P3D+ compatible wheels

[Xenoilphobe]

Anybody know what the DOT wheel loads are for Flow One Wheels?

1. There are no government standards or regulations that require a wheel manufacturer or importer to meet in order to sell a wheel in the US. There are several marking and dimensional requirements that are required by the DOT (Dept. Of Transportation), but no performance or testing requirements.
2. The standards for performance and testing are voluntary on the part of the manufacturer or importer. There are several specifications that are considered recommended practice, available from such organizations as SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers), TUV (the German regulatory agency), ISO (International Standards Organization), and JWL (Japan Light Alloy Wheel Testing Council Rules). The SAE J2530 Aftermarket Wheel Performance Requirements and Test Procedures is a new standard developed for the aftermarket wheel industry to assure that the wheels produced for use on passenger cars and light trucks are safe and reliable.
3. The testing requirements of J2530 are composed of 3 performance tests.
   1. The first is a Dynamic Cornering Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load put on a wheel when the vehicle is turning a corner or going around a curve.
   2. The second is a Dynamic Radial Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load that the wheel experiences with a tire mounted and carrying the weight of the vehicle, passengers and or cargo.
   3. The third is an Impact Test. This is a test designed to test the effect on the wheel in the event of an impact to the wheel such as hitting a pot hole or side impact into a curb.
4. The quantity of wheels required to complete the testing are as follows:
   1. Cornering Fatigue = 2 up to 7
   2. Radial Fatigue = 2 up to 7
   3. Impact = 2
   The Cornering and Radial test sample quantities are calculated based on number of cycles and test load settings. In other words, the fewer test samples the greater number of cycles and the higher the test load or the tougher the test. In addition to the above, the tests are based on per style by size. For example, sizes 17×8 and 18×9 of the same style require a minimum of 6 test samples per size. Makes one wonder how or even if some of these “One Off” wheels are tested.
   
   
5. Marking requirements:
   The markings that are required by DOT are as follows;
   1. Wheel Load – this is the maximum load that the wheel is designed to carry. The wheel load is determined by taking 50% of the heaviest axle rating of the vehicle (GAWR – gross axle weight rating). Example; if your heaviest axle weight rating is 3000 lbs then your wheel load requirement would be 1500 lbs.
   2. Wheel size (example 15×8).
   3. Wheel manufactures name, trademark or symbol.
   4. Date of manufacture of the wheel, indicating month and year.
   5. Manufacturers part number or code.
   6. Country of manufacturer.
   7. The symbol “DOT” constituting a certification by the manufacturer of the rim that the rim complies with all applicable vehicle safety standards.
6. Here is a simple way to determine what a safe wheel load rating should be for your vehicle.
   1. The first thing to do is check to see if the vehicle has the original data plaque. Normally it can be found in the door jam or door on the driver’s side.
   2. If that isn’t available then use the following rule of thumb;
      Passenger cars (not including stretch limo’s) = 1400 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt patterns 5×4.50” & 5×4.75” = 1600 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt pattern 5×5.00” = 1900 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt patterns 5×5.50” & 6×5.50” = 2100 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – 8 lugs = 3400 lbs

 

[Shopmicrocode]

Square is recommended for best handling performance and you get to rotate all of your tires.

Staggered increases understeer and is not recommended.

I guess ill be getting a squared set then.

 

[N54TT]

The next question is. Should I get a staggered or square set? What about tire rotation etc? I was looking at 20x8.5 +30 and 20x10 +40 in the rear

Staggered will tend to cause more understeer at the limit than square with AWD cars...but this is something you would only notice on the track or auto-x. It’s perfectly fine to run staggered on an AWD car as long as the overall tire radius is the same. The other downside with staggered is that it limits your tire rotation pattern...can’t rotate front to back. Unless you have directional tires you can still rotate side to side and that shouldn’t be an issue. This being said...if you’re okay with those downsides and prefer the look of staggered...run staggered.

I’m still trying to decide. I prefer the look of staggered...with the only issue somewhat holding me back is the loss in efficiency with wider tires in the rear. I could run square but want my rear to be as flush as the front....which would require spacers or different offsets for the rear wheels. Don’t want to run spacers and if I get different offsets for rear (but same width as front)....would still limit my front/rear tire rotations.

Anybody know what the DOT wheel loads are for Flow One Wheels?

