get a $5,000 break there) (I don't care for the 20" wheels or any of the other features in that upgrade)
• Price after the federal tax credit comes to $56,500
• Free supercharging for first 6 months; and 400 kwh in credits annually

MS P85D+

• Ludicrous mode with First Gen Autopilot
• 2014/2015 model year
• Priced similarly to the M3 P (slightly higher)
• Unlimited supercharging
• No $7,500 federal tax credit

With year-end right around the corner, your input is very helpful.

Thank you so much.

 

[whatthe2]

I've only owned a M3P (non-PUP), so I may be biased. I drove the S and waited for the 3 because I like the size of it better. I'm also a fan of having newer technology, so I'd go with M3P.

 

[Tifighter]

Agreed about the potential bias, but I also considered a 15-16 P90D as well before going P3D. Ultimately, you have to drive them both as they drive noticeably differently, IMO. Tech has changed as well. Two very nice options, in any case.

 

[Camera-Cruiser]

I have M3P+ and have driven the P85+, but not the D. The P85+, while bigger, heavier hits harder all the time. I miss that in the 3, I still like the 3, but am always tempted by P85+ and the D model.

The 3 is refined and quick, while the P85 is brutally quick. I just want a bit more of a brute out of my 3.

 

[ba2002]

I would take a facelift 90d/100d with SAS over a p3d.

I would take a nosecone p90d with SAS over a p3d if price was reasonable.

I would take a p3d over used model S on coils.

I don't know if p85s had air suspension option?

 

[nexusone]

I tried to talk myself into a m3 before buying a mS this year. Just couldn't do it. The interior bugs me. The looks of the outside bug me. I hate the weird trunk/hatch configuration. Everything just feels kind of wrong, while the mS gets a lot of things right.

Both share the same crappy build quality and poor quality control. You'll get a better-built car with tighter tolerances in a 30k toyota.

Both have exceptional powertrains and offer enjoyable driving experiences.

 

[Lifeinabox]

Hello,

Currently a Model X owner. Wanted to see what you guys thought if you had an option to get the new M3 Performance or a used P85D+ as follows:

M3 P

• Performance drive with Enhanced Autopilot
• Ordered before performance upgrade was included (hence may be able to get a $5,000 break there) (I don't care for the 20" wheels or any of the other features in that upgrade)
• Price after the federal tax credit comes to $56,500
• Free supercharging for first 6 months; and 400 kwh in credits annually

MS P85D+

• Ludicrous mode with First Gen Autopilot
• 2014/2015 model year
• Priced similarly to the M3 P (slightly higher)
• Unlimited supercharging
• No $7,500 federal tax credit

With year-end right around the corner, your input is very helpful.

Thank you so much.

M3P with EAP is $61,500 after the tax credit. I'd add 6 year (assuming you add ESA) vs 4 year warranty.

I grappled with the same decision. The big negative with the P85D is Tesla's unreliable used car sales process.

 

[whatthe2]

I tried to talk myself into a m3 before buying a mS this year. Just couldn't do it. The interior bugs me. The looks of the outside bug me. I hate the weird trunk/hatch configuration. Everything just feels kind of wrong, while the mS gets a lot of things right.

Both share the same crappy build quality and poor quality control. You'll get a better-built car with tighter tolerances in a 30k toyota.

Both have exceptional powertrains and offer enjoyable driving experiences.

Looks and configuration are certainly a personal opinion. But the build quality on my M3P (vin 105xxx) is great! I guess that could be subjective as well, but consider me 100% satisfied.

 

[Glamisduner]

The downsides are to a used S
Old body style on the S (Still looks better than the 3 though).
Used so there will be wear on things (you don't just lose out on the tax credit)
Less warranty
noticeably less range
noticeably less efficient
Gen 1 Autopilot struggles to work at all on my commute in places where Gen 2 works intermittently. Also has less features, less situational awareness.
No Dash Cam either.
Slow Center Screen (but larger).
Headlights are much worse.
Old Gen Seats
Bulky Dash
AC System does not work as well
Need to carry a Key-Fob
Heavier Handling
Older Battery Chemistry

Positives:
More luxury feel to it.
Better door handles
More Cargo space
Auto Open/Close Trunk in an option.
Faster in ludicrous mode (what is it's spec without? Because most of the time you won't have it enabled).
Looks better.
Easy Access To Windshield wipers.

I drove around a 2014 85D loaner for a while, the screen is noticeably slower, and less quality. It has issues with red tones but maybe it was defective or worn out. It was a nice car over all and felt better quality than the 3, but it was like driving a boat in comparison.

 

[Sappy02]

I have M3P+ and have driven the P85+, but not the D. The P85+, while bigger, heavier hits harder all the time. I miss that in the 3, I still like the 3, but am always tempted by P85+ and the D model.

The 3 is refined and quick, while the P85 is brutally quick. I just want a bit more of a brute out of my 3.

Yes, it’s the quickness of the P85+ that’s tipping me over to that car and also the cabin roominess and trunk space.

 

[whatthe2]

Yes, it’s the quickness of the P85+ that’s tipping me over to that car and also the cabin roominess and trunk space.

