Plaid Vibration around 38-42MPH....

[n2mb_racing]

That's just because the shaking of the shafts transfers to every single suspension component including the steering rack. That said, if the vibration is from out of balance shafts the vibration won't be as bad as if the source of the vibration are bent CV splines causing a constant differential in rotational velocity between the cv halves which will translate directly to the steering rack.

I don't really understand how the shafts would initially be balanced and then go out of balance after 1k miles. Maybe there's a balance weight that's falling off?

 

[lbowroom]

I don't really understand how the shafts would initially be balanced and then go out of balance after 1k miles. Maybe there's a balance weight that's falling off?

I think you're closer with the idea of play in the CV joint which can vibrate when unloaded but locks up under load. Are you familiar with a Ducati dry clutch where the "splines" rattle when unloaded but not when engaged?

 

[n2mb_racing]

I think you're closer with the idea of play in the CV joint which can vibrate when unloaded but locks up under load. Are you familiar with a Ducati dry clutch where the "splines" rattle when unloaded but not when engaged?

No.

Another idea. We could jack up one front wheel and try to turn the tire by hand with the opposite tire on the ground. You should be able to feel and perhaps measure how much play there is in the driveshafts before the motor starts turning. We could compare between someone that has the vibration vs someone that doesn't.

 

[lbowroom]

No.

Another idea. We could jack up one front wheel and try to turn the tire by hand with the opposite tire on the ground. You should be able to feel and perhaps measure how much play there is in the driveshafts before the motor starts turning. We could compare between someone that has the vibration vs someone that doesn't.

No, you aren't familiar with Ducati dry clutches, or no, you think I'm completely wrong?

 

[sorka]

I don't really understand how the shafts would initially be balanced and then go out of balance after 1k miles. Maybe there's a balance weight that's falling off?

They'd only go out of balance from being bent. Imagine cv joint damage occurs due to too much torque when angle is beyond design limits. Several adjacent ball channels get distorted resulting in freeplay. Now when monster torque is applied, one of the halves ends up being pushed unevenly on edge which results in just a slight bowing of the shaft during monster torque. The bowing is amplified dramatically as the rotation speed hits the sympathetic frequency of the length of the shaft and now you have an oscillation that is growing with positive feedback. If it goes far enough, you get slightly permanently bent shaft.

At this point, you're going to get a slight vibration in the speed range that corresponds to that sympathetic frequency even at constant speed.

You could also have a constant vibration at constant speed with bent cv ball channels.

 

[n2mb_racing]

No, you aren't familiar with Ducati dry clutches, or no, you think I'm completely wrong?

Oh sorry, I wasn't clear enough. I don't know about ducati dry clutches.

 

[n2mb_racing]

They'd only go out of balance from being bent. Imagine cv joint damage occurs due to too much torque when angle is beyond design limits. Several adjacent ball channels get distorted resulting in freeplay. Now when monster torque is applied, one of the halves ends up being pushed unevenly on edge which results in just a slight bowing of the shaft during monster torque. The bowing is amplified dramatically as the rotation speed hits the sympathetic frequency of the length of the shaft and now you have an oscillation that is growing with positive feedback. If it goes far enough, you get slightly permanently bent shaft.

At this point, you're going to get a slight vibration in the speed range that corresponds to that sympathetic frequency even at constant speed.

You could also have a constant vibration at constant speed with bent cv ball channels.

I could see that... Though, if they are bent and the vibration goes away by reducing the angle, that would be interesting too.

 

[jebinc]

Data collection poll

Refreshed Model S and Plaid Vibration demographics

Your input is needed for a ongoing vibration experiment discussed here. https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/6455160/

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[mswlogo]

It's not a harmonic issue. I can feel the vibration in the pedal and the yoke.

Anything that vibrates due to a harmonic type issue can cause harmonic vibrations anywhere.

In fact your comments indicates more than it is than isn’t.

Let’s say you slightly accelerate. Motor turns up the torque. Slightly. That doesn’t immediately translate to the pavement. Some “energy” gets stored in the motor mounts, suspension, tires etc.

The motor senses it reached it’s desired torque. But it has not actually reached the pavement yet. But that stored energy is now releasing from motor mounts, drive shafts, suspension into the pavement. Now the car is moving faster than it wants and lowers the torque (slightly over corrects).

If you get into the perfect storm of oscillation, every loop feeds on the next.

It might be at that perfect load and request for torque and the entire system response rate are all in “harmony”.

It is a little surprising to ever feel anything in the pedal. Since it’s drive by wire. You might think it’s in the pedal but it’s just something that is making it feel like that.

These types of problems can happen at any frequency.

Could be oscillation between front and back too. Changing the height changes a lot of the system and could break/prevent the harmonic cycle from developing.

 

[MP3Mike]

Let’s say you slightly accelerate. Motor turns up the torque. Slightly. That doesn’t immediately translate to the pavement. Some “energy” gets stored in the motor mounts, suspension, tires etc.

The motor senses it reached it’s desired torque. But it has not actually reached the pavement yet. But that stored energy is now releasing from motor mounts, drive shafts, suspension into the pavement. Now the car is moving faster than it wants and lowers the torque (slightly over corrects).

