Performance Model 3 Drag Race - 2021 vs 2018 - Is it Faster?

[AlanSubie4Life]

You can also increase power by lowering the battery's internal resistance. Voltage sags as the current draw goes up due to the internal resistance of the battery. No-load terminal voltage might be 400V, but place a 1200A draw on the battery and terminal voltage might sink to 300V, maybe lower with lower states of charge.

Lower the battery's internal resistance through different cell construction or different cell materials, and the voltage will sag less. The same 1200A draw might only sink voltage to 325V, which means an extra 30 kW of power output.

Yes. We don't know how the new denser battery behaves (maybe @MasterC17 could compare & log the CAN bus reported voltage under WOT to 60+mph between the two vehicles!). But there are reasons to believe (namely, because this is how other Panasonic lithium cells work) a denser, higher capacity battery would tend to increase internal resistance and reduce maximum output current for a given sag. They were probably careful in this case to make appropriate design optimizations to ensure that it didn't change much for this new cell, though (meaning, the cell is just "better," moving the capacity/performance envelope outwards).

 

[RefreshedP]

Great vid. Thank's for posting. Question regarding the rims on the 18 performance. Do you have a weight on that setup? I'm assuming 18s, how much of an advantage do you think they gave the 18 over the 20" that it came with?

 

[Marius A]

Apparently we're not going to avoid further discussion, lol.

Yeah, I went a bit off the rails after my "horse tranquilizers" wore off.
Not going to light the flame of semantics again.

One difference I noticed in my 2021 compared to my 2020 is that the available power (dots to the right) maxes out much faster, I'm assuming because of the heat pump.
It's not that cold here at the moment, 4 celsius, but that's low enough for my 2020 to not reach the visualized max output on my commute to work.
However, I've tested my 2021 3 days with the same temperature and it reaches max power halfway through my commute.
Definitely not very relevant for proper dragracing, but for daily driving in colder climate it means you get to use the full power of your TM3P more often without having to pre-heat the car.
That's a big win for me at least.

 

[MasterC17]

Great vid. Thank's for posting. Question regarding the rims on the 18 performance. Do you have a weight on that setup? I'm assuming 18s, how much of an advantage do you think they gave the 18 over the 20" that it came with?

The 18" Wheels + Tires I have on the 2018 weigh 47lbs, the 20" Wheels + Tires on the 2021 weigh 54lbs. The tires on the 2021 have substantially more grip and a larger tread patch (the 2018 has the factory MXM4's). That being said, I haven't noticed too much of a difference but 7lbs of unsprung weight is considerable.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The 18" Wheels + Tires I have on the 2018 weigh 47lbs, the 20" Wheels + Tires on the 2021 weigh 54lbs. The tires on the 2021 have substantially more grip and a larger tread patch (the 2018 has the factory MXM4's). That being said, I haven't noticed too much of a difference but 7lbs of unsprung weight is considerable.

Would it be possible to do a test like the one in the OP, with both vehicles at 20% SoC? There's a claim that (currently) the performance is limited with the new denser battery in the 2021 Performance. But there has been no documentation/instrumentation of this claim. Obviously, there is a lot less power available in both vehicles at 20% SoC; that's a given - but is there a difference between the two?

The Performance 2021 is claimed to be very slow at low SoC.

I wouldn't be surprised at all by an even lower cap on discharge rate at low SoC for the new battery, for the time being (there's no reason for Tesla not to impose such a safety limit for now). But curious if it is actually happening.

 

[Marius A]

Would it be possible to do a test like the one in the OP, with both vehicles at 20% SoC? There's a claim that (currently) the performance is limited with the new denser battery in the 2021 Performance. But there has been no documentation/instrumentation of this claim. Obviously, there is a lot less power available in both vehicles at 20% SoC; that's a given - but is there a difference between the two?

The Performance 2021 is claimed to be very slow at low SoC.

I wouldn't be surprised at all by an even lower cap on discharge rate at low SoC for the new battery, for the time being (there's no reason for Tesla not to impose such a safety limit for now). But curious if it is actually happening.

On my car it happens at around 200km rated range. I had a 2020 TM3P and it was nothing like this.
Could be fleet-wide with the newest updates, I don't have the old car so I can't compare

 

[MasterC17]

Would it be possible to do a test like the one in the OP, with both vehicles at 20% SoC? There's a claim that (currently) the performance is limited with the new denser battery in the 2021 Performance. But there has been no documentation/instrumentation of this claim. Obviously, there is a lot less power available in both vehicles at 20% SoC; that's a given - but is there a difference between the two?

The Performance 2021 is claimed to be very slow at low SoC.

I wouldn't be surprised at all by an even lower cap on discharge rate at low SoC for the new battery, for the time being (there's no reason for Tesla not to impose such a safety limit for now). But curious if it is actually happening.

I can do that in the next few weeks. Will test and let you know.

 

[Kristoffer Helle]

We have problems with EU models.
2021 is slow as f...
Even with hot battery.
Several cars can't even retain speed limit when getting under 20% soc.
It's not a temp problem. As some stupid Norwegian YouTubers think..

