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Radar deleted on all new Model Y and Model 3. Is FSD worth it?
- Thread starter walkrunflyy
- Start date
Tam
Well-Known Member
You just said what the blog said:
"All new Model S and Model X, as well as all vehicles built for markets outside of North America, will continue to be equipped with radar and will have radar-supported Autopilot functionality until we determine the appropriate time to transition those vehicles to Tesla Vision."
Not exactly. This is just about Model S and Model X, and then all Teslas sold to outside of North America. This doesn't include M3/MY sold to North America.
EDIT: This also deosn't mention about existing vehicles already on road in any market. It's specific to cars being or to be built....
Tam
Well-Known Member
On the other hand, FSD beta version 9 will be pure vision. I don't think the tweet suggests only new non-radar cars would get FSD V9 pure vision and the rest of existing radar-equipped older cars would not:
Physics is on the side of radar cars. My car reports that it cannot see out of the pillar cameras when the sun is shining on them. Does this mean I'll lose collision avoidance when driving directly into a low sun - right when I need it most??? I sure hope they don't disable my radar. Seriously, I very well might have not bought my MY if the radar was absent.
Well, if radar is truly needed, they can simply reactivate it for you. Idk what that means for people who are getting the radarless cars like me.
They won't transition you over until they use us as validation.
They won't transition you over until they use us as validation.
I don't think the Tesla ever used side radar sensors, only front facing radar. If it had side radar, like other companies, it would be easy to have cross traffic detection.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
uh yes, but he was not talking about a side facing radar. He was talking about the pillar cameras.
I wonder how many lawsuits this might result in, or lives lost to save a few $$$. Which is even more annoying given the continuous cost increases over the last few months on the 3 & Y.
A good write-up here as well.
https://thenextweb.com/news/tesla-is-removing-radar-from-autopilot-and-it-makes-absolutely-no-sense
This removal is getting a lot of media coverage and its removal isn't flying under the radar so to speak... Pun intended. Obviously, in its current state, this camera only option is inferior to what there is now or they wouldn't have limited its functionality in the system. So it makes everyone beta testers with pretty crucial safety aids until when, and if, this is ever ready for prime time.
I've had radar adaptive cruise control and other aids that are radar based on cars since 2013 and they have generally worked very well. Saved my wife from a very bad collision once that would have been very challenging conditions for one based on cameras.
I want to see where camera only is better than camera and radar!
A good write-up here as well.
https://thenextweb.com/news/tesla-is-removing-radar-from-autopilot-and-it-makes-absolutely-no-sense
This removal is getting a lot of media coverage and its removal isn't flying under the radar so to speak... Pun intended. Obviously, in its current state, this camera only option is inferior to what there is now or they wouldn't have limited its functionality in the system. So it makes everyone beta testers with pretty crucial safety aids until when, and if, this is ever ready for prime time.
I've had radar adaptive cruise control and other aids that are radar based on cars since 2013 and they have generally worked very well. Saved my wife from a very bad collision once that would have been very challenging conditions for one based on cameras.
I want to see where camera only is better than camera and radar!
Sorry, I was confusing the field of view of the b pillar camera with the side repeater.uh yes, but he was not talking about a side facing radar. He was talking about the pillar cameras.
Looking back at the title is FSD worth it, I can't say it ever was. Now with the reliance solely on cameras even less so. At the same time it clearly has diminshed the value of other driver safety aids. They should not have rolled it out at all unless, at a minimum, it was at parity with the current system. This is a major issue as far as I am concerned. Now several safety features likely aren't ready for primetime and this was one of the reasons we were considering a Tesla in the first place.
This isn't really any different then when they dropped mobile eye. AutoPilot 2.0 wasn't at parity with the v1 mobile eye version when it was first released either.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
It might be a bit better because teslavision keeps the same hardware. Then again they dropped the rain sensor, and that's still a mess.
travwill
Active Member
I’m definitely pausing here on ordering a Y. Will wait and see how this goes and if a spurt of safety issues arise. Not paying more for less safety than a Prius and less tech that is just a promise at this point, we know how that has went with Tesla since AP1 hardware - ha.
Tam
Well-Known Member
MobilEye says it's fine to go pure vision as an L2 when human drivers are still responsible for safe driving. It says but if you want to go higher than that from L3 to L5 (when the responsibility of driving is now shifted to the machine and no longer human driver), then it would need to add radar and lidar.
Tesla has hinted to go pure vision for a few years so the question prior to this was when.
Now that the transition has started, not all will go to pure vision at once right now, but the goal is still for all to go there, sooner or later.
I love this quote from MobileEye. Bolding of text is theirs..
"Computer Vision
From the outset, Mobileye’s philosophy has been that if a human can drive a car based on vision alone – so can a computer. Meaning, cameras are critical to allow an automated system to reach human-level perception/actuation: there is an abundant amount of information (explicit and implicit) that only camera sensors with full 360 degree coverage can extract, making it the backbone of any automotive sensing suite."
Yes, but humans do it very poorly in bad lighting, inclement weather, etc. So what system is implemented to keep the lenses clean and free of debris at all times? I've had other cars with radar based aids and there were fairly tolerant of dirt, rain, some ice, etc.
I don't want to be a beta tester of safety systems with my family. The fact that they are limiting the speed to 75 mph tells me all I need to know about how ready this is. So driving through Texas it is worthless.
"Computer Vision
From the outset, Mobileye’s philosophy has been that if a human can drive a car based on vision alone – so can a computer. Meaning, cameras are critical to allow an automated system to reach human-level perception/actuation: there is an abundant amount of information (explicit and implicit) that only camera sensors with full 360 degree coverage can extract, making it the backbone of any automotive sensing suite."
Yes, but humans do it very poorly in bad lighting, inclement weather, etc. So what system is implemented to keep the lenses clean and free of debris at all times? I've had other cars with radar based aids and there were fairly tolerant of dirt, rain, some ice, etc.
I don't want to be a beta tester of safety systems with my family. The fact that they are limiting the speed to 75 mph tells me all I need to know about how ready this is. So driving through Texas it is worthless.
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