-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Pure BEV Dogma
- Thread starter bonnie
- Start date
If a woman carries a child for 7 months and then loses it to something horrible before birth, was the woman never pregant?
Terminology matters, especially when government entities (elected and non-elected) make decisions that affect all of us based on that terminology (and on social pressure that is somewhat shaped by terminology maneuvering).
Some would also argue Tesla has more work to accomplish it's long-term mission because of the FUD terminology efforts of other actors.
Skotty
2014 S P85 | 2023 F-150L
Plug-in hybrids deserve to be in their own category. They are not exactly EVs. But they should not just be called hybrids either, even if they fit within the broader hybrid category. I couldn't give 2 $*#@s about regular hybrids. But when plug-in hybrids came on the market, I traded in my very beloved Mustang GT for one. Why? Because there is a very important distinction between the two. A regular hybrid runs only on gas. A plug-in can run partially, and in may cases, primarily on electricity from a socket. It's a highly relevant and important distinction. You think I would still be driving a Volt right now if I couldn't plug it in? No #$*&#$ way.
Easy for you to say - you don't have to clean up the mess.
It's not verboten - it's triggered more discussion here... in the appropriate place.
Noted. It's quite fortunate that this "hot word set" leads to a thread that isn't locked.
There's a fellow here locally who used just one tank of gas in the whole first year of ownership. He once sat in his car at our office charger while his wife was shopping... for two hours! Now that's dedication.
I'd rather sit in my car than go shopping. [Of course, when it's "shopping with the wife" it may have to be re-classified as a "bonding moment" instead and thus well worth the investment]
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
They have one, it's called "Plug-in hybrid", which is a subset of "Hybrid", so both terms are applicable.
I never understood why people objected so much to PHEV term who drive the Volt. Many want to play up the fact that it is an EV and they almost never use gas but then at the same time point out how much better it is than an EV because they have a gas generator as backup.
Skotty
2014 S P85 | 2023 F-150L
I wouldn't say it's better than an EV, it just meets different needs. However, I would say it's better than all the other PHEV's out there. Frankly, I'm very much a Ford guy, but I'm driving a Chevy Volt. That says something.
I think it meets certain driving needs very well. It's the term some Volt drivers get upset about. You call the Volt a hybrid or a PHEV and they will get upset insisting it is an EV because they drive in EV mode 90% of the time for example (which is great by the way).
- - - Updated - - -
if tesla would build a range extended ecar they would build in a 100kg 24kwh battery and a 30kg rotary engine generator.
That would not longer be a battery electric vehicle and add a lot of cost and complexity to the car. It would also blow away Tesla's entire goal of proving that electric cars can work for travel and negate the need for further Supercharger expansion.
It would no longer be a Tesla then. They only make BEVs and have zero interest in any range extender. It would require changes to all of their service centers. The one in Houston I believe was able to get around some ordinance requiring oil traps and saved them a few hundred thousand dollars. Add a range extender and that all changes.
I also think that the names are confusing. But I think the problem started with the Prius na dcontinued with all other so-called Hybrids. IMHO, they are simply NOT hybrids at all. If a car gets 100% of its energy from gasoline, then it is not a hybrid. The fact that it has an electric motor and battery to capture and reuse some of the kinetic energy from braking is simply a fuel-saving technology.
Now, the Volt, ELR, Fisker and BMW i8 are the real hybrids. They can be powered by electricity OR gasoline, i.e. there are 2 possible energy sources that can propell the car. But since the Prius & gang has already stolen the "hybrid" name, GM had to come up with a different name to differentiate, so the real mess started (EREV, PHEV, ...).
Now, it seems too late to fix the root of the problem.
Now, the Volt, ELR, Fisker and BMW i8 are the real hybrids. They can be powered by electricity OR gasoline, i.e. there are 2 possible energy sources that can propell the car. But since the Prius & gang has already stolen the "hybrid" name, GM had to come up with a different name to differentiate, so the real mess started (EREV, PHEV, ...).
Now, it seems too late to fix the root of the problem.
green1
Active Member
I've always said the Volt is a hybrid, and I usually qualify that by saying that I also believe it's one of the first hybrids that was done right, the early "hybrids" were designed such that they had all the reliability of an ICE, and all the purchase cost of electric, seemed the worst of both worlds.
I think the terms are all marketing. I actually thought that Chevy had originally promised a pure electric in the volt (many years before they finally brought it to market (though not before they started their extremely long advertising campaign claiming they were selling it)) and I was quite disapointed when they went back on that and made it a hybrid.
I think the terms are all marketing. I actually thought that Chevy had originally promised a pure electric in the volt (many years before they finally brought it to market (though not before they started their extremely long advertising campaign claiming they were selling it)) and I was quite disapointed when they went back on that and made it a hybrid.
No, the Volt was first revealed as a plugin hybrid in January 2006.
When the Volt was delivered in late 2010 or so a book about the Volt development revealed that Bob Lutz had initially conceived of the Volt as a BEV but was almost immediately talked into doing it with a range extender.
moollar
Member
*...in the United States.
In Australia, the Outlander PHEV represents much better value than the Volt. It is about AUD$10k cheaper than the Volt(!), has 5 seats, 4WD, way more cargo space, can use CHAdeMO DCFCs and drives further overall on a tank of fuel. The only advantage the Volt has is higher EV only range. For whatever reason, GM decided to make the Volt stupidly expensive in Australia (starting at AUD$60k!!) compared to its pricing in other countries.
In either case, I think that longer range EVs coupled with DCFC stations placed along highways for long trips (like what Tesla is doing) will win out in the mainstream as the price comes down, which will likely be the case with the introduction of the Model E. In the meantime, PHEVs aren't too bad an option - when they aren't stupidly expensive or way too limited in their EV capabilities like the Plug-in Prius.
Edit: Found out that the Aussie version of the Outlander PHEV does not have CHAdeMO for some weird reason, but it does have 1,500kg (~3,300lb) towing capacity (which rocks and, I believe, no other plug-in vehicle has).
Last edited:
Similar threads
