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Northern California PW installs BUMPED to 2020!!
- Thread starter who177e
- Start date
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
Just to help clarify the process a bit from my experience:
Once Tesla gets the work done and passes the building department inspection, the team that deals with the interconnect agreement application steps in. They take all the materials and prepare the utility application. In my case that took less than a week. They will then email you an electronic form to sign. This way you know it's been done. After signing I got a completed email within an hour. The next day I got an email from my utility (PG&E) stating that the interconnect application was accepted and in process. This happened yesterday so I am just waiting for my PTO.
Once Tesla gets the work done and passes the building department inspection, the team that deals with the interconnect agreement application steps in. They take all the materials and prepare the utility application. In my case that took less than a week. They will then email you an electronic form to sign. This way you know it's been done. After signing I got a completed email within an hour. The next day I got an email from my utility (PG&E) stating that the interconnect application was accepted and in process. This happened yesterday so I am just waiting for my PTO.
This process flow might depend on the energy rep you have, though. In my case, my rep emailed me that new interconnect agreement form a month before my install date. When asked, he said it was to "ensure he had all the paperwork in hand ready to submit when the job was complete".
I had to get him to send it to me again, because he had changed my billing to monthly on the version he had sent me. I didnt esign that one and had him send it to me again. All this took place in november, and my install was Jan 6th. I called yesterday to "check on the submittal for the supplemental interconnect" (like @miimura says, sometimes you have to gently prod them) and he told me "oh I will get it submitted today, I just had not had a chance to do it yet. It was only a couple days after my inspection so no biggie but.. just saying that the process flow can be slightly different as far as that electronic interconnect agreeement signing is concerned.
charlesj
Active Member
The SolarEdge inverted does not seem to be provisioned so getting no solar. They are coming next week to finish up a panel update. I’ve read mixed things about the inverter provisioning being tied to getting the PGE ok. Is that the case?
charlesj
Active Member
I don't know but why would that be. PG&E doesn't turn anything on or off. They don't have access to the gateway or other hardware except the meter outside.
And, if that is a net meter, nothing you do should affect it.
the inverter is just flashing the green light. I connected to it with the SolarEdge SetApp and it says inverter was not activated. The little solarcity gateway they gave me also says no signal.
It should get sorted out next week. I’m eager to get generating!
The inverter was not setup, this got fixed a few weeks ago and it's working well now.
Well just heard from my husband about where we stood for a March install (1/4/20 order) and apparently we are now being scheduled for a two-part install. Solar first, so we can take advantage of the Summer sun on our energy bill, and then the PW portion in the Fall. Assume these will be done in date order of customer orders placed. Apparently not enough installers trained for the PW portion given the demand in the PG&E safety shut off area. Again, Tesla customer overload due to popularity of product (such a problem to have). Who knows maybe by the time Fall rolls round PW3 and a new Gateway will be out 
and we'll see what happens during Battery Day. I suspect the lack of installers for the PW is why the Tesla Energy website was changed recently de-coupling the combo installation package; well educated guess here anyway.
I know wildfires in the past have started here in California during the summer months so it does make me nervous about that unknown. Plus it already looks like we are going into a drought situation here in Calif. Will probably not keep much in our refrig/freezer this summer just in case (threw out food after last safety shutdown). Can't say I'm not disappointed but the solar will be good to have during the hot summer months although our rate plan is off peak midnight to 4pm and no PW storage to draw from during the late afternoon/evening hours when we'll want A/C while at home and before going to sleep.
For another reference point, last week I drove into our neighborhood area and saw a Tesla Energy truck at a home and decided to stop by to say hi to the homeowner and see how installation goes. TE was there from at least 10:30 to after 5pm when I drove past later in the day. The owner invited me and my husband to stop by afterwards which we still have to do. The owner was having two PWs installed on an east wall opposite his garage area, ours will be inside since we have a west garage outer wall exposure with stucco walls and no overhead shading, so a bit different layout. Their development was built with solar panels on the roof already so his install was just the PW portion. He said his order was from October 2019.
and we'll see what happens during Battery Day. I suspect the lack of installers for the PW is why the Tesla Energy website was changed recently de-coupling the combo installation package; well educated guess here anyway.I know wildfires in the past have started here in California during the summer months so it does make me nervous about that unknown. Plus it already looks like we are going into a drought situation here in Calif. Will probably not keep much in our refrig/freezer this summer just in case (threw out food after last safety shutdown). Can't say I'm not disappointed but the solar will be good to have during the hot summer months although our rate plan is off peak midnight to 4pm and no PW storage to draw from during the late afternoon/evening hours when we'll want A/C while at home and before going to sleep.
For another reference point, last week I drove into our neighborhood area and saw a Tesla Energy truck at a home and decided to stop by to say hi to the homeowner and see how installation goes. TE was there from at least 10:30 to after 5pm when I drove past later in the day. The owner invited me and my husband to stop by afterwards which we still have to do. The owner was having two PWs installed on an east wall opposite his garage area, ours will be inside since we have a west garage outer wall exposure with stucco walls and no overhead shading, so a bit different layout. Their development was built with solar panels on the roof already so his install was just the PW portion. He said his order was from October 2019.
