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Short-Term TSLA Price Movements - 2016

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You can't draw the conclusion you are trying to advance until October delivery data available for all geographical regions. Deliveries in one region can be lower, while other higher, you just can't draw conclusions based on US deliveries alone. As you can see from the Tesla Europe Registration Stats, percent of total deliveries in NA went down 2016Q2 to 2016Q3, with a significant proportional growth in Asia. Under such scenario if it is assumed for this quarter, lower deliveries in NA do not mean overall lower deliveries in October.

In summary, the conclusion you are trying to advocate is premature - not enough data to come to your conclusion.

I strongly recommend putting more stock in what Elon and Jason are telegraphing. Since 2016Q1 they have set a record in delivering on their projections.

CASH IS KING.

This is just one data point, but October deliveries in Norway were 86% higher than last quarter: 123 in October vs. 66 in July. The split MS/MX: October - 39 / 84, July - 43 / 23. So at least this single data point is consitent with my hypothesis that October mix includes an increase of overseas deliveries vs. NA.
 
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I do wonder how many people forfeited their $2,500 deposit and canceled their AP1 ordered cars to then place an order for an AP2 car. And how much Tesla would then discount that now inventory AP1 car to move it. Ideally, many of those cars become the showroom demo cars. I'm thinking AP2 cars do not become demo vehicles since they make a terrible demo while the AP2 software isn't yet enabled. That might be enough to have a gross margin positive effect, as Tesla has to have demo cars anyways and their discounting is already a cost of doing business.

Further, the take rate of the AP2 features would mean some parts of that revenue would count in Q4 (hardware + markup) and the rest would be deferred until the various features are enabled and recognized on some sort of schedule. It's in interesting dynamic for Q4.
 
Anybody has any guess on how many reservations will be for powerwall 2?

Just a wild unbridled guess: If Tesla received 2 million reservations for PW2, that is $1 Billion in cash flow right there at $500 per reservation. That is much better than a cap raise! :D

2 million PW2 units at 14kwh each, require about 28 Gwh in battery cells. I am not sure how much GF1 is expected to produce in 2017. Any guess?

A recent published report estimated that Tesla sold a total of about 5000 powerwall 1. A million powerwall 2 in a year would be production of about 4000 per day.

I think Tesla can sell all the powerwalls they can make over the next coupe of years. It is very unclear how many they can/will make. For a number of reasons