That's definitely a minus to the 3. Good trunk space, but the access to it - not so great. I tried to put a box in there (24" I believe) and it would have fit just fine, but couldn't get it through the opening. I had to put it in the back seat.

 

[Sappy02]

I would take a facelift 90d/100d with SAS over a p3d.

I would take a nosecone p90d with SAS over a p3d if price was reasonable.

I would take a p3d over used model S on coils.

I don't know if p85s had air suspension option?

Sadly, I have not seen one used 90d/100d that would be cheaper than the p3d.

I agree with your second statement if the price would be at least about the same.

When you say coils I assume you are talking about the older p85 that don’t come with SAS. Correct?

Good question. If they do exist, they seem to be pretty rare.

 

[Sappy02]

M3P with EAP is $61,500 after the tax credit. I'd add 6 year (assuming you add ESA) vs 4 year warranty.

I grappled with the same decision. The big negative with the P85D is Tesla's unreliable used car sales process.

In my calc, I assumed Tesla would knock off the $5,000 for PUP, bringing us down to $56,500. So you would add the warranty on the car? That’s something I haven’t explored in detail. On a car like P3D that is deemed reliable would you plunk down that cash for the peace of mind?

I know nothing about Tesla’s used car sales process so any additional thoughts/resources would be very helpful.

 

[Sappy02]

I tried to talk myself into a m3 before buying a mS this year. Just couldn't do it. The interior bugs me. The looks of the outside bug me. I hate the weird trunk/hatch configuration. Everything just feels kind of wrong, while the mS gets a lot of things right.

Both share the same crappy build quality and poor quality control. You'll get a better-built car with tighter tolerances in a 30k toyota.

Both have exceptional powertrains and offer enjoyable driving experiences.

Sounds like you are enjoying the MS quite a bit more. What are the specs on your car and what ultimately made you go with the S vs. the 3?

 

[Lifeinabox]

In my calc, I assumed Tesla would knock off the $5,000 for PUP, bringing us down to $56,500. So you would add the warranty on the car? That’s something I haven’t explored in detail. On a car like P3D that is deemed reliable would you plunk down that cash for the peace of mind?

I know nothing about Tesla’s used car sales process so any additional thoughts/resources would be very helpful.

The PUP "discount" is already included in the current price. You don't get an extra $5k. Given that no one has ever owned a Model 3 out of warranty, I'd want peace of mind. Maybe not buy it right away but it's good to have the option as the original warrantly expires. You don't have that option with a used S unless you buy from a private party and the original owner extends.

 

[Sappy02]

The PUP "discount" is already included in the current price. You don't get an extra $5k. Given that no one has ever owned a Model 3 out of warranty, I'd want peace of mind. Maybe not buy it right away but it's good to have the option as the original warrantly expires. You don't have that option with a used S unless you buy from a private party and the original owner extends.

Yes I see your point on the warranty. If I do get the P3D, I would definitely consider getting it.

The price I paid for the car is the same as current price which includes the PUP. So essentially now for the same price I could get a “better” car since the PUP is included vs. what was available at the time I ordered mine. Using that logic there may be room for negotiating there.

 

[whatthe2]

Yes I see your point on the warranty. If I do get the P3D, I would definitely consider getting it.

The price I paid for the car is the same as current price which includes the PUP. So essentially now for the same price I could get a “better” car since the PUP is included vs. what was available at the time I ordered mine. Using that logic there may be room for negotiating there.

Not sure there is room for negotiating since that is the price they are selling it for now, and is the fair price. But certainly worth asking.

 

[Gavyne]

If you require larger cabin and trunk space, including the hatchback trunk style, then P85D. It'll simply work better if you have a large family. Also if you travel a lot, and I mean a lot, then unlimited Supercharging is very nice.

Otherwise, Performance Model 3 all the way. A smaller car just feels more fun, more agile and sporty feeling. Model 3 tech is also better, you don't want to get stuck with the old AP. Getting P3D will make you future proof when new hardware is ready.

 

[Sappy02]

If you require larger cabin and trunk space, including the hatchback trunk style, then P85D. It'll simply work better if you have a large family. Also if you travel a lot, and I mean a lot, then unlimited Supercharging is very nice.

Otherwise, Performance Model 3 all the way. A smaller car just feels more fun, more agile and sporty feeling. Model 3 tech is also better, you don't want to get stuck with the old AP. Getting P3D will make you future proof when new hardware is ready.

Thank you for that. I currently don’t have an option to charge at my home so supercharging will be the daily routine

Setting the autopilot technology aside, I like the automation on the MS with the hatchback and the door handles.

Do you have the 3? If so, did you get the ESD as well?

 

[whatthe2]

Thank you for that. I currently don’t have an option to charge at my home so supercharging will be the daily routine

Setting the autopilot technology aside, I like the automation on the MS with the hatchback and the door handles.

Do you have the 3? If so, did you get the ESD as well?

Regarding the AP HW, if you buy FSD on the 3 (assuming they still let you since they don’t offer it any longer unless special request), you get the new HW when they introduce AP3. However, on the 3 you still have better HW (AP2.5) instead of AP1. Just pointing that out.