1. There are no government standards or regulations that require a wheel manufacturer or importer to meet in order to sell a wheel in the US. There are several marking and dimensional requirements that are required by the DOT (Dept. Of Transportation), but no performance or testing requirements.
2. The standards for performance and testing are voluntary on the part of the manufacturer or importer. There are several specifications that are considered recommended practice, available from such organizations as SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers), TUV (the German regulatory agency), ISO (International Standards Organization), and JWL (Japan Light Alloy Wheel Testing Council Rules). The SAE J2530 Aftermarket Wheel Performance Requirements and Test Procedures is a new standard developed for the aftermarket wheel industry to assure that the wheels produced for use on passenger cars and light trucks are safe and reliable.
3. The testing requirements of J2530 are composed of 3 performance tests.
   1. The first is a Dynamic Cornering Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load put on a wheel when the vehicle is turning a corner or going around a curve.
   2. The second is a Dynamic Radial Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load that the wheel experiences with a tire mounted and carrying the weight of the vehicle, passengers and or cargo.
   3. The third is an Impact Test. This is a test designed to test the effect on the wheel in the event of an impact to the wheel such as hitting a pot hole or side impact into a curb.
4. The quantity of wheels required to complete the testing are as follows:
   1. Cornering Fatigue = 2 up to 7
   2. Radial Fatigue = 2 up to 7
   3. Impact = 2
   The Cornering and Radial test sample quantities are calculated based on number of cycles and test load settings. In other words, the fewer test samples the greater number of cycles and the higher the test load or the tougher the test. In addition to the above, the tests are based on per style by size. For example, sizes 17×8 and 18×9 of the same style require a minimum of 6 test samples per size. Makes one wonder how or even if some of these “One Off” wheels are tested.
   
   
5. Marking requirements:
   The markings that are required by DOT are as follows;
   1. Wheel Load – this is the maximum load that the wheel is designed to carry. The wheel load is determined by taking 50% of the heaviest axle rating of the vehicle (GAWR – gross axle weight rating). Example; if your heaviest axle weight rating is 3000 lbs then your wheel load requirement would be 1500 lbs.
   2. Wheel size (example 15×8).
   3. Wheel manufactures name, trademark or symbol.
   4. Date of manufacture of the wheel, indicating month and year.
   5. Manufacturers part number or code.
   6. Country of manufacturer.
   7. The symbol “DOT” constituting a certification by the manufacturer of the rim that the rim complies with all applicable vehicle safety standards.
6. Here is a simple way to determine what a safe wheel load rating should be for your vehicle.
   1. The first thing to do is check to see if the vehicle has the original data plaque. Normally it can be found in the door jam or door on the driver’s side.
   2. If that isn’t available then use the following rule of thumb;
      Passenger cars (not including stretch limo’s) = 1400 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt patterns 5×4.50” & 5×4.75” = 1600 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt pattern 5×5.00” = 1900 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – bolt patterns 5×5.50” & 6×5.50” = 2100 lbs
      Pick Up trucks – 8 lugs = 3400 lbs

My 19” flow one f3’s Are stamped 690kg

 

[nalang]

Staggered will tend to cause more understeer at the limit than square with AWD cars...but this is something you would only notice on the track or auto-x. It’s perfectly fine to run staggered on an AWD car as long as the overall tire radius is the same. The other downside with staggered is that it limits your tire rotation pattern...can’t rotate front to back. Unless you have directional tires you can still rotate side to side and that shouldn’t be an issue. This being said...if you’re okay with those downsides and prefer the look of staggered...run staggered.

I’m still trying to decide. I prefer the look of staggered...with the only issue somewhat holding me back is the loss in efficiency with wider tires in the rear. I could run square but want my rear to be as flush as the front....which would require spacers or different offsets for the rear wheels. Don’t want to run spacers and if I get different offsets for rear (but same width as front)....would still limit my front/rear tire rotations.

This is exactly why I ultimately decided to go staggered instead of square. Square setup will still require rear spacers (which I personally do not prefer) to match the poke of the front wheels unless you change the rear offset which takes away your ability to rotate all four.

I’m running 20x9 +32 in front (245/35 tire) and 20x10.5 +45 on rears (285/30 tire). Tires are the same OD and I can rotate side to side. Im aware this may cause understeer when pushed hard but I’m hoping track mode will assist to decrease this if and when I track my car.

 

[TexasTeslaRacing]

I second orwell. Square setup has a lot more advantages than staggered.

 

[Shopmicrocode]

Would the car still need spacers if the rims are custom milled out for the P3D+'s rim hub? Or are spacers used to align the wheels? I'm new at this car stuff if you can't tell already.

 

[kbecks13]

Would the car still need spacers if the rims are custom milled out for the P3D+'s rim hub?