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aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
It's Tesla so don't assume this at all.
They seem to use a much larger algorithm but many of us suspect the ultimate answer is eventually financially driven.
See. I know many that ordered around the same time and have already been installed and some who ordered early and are still waiting.
Other factors:
- Trained and available staff in your area
- How easy the install will be (ie engineering, types of loads, panels etc)
- How easy it is to work with your building department
- Access to the site
Another little surprise today after getting some new documents to sign due to the solar/PW install being split so the solar can go forward now and PWs later in the Fall. When Energy was going over plans with our city, the City came back and said we needed to upgrade our main panel. We have 200a service. Home built in 2004 and the sticker on the main panel was no longer on the box. City check of developer plans that were filed indicated the manufacturer and product that was installed, and turns out the busbar was rated at 200 also. Over the years we had some additional additions to the circuit. Given the 120% rule we need to update the main panel box to a 200a with 225a busbar (believe that was the number) to safely install our PVs. Kind of a surprise but one that neither we nor Energy knew would happen given info we had at hand. Certainly don't want a fire. Signed for the new panel update and the permitting can now proceed. Scheduling should be contacting us for a date soon. Just illustrates that surprises to your install can happen. I think I've read some other people here have run into panel upgrades as well.
I was concerned that splitting the install into 2 parts would affect layout of the PWs and other equipment since not all the components would be on hand but was assured that when they come out for the solar the whole solar/PW system will be planned for at that time for positioning etc. so layout would be done as originally hoped for and nothing to be moved later.
I was concerned that splitting the install into 2 parts would affect layout of the PWs and other equipment since not all the components would be on hand but was assured that when they come out for the solar the whole solar/PW system will be planned for at that time for positioning etc. so layout would be done as originally hoped for and nothing to be moved later.
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charlesj
Active Member
This is interesting especially the 120% bit. How much upgrades in the past did you add?
I am puzzled though how adding solar and battery increases the need of the main panel.
My designer implicated something similar 120% and only could do 150A mains even though I have 2- 100A in there now.
Solar sends power to the house and excess to the grid now, later to batter or to the grid.
So, I just don't see the main buss ever getting close to that 200A or even that other 80% rule for brakers, loads calced to 80% of breaker.
160A at 240V is a huge amount of power, 38,400 Watts through that buss.
We've lived here for a while and over the years did some remodeling. Here's how I understand our situation (and I'm not electrically minded at all and still learning here). The main panel additions we made accounted for 130A--outdoor kitchen and dining pergola with heaters and a 50A circuit for our NEMA 14-50. Our oven and AC unit are also on it for another 90A. So right now with the 120% rule (200 x 1.2) we would have 20A "unused" (240 - 220). Not enough to add the solar (assuming the inverter). By upgrading to a 225 busbar (225 x 1.2), we would have 50A "unused". From what we understand this upgrade was acceptable for our City and PG&E without any extra work beyond the higher rated panel.
Here's an article from a Greentech/CivicSolar website that might help you along with info from a Q&A on service panel upgrade:
What is the Panelboard Sizing 120% Rule?
Do I need a service panel upgrade?
As far as understanding your situation, I'm sure someone more knowledgeable can help out.
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BTW we were also told we needed to upgrade from our 200A Center Fed panel to a 200A End Fed panel (with the larger capacity busbar). Here’s a video I found addressing that very issue:
Your Breaker Box and Solar - #29
so for Solar you apparently HAVE to have an End Fed panel. Looking at our panel now I can see we have the Center Fed version.
Your Breaker Box and Solar - #29
so for Solar you apparently HAVE to have an End Fed panel. Looking at our panel now I can see we have the Center Fed version.
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That changed starting with the 2017 National Electric Code, which California adopted on January 1 of this year (and calls the 2019 California Electric Code). Center fed panels are now eligible for the 120% rule.
Cheers, Wayne
That's not how the 120% rule works, the size of the loads don't matter. What matters is the size of the sources of power feeding the bus in the panel. For the utility, the size is the rating of the breaker. For inverters (like solar and battery), the size is typically also the rating of the breaker but may be a little less (details omitted).
So if you have a 200A bus with a 200A main breaker, you can back feed up to 40A of breakers of solar/battery. With a 225A bus with a 200A main breaker, you are up to 70A of allowable back feed. Or with a 200A bus and a 175A main breaker, you are at 65A.
Cheers, Wayne
Thanks. Guess I thought the loads would matter for installing solar like for any other power source you were adding like AC etc. I get that the Center fed panels are "out" for solar now but haven't really seen an explanation as to why. Can you explain what makes an End fed panel set up necessary over the Center fed? The guys in the video (Video #29 linked above in thread) don't really explain why this is...just that for a non-solar house Center fed is not a problem but it is for installing solar.
Not sure what you mean by "power source . . . like AC". If AC = Air Conditioning, that's not a power source, that's a load.
No, center fed panels used to be a problem for interconnecting solar, but they are now allowed. It changed with the 2017 NEC, which was adopted in California on January 1 this year. So you may have gotten stale information when you were told that the center fed panel is problem.
I could explain why they are a theoretical problem, but since they are no longer a code problem, I'll skip that for now.
Cheers, Wayne