Something to note is that Tesla told him that they tested disabling the front motor and it didn't eliminate the vibration. Which, assuming they actually did disable the front motor, eliminates a lot of possibilities for the cause of the vibration.

 

[theslimshadyist]

Anything that vibrates due to a harmonic type issue can cause harmonic vibrations anywhere.

In fact your comments indicates more than it is than isn’t.

Let’s say you slightly accelerate. Motor turns up the torque. Slightly. That doesn’t immediately translate to the pavement. Some “energy” gets stored in the motor mounts, suspension, tires etc.

The motor senses it reached it’s desired torque. But it has not actually reached the pavement yet. But that stored energy is now releasing from motor mounts, drive shafts, suspension into the pavement. Now the car is moving faster than it wants and lowers the torque (slightly over corrects).

If you get into the perfect storm of oscillation, every loop feeds on the next.

It might be at that perfect load and request for torque and the entire system response rate are all in “harmony”.

It is a little surprising to ever feel anything in the pedal. Since it’s drive by wire. You might think it’s in the pedal but it’s just something that is making it feel like that.

These types of problems can happen at any frequency.

Could be oscillation between front and back too. Changing the height changes a lot of the system and could break/prevent the harmonic cycle from developing.

Interesting and thanks for the info!

 

[jebinc]

Something to note is that Tesla told him that they tested disabling the front motor and it didn't eliminate the vibration. Which, assuming they actually did disable the front motor, eliminates a lot of possibilities for the cause of the vibration.

I was told the same, that they disabled the front motor and it still vibrates like a MoFo.

 

[n2mb_racing]

I was told the same, that they disabled the front motor and it still vibrates like a MoFo.

I wonder if disabling the rear motors would fix it. It would keep constant torque on the shafts.

 

[jebinc]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1497256226219978753

 

[CLPMiami]

I live in FL and thinking about contacting Morgan & Morgan for guidance on a class action lawsuit.

Those who live here know their reputation as John Morgan led the charge against the state to allow the constituents to vote on the passage of medical marijuana years ago.

I am an attorney in Miami and a 2021 Plaid owner with the vibration. I would be interested in joining a Plaid owner group to go shop this around to class action law firms to see if there is interest.

 

[jebinc]

I am an attorney in Miami and a 2021 Plaid owner with the vibration. I would be interested in joining a Plaid owner group to go shop this around to class action law firms to see if there is interest.

Some threads to check out. Many frustrated owners.

"Refreshed" Model S model VIBRATION tracking and information thread!!!

This thread aims to capture sub model (dual and trim motor) vibration occurrences for "refreshed" Model S cars. Please comment with as much information you can, should your car have this affliction (including VIN range). Issue Description: Vibration felt in accelerator pedal and sometime in...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[jebinc]

Some threads to check out. Many frustrated owners.

"Refreshed" Model S model VIBRATION tracking and information thread!!!

This thread aims to capture sub model (dual and trim motor) vibration occurrences for "refreshed" Model S cars. Please comment with as much information you can, should your car have this affliction (including VIN range). Issue Description: Vibration felt in accelerator pedal and sometime in...

teslamotorsclub.com

@CLPMiami

 

[CLPMiami]

Some threads to check out. Many frustrated owners.

"Refreshed" Model S model VIBRATION tracking and information thread!!!

This thread aims to capture sub model (dual and trim motor) vibration occurrences for "refreshed" Model S cars. Please comment with as much information you can, should your car have this affliction (including VIN range). Issue Description: Vibration felt in accelerator pedal and sometime in...

teslamotorsclub.com

yes, thanks...I have been doing my reading. Tried turning on track mode yesterday and it definitively dampened the vibration, but still not a complete fix even for this work around.

Still just stunned that this design defect made it through Tesla's QA, especially since the Plaid launch was maybe the most hyped new car launch I can think of, and their most expensive model to date if Im not mistaken. I know I am preaching to the quire.

 

[jebinc]

yes, thanks...I have been doing my reading. Tried turning on track mode yesterday and it definitively dampened the vibration, but still not a complete fix even for this work around.

Still just stunned that this design defect made it through Tesla's QA, especially since the Plaid launch was maybe the most hyped new car launch I can think of, and their most expensive model to date if Im not mistaken. I know I am preaching to the quire.

@CLPMiami When in track mode, select “custom” profile. Then while vibrating, slide the top slider (handling) all the way to the right (100 percent rear bias) and the vibration will spontaneously cease. F’d up. Yeah, Tesla let this go and continues to do so.

 

[n2mb_racing]

Update after driving more. Tesla replaced my half shafts on 3/1/22, which temporarily fixed the vibration. It started to have a slight vibration again after a few days. I installed the lowering links on 3/7/22. I set them to +5 mm all around. I still haven't measured how high the car is now, but it looks pretty slammed when on the low setting. I can't imagine going much lower and still having enough suspension travel. Also, the camber angle is visibly off, so I imagine I'm wearing the inside of the tires pretty strongly.

The vibration is better, but not gone. It's not very noticeable, unless I am trying to feel for it. It definitely gets worse when I go to the "normal" ride height setting, which from what I gather should be about the same as the previous "low" setting.

So, I wouldn't really recommend lowering the car as a fix to the vibrations. It's more like a band-aid until someone comes up with a better solution. I don't think it was worth the money and effort, unless you want the lowered look as well.