diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Technically, yes. But this was not a 4 way intersection. It was a red light on 4 lane road. The traffic light is for a left turn onto a campus. I was going straight on the 4 lane road.
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Red light detection, stop sign detection, stopping!
- Thread starter verygreen
- Start date
Technically, yes. But this was not a 4 way intersection. It was a red light on 4 lane road. The traffic light is for a left turn onto a campus. I was going straight on the 4 lane road.
My only point there was this feature clearly is not ready for primetime. I was trying, the other night, to see if I could trigger it and I found myself basically having to slam on the brakes to stop for a red light. My impression is this should give you at least several car length of warning. That sort of distance would be appropriate for stopping or not stopping for yellow light.
It should because auto-steer is an EAP feature. Release notes indicate Auto-Steer must be engaged. So it's not enough to have EAP purchased, A/S must be active.
But as a feature I remember reading that FSD is required for Red Light/Stop sign detection when it will be officially out. If I can use it with A/S I would be extremely happy. I have been waiting for this for a long time.
Statistically, the purpose of speed limits is revenue, not safety. I'm not saying that speed limits aren't useful, but I guarantee that having a 25 MPH speed limit on very nearly every single road (including major five-lane city-street highways) through Santa Cruz is not for safety. Despite being in ostensibly a zero tolerance state, the cops gave up bothering to pull people over for less than about fifteen over... a couple of decades ago.
CA-9 south of Saratoga has a 45 MPH speed limit, but if you try, you will die. On the flip side, there's one stretch of access road along the freeway in Sunnyvale that has a 25 MPH speed limit for something like two blocks, for no obvious reason. Everybody drives 45.
The interstates through Nashville are marked 55. If you drive slower than 70, you will get run over. If 90% of cars are going more than 15 MPH over the limit and you aren't seeing a crazy number of crashes, your speed limit is pretty much guaranteed to be at least 10–15 MPH too low.
So no, speed limits are mostly a joke at this point. They stopped being set sensibly and started being set ridiculously low for revenue generation a long time ago. I wish it were not so, because that practice makes the few spots where the speed limits actually are there for safety a lot more dangerous, because people ignore them, and then they flip their cars.
Quite the opposite. Most people still pay attention to sensible laws. The more ridiculous the law, the more people ignore it. If you put a 5 MPH sign on a freeway, people won't even slow down. If you put a 65 MPH sign in a residential neighborhood, people also won't speed up. Most people have a decent intuitive sense about what is safe. That's why IMO, for the most part, speed limits shouldn't even exist except in places where the reason for those speed limits is not immediately obvious. Nearly everyone will still drive a reasonable speed for the road, and the speed limit signs that do exist will immediately jump out as critically important.
Speed limits are rather like California's Prop 65. It started out as a way of warning people about truly dangerous substances that can cause cancer and reproductive harm. And over time, the desire to protect people from smaller and smaller levels of harm, coupled with the existence of fines for not warning people, but no fines for warning people unnecessarily, has weakened the impact of those signs to the point that everyone ignores them entirely.
The problem is, local governments, in an attempt to raise revenue, have been crying wolf for way too long. After a while, when the real wolf appears, everyone gets eaten.
I don't agree on that. Common sense is not that common.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
Yup, absolutely agree that many people DON'T have common sense about what is safe. At least not the people in my neighborhood that race up and down the street at 50 mph in a 25 mph zone. In less than 3 years, 2 people hit and 3 animals hit. If people had common sense, there wouldn't be 100 car pileups in fog
FSD is required for "Recognize and respond to traffic lights and stop signs."
My guess is that this is a safety feature and, at a minimum, everyone with Autosteer will get the warning that you are about to run a red light. But it won't stop for them on its own, you have to pay for FSD for that. But as people have stated the warning comes when it is absolutely positive that you aren't going to stop before the line. In other words, really late.
mrbulk
Member
Hmmm, lots of late warning comments here and on Youtube. I wonder if this warning threshold can adjusted by using the Late/Medium/Early settings in the Forward Collision Warning section of Autopilot?
I think that assuming FSD does emerge as a viable functionality set, EAP and/or AP will become very non-desirable because of compromises like the one you point out above, and will ultimately be retired. With that in mind I think I agree with the AP scope reduction vice FSD - it potentially differentiates the two and may help with expectation management. After all EAP essentially sounds like Level 3 FSD when NoA is active on freeways. It leave a big grey area in my mind.
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
mrbulk
Member
Too bad, although I bet verygreen could likely do it.
@verygreen Would you happen to know the answer? Your video seemed to indicate pretty good advanced warning/action.
Yup, absolutely agree that many people DON'T have common sense about what is safe. At least not the people in my neighborhood that race up and down the street at 50 mph in a 25 mph zone. In less than 3 years, 2 people hit and 3 animals hit. If people had common sense, there wouldn't be 100 car pileups in fog
To be clear, I'm not saying there aren't morons out there who drive at excessive speeds. I'm just saying that the 1% of drivers who fall into that category will still drive like morons regardless of the speed limit, and the other 99% of drivers won't drive like idiots even if they aren't told to drive at a particular speed.
I did not play too much with the warning, but the car sees the light decently far away. No idea if anything is tied to FCW
I think it's best people not try ty running red lights trying to trigger this stuff, sound like a dangerous and calling for being rear-ended.
Good call!
Also, I am wondering in any of your snooping of recent firmwares. Have you seen any details of information about the properties of an intersection? like maybe how many lanes from each direction, if there are turn lanes, whether it expects an intersection to be a stoplight or not? The location of the actual traffic light (like laterally how it is placed), or is there any information at all about the traffic lights before they are approached? or entirely vision?
Thanks
I've had 2019.8.3 for about a week now and have yet to see it recognize a stop sign or red light.
traffic lights/stop lights are marked on the map. if it's not mapped, no detection is attempted. I hae a couple of unmapped lights that I noticed around. One installed a couple months ago, one I am not sure why it's unmapped. These are never detected. The mapped ones - when you are in vicinity, the car shows the gray icon and then once it's seen and signal is know, the signal state is added. Similarly with the stop signs.
They had v2 maps that had per lane information and stuff and it looks like they now have v3 maps with even more stuff, but I did not look into it with any sort of details, since it seems to be mostly in CA only anyway. Most of the mappign data hey use is in the form of v1 adas tiles we looked at in the past and the teslamaps data (I think this is where the traffic lights info is stored today, no detection works if you do not have teslamaps of the right vintage or region)
When you say map, you mean the one that is displayed and does it show in the 'satellite' view or just the non-satellite view. I've never seen even grayed out signals or signs.
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