No, you would only need spacers at that point if you wanted to move the wheels to sit farther out for clearance reasons. Are you familiar with wheel offset? That is what changes with spacers

Offset Explained | WheelPros

 

[Shopmicrocode]

Nope, not familiar at all. So, the offset would be VERTINI VS01 20X8.5 +30 5X114.3 64.1 on the front and rear if I'm going with a squared setup. Is that going to cause any problems? I assume not because isn't that stock offset?

 

[kbecks13]

Nope, not familiar at all. So, the offset would be VERTINI VS01 20X8.5 +30 5X114.3 64.1 on the front and rear if I'm going with a squared setup. Is that going to cause any problems? I assume not because isn't that stock offset?

So that would be a +30 offset and the stock one is +35 (for the P3D+). This means that your wheels would sit 5mm further out (closer to the fender/away from suspension) compared to stock.

I don't think that would be a major problem, but it is different and means your handling will also change (see scrub radius). It would be best to get a +35 offset if you can, but +30 could work.

 

[Shopmicrocode]

I believe that offset was use because my initial setup was staggered. So, I guess revert to +35 to keep things as close to stock as possible? Or is there a better offset I should be getting?

 

[kbecks13]

I believe that offset was use because my initial setup was staggered. So, I guess revert to +35 to keep things as close to stock as possible? Or is there a better offset I should be getting?

If you're keeping the same width wheel, then you should basically have the same clearance needs as stock - meaning you shouldn't need to adjust offset. It's always a good idea to keep the same offset as factory so that your scrub radius and handing feel is as perfect as Tesla designed it to be.

If you went with wider wheels/tires, then you would probably want a lower offset (i.e +33 or +30) to get more suspension clearance, but you could also get a +35 and then use spacers to shift it out to artificially create a lower offset (only a few mm though).

 

[Shopmicrocode]

okay, that's what I will do. Just keep the +35 for stock offset since staggered seems to be more annoyance for what its worth for street driving. Thanks again.

 

[Oyinko]

Is a load rating of 94V(1477lbs per tire) without beeing XL rated enough for the Model 3 Performance PUP? I'm considering to buy the Michelin Premier 235/45 18 for my winter set.

 

[N54TT]

okay, that's what I will do. Just keep the +35 for stock offset since staggered seems to be more annoyance for what its worth for street driving. Thanks again.

I honestly doubt you’d feel a difference between a +30 or +35mm wheel on the street and probably not even on the track...unless you’re an avid weekend track person...and has played around with suspension setups before. Being a newb I would decide on what look you’re going for and go from there. Now if you were talking about crazy specs like +20 or something, are looking into becoming a weekend track junkie..that’s a different story. Than again you wouldn’t be looking at 20” wheels if this was going to be a track setup.
Can’t go wrong with oem specs...but after over 42 yrs of using aftermarket wheels on all my cars...if you can order a custom offset consider what look you’re going for...if ok with stock and don’t care about being a bit more flush...just stick with that.

 

[Shopmicrocode]

I just wanted a little better 0-60 and a different look, so that's why I first considered a staggered set. But, I guess I'm going to avoid that since it seems like more of a headache than a squared setup .

 

[stickman]

so for track use (and perhaps occasional street use) with no spacers and stock scrub radius etc, 19x9.5 35mm offset and 265/35/19 is where it's at?, as long as the vendor can machine them to accept the lip?

 

[SD_Engnr]

so for track use (and perhaps occasional street use) with no spacers and stock scrub radius etc, 19x9.5 35mm offset and 265/35/19 is where it's at?, as long as the vendor can machine them to accept the lip?

Yes. It's a great size to go with.
You can easily fit bigger tires in the rear, but you'll run into issues up front.

 

[TexasTeslaRacing]

so for track use (and perhaps occasional street use) with no spacers and stock scrub radius etc, 19x9.5 35mm offset and 265/35/19 is where it's at?, as long as the vendor can machine them to accept the lip?

That’s correct. Any wider and you’ll need 3mm spacer up front.

 

[stickman]

That’s correct. Any wider and you’ll need 3mm spacer up front.

Yes. It's a great size to go with.
You can easily fit bigger tires in the rear, but you'll run into issues up front.

Are either of you running lower ride height? I’m assuming this set up would work with a 1” drop. I’m planning on coil overs at some point

 

[SD_Engnr]

Are either of you running lower ride height? I’m assuming this set up would work with a 1” drop. I’m planning on coil overs at some point

Not yet, but yes, it works great.