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Reading Speed signs...is is till due in AP/EAP?FSD?
- Thread starter fbitz777
- Start date
It is in AP1 (not even EAP)....so one would assume AP2.0 would catch up?
Seriously GPS based speed control is off half the time for me and sometimes by 20mph...tell that to the cops when Tesla says 75mph but cop says 55. At least FSD will need to be able to read speed signs.
Yesterday I took a trip on Freeway and car decided that the speed limit was 35mph (from 75mph) because that was the speed limit on the overpass above me. Pretty scary. So yeah GPS would say 35mph for a few hundred feet!
Oh and wiper control (works great on AP1) ...same story and well documented...this one is on my 2017 delivery sheet.
The new AP/FSD (which they didn't claim it was FSD) is much simpler to explain.
AP is now TACC plus AutoSteer (lane keeping).
FSD is now everything else, including NOAP (Navigate On AutoPilot), Summon, AutoPark, ...
Mobileye provided the speed sign reading support with AP1. Tesla is yet to turn that feature on with the AP2 sensors and software, and I agree, this is badly needed because of the numerous errors in the offline speed limit database distributed to the vehicles.
For current customers with EAP and no FSD - they'll get TACC, AutoSteer, NOAP on limited access highways only, Summon (possibly limited to straight lines for short distances) and AutoPark (limited to current parallel/perpendicular parking spaces).
AP is now TACC plus AutoSteer (lane keeping).
FSD is now everything else, including NOAP (Navigate On AutoPilot), Summon, AutoPark, ...
Mobileye provided the speed sign reading support with AP1. Tesla is yet to turn that feature on with the AP2 sensors and software, and I agree, this is badly needed because of the numerous errors in the offline speed limit database distributed to the vehicles.
For current customers with EAP and no FSD - they'll get TACC, AutoSteer, NOAP on limited access highways only, Summon (possibly limited to straight lines for short distances) and AutoPark (limited to current parallel/perpendicular parking spaces).
Be careful for what you wish for. AP1 reads ALL speed limit signs, including the 25 MPH school zones. Sometimes it can be miles until another sign comes along releasing the school zone restriction. At least that does not appear to happen with the map data based approach.
I agree it's a mixed blessing. We have 1 car with live sign recognition and one with GPS. Overall I do think live sign recognition is better, but it's not a big deal either way. For the most part they both work reasonably well.
It doesn't prevent anything, they just have to pay for its usage. On the other hand, wouldn't there really not be any prior art? No visual recognition of signs at all before that patent seems strange. It isn't any different that *any* form or object recognition besides that it is sign!
This is the reason why such software patents are so stupid as how can you even patent such an obvious thing.
jww1966
Member
Speed limit sign recognition may not be so easy in Europe. In The Netherlands we have time based speed limits: the sign says 100 km/hr with a smaller sign beneath that reads between 6 am - 7 pm. Any other time the max speed is 130 km/hr.
In Germany there are speed limits that are only active when it rains.
It will take some doing to get this right.
In Germany there are speed limits that are only active when it rains.
It will take some doing to get this right.
This has never once been promised with AP2+ hardware. Parity with AP1 on all fronts sounds like a nice theory but no one promised that. Considering they're not even delivering on what they did promise, it would be extremely hopeful to assume they'd deliver on this, though it would make sense as an FSD feature.
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Speed limit detection was part of the Mobileye technology used for AP1.
When Tesla dropped Mobileye for AP2, they shifted to implementing their own object detection (Tesla Vision).
In order to achieve FSD or full implementation of NOAP (on limited access highways to surface streets), the AP software must recognize AND OBEY speed limits, and traffic signs/signals. While the software has likely been classifying the traffic signs/signals with Tesla Vision since AP2 was introduced, the software has not (yet) been interpreting those objects - which Musk has indicated should be coming this year.
As commented above, correctly interpreting speed limit/traffic signs/signals is difficult. Unfortunately, there isn't standardization on the placement of signs/signals - especially when the placement makes it difficult (impossible) to determine if the sign applies to where the vehicle is located. On local highways, we'll have HOV lanes, main lanes, entry/exit lanes and frontage road lanes that are adjacent to each other. Signs are placed between the lanes, without any obvious marking on the signs indicating the lanes for which the sign should be used. So a speed limit sign for an exit ramp or HOV lanes could be interpreted to apply to the main lanes.
This is one of the challenges for implementing NOAP (driver assistance) and later getting approval for FSD.
There are other challenges that aren't being discussed impacting NOAP and FSD. Emergency vehicles, oncoming trains and police/emergency responders use audio signals (horns, whistles) to alert drivers even when you can't see the approaching object. Is the AP system able to detect those audio signals (using the interior microphone or is there an exterior microphone)?
When police or emergency responders are manually directing traffic, will the software be able to interpret the instructions provided through hand gestures, potentially coupled with a whistle?
AP is much more than lane keeping and maintaining speed and spacing from the vehicle ahead...
When Tesla dropped Mobileye for AP2, they shifted to implementing their own object detection (Tesla Vision).
In order to achieve FSD or full implementation of NOAP (on limited access highways to surface streets), the AP software must recognize AND OBEY speed limits, and traffic signs/signals. While the software has likely been classifying the traffic signs/signals with Tesla Vision since AP2 was introduced, the software has not (yet) been interpreting those objects - which Musk has indicated should be coming this year.
As commented above, correctly interpreting speed limit/traffic signs/signals is difficult. Unfortunately, there isn't standardization on the placement of signs/signals - especially when the placement makes it difficult (impossible) to determine if the sign applies to where the vehicle is located. On local highways, we'll have HOV lanes, main lanes, entry/exit lanes and frontage road lanes that are adjacent to each other. Signs are placed between the lanes, without any obvious marking on the signs indicating the lanes for which the sign should be used. So a speed limit sign for an exit ramp or HOV lanes could be interpreted to apply to the main lanes.
This is one of the challenges for implementing NOAP (driver assistance) and later getting approval for FSD.
There are other challenges that aren't being discussed impacting NOAP and FSD. Emergency vehicles, oncoming trains and police/emergency responders use audio signals (horns, whistles) to alert drivers even when you can't see the approaching object. Is the AP system able to detect those audio signals (using the interior microphone or is there an exterior microphone)?
When police or emergency responders are manually directing traffic, will the software be able to interpret the instructions provided through hand gestures, potentially coupled with a whistle?
AP is much more than lane keeping and maintaining speed and spacing from the vehicle ahead...