 

[Devils son]

We have problems with EU models.
2021 is slow as f...
Even with hot battery.
Several cars can't even retain speed limit when getting under 20% soc.
It's not a temp problem. As some stupid Norwegian YouTubers think..

Isn’t it the same battery as the US version? So why would this only affect the EU version?

 

[RefreshedP]

Would it be possible to do a test like the one in the OP, with both vehicles at 20% SoC? There's a claim that (currently) the performance is limited with the new denser battery in the 2021 Performance. But there has been no documentation/instrumentation of this claim. Obviously, there is a lot less power available in both vehicles at 20% SoC; that's a given - but is there a difference between the two?

The Performance 2021 is claimed to be very slow at low SoC.

I wouldn't be surprised at all by an even lower cap on discharge rate at low SoC for the new battery, for the time being (there's no reason for Tesla not to impose such a safety limit for now). But curious if it is actually happening.

Although no scientific data besides my ass, I can attest, when my 2021 is below 70% SOC, it feels like a dog. 90% and above its a monster. never been in previous performance so cant tell. Even my son comments "is that all it has now?"

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Although no scientific data besides my ass, I can attest, when my 2021 is below 70% SOC, it feels like a dog. 90% and above its a monster. never been in previous performance so cant tell. Even my son comments "is that all it has now?"

Even in prior years it makes a difference. I would not be surprised if the 2021 is even worse at low SoC (for now). But we would need to test it side by side to demonstrate it!

 

[Devils son]

Although no scientific data besides my ass, I can attest, when my 2021 is below 70% SOC, it feels like a dog. 90% and above its a monster. never been in previous performance so cant tell. Even my son comments "is that all it has now?"

With very low soc, I also feel that my car is slower. But at 70%? Not really.

Sure, it will no doubt perform better at above 80%, but that has always been the case.

 

[Candleflame]

Although no scientific data besides my ass, I can attest, when my 2021 is below 70% SOC, it feels like a dog. 90% and above its a monster. never been in previous performance so cant tell. Even my son comments "is that all it has now?"

Dunno my stealth performance 2019 feels like a beast even <10%. SOC. I usually put it in chill mode below 20% though.

50-60% feels the same as 90% for me imho.

 

[Marius A]

Dunno my stealth performance 2019 feels like a beast even <10%. SOC. I usually put it in chill mode below 20% though.

50-60% feels the same as 90% for me imho.

It's completely different rom my 2020P, that one was beast mode all day, 2021 goes limp mode at ~35% rated range

 

[LP99]

It's completely different rom my 2020P, that one was beast mode all day, 2021 goes limp mode at ~35% rated range

Is it the same with track mode?

 

[Marius A]

Is it the same with track mode?

Don't know, I'll check next time it's low, but I usually top off before it hits 50%

 

[Kristoffer Helle]

Under 80%. It's really slow.
Std long range is faster.
It's some kind of SW problem.
Tesla sais it has 1. Priority to find the problem.

 

[OzBMR]

OP thanks for the thread and I appreciate the detailed analysis and video.

I have a 2021 M3P here in Australia and have only done one Dragy data run so far, recording 0 - 100 km/h in 3.48s (3.27s with 1ft rollout) and 100 - 150 km/h in 3.57s. This was with 80% SOC and ambient temperature of 28 C (82 F) No valid 1/8th mile recorded yet.

 

[Devils son]

Under 80%. It's really slow.
Std long range is faster.
It's some kind of SW problem.
Tesla sais it has 1. Priority to find the problem.

Tested this morning at 26% soc. Road was damp, just after I left the house.

0-100 km/u in 4.4 seconds.

So no, the 2021 M3P isn’t slower than the M3LR under 80% soc.

BTW: outside temp was 2 degrees celcius.

 

[Sam1]

Would it be possible to do a test like the one in the OP, with both vehicles at 20% SoC? There's a claim that (currently) the performance is limited with the new denser battery in the 2021 Performance. But there has been no documentation/instrumentation of this claim. Obviously, there is a lot less power available in both vehicles at 20% SoC; that's a given - but is there a difference between the two?

The Performance 2021 is claimed to be very slow at low SoC.

I wouldn't be surprised at all by an even lower cap on discharge rate at low SoC for the new battery, for the time being (there's no reason for Tesla not to impose such a safety limit for now). But curious if it is actually happening.

they may be talking about the same issue I noticed in my 2019. After an update, Tesla seems to have implemented a speed sensitive nerfing when my battery is under 20%. Like you launch it, it takes off out of the hole like normal, then it falls on its face around 40ish mph like you’re running under 10% battery and the car limits power like it’s in chill mode. And anything above 45ish, always feels like the car is in chill mode.

Haven’t had a chance to get data logs of it occurring yet, but will shortly

<edit> here’s my thread about it from a week ago:

Speed sensitive power nerfing @ lower SOC after last update

so it’s definitely not limited to the 2021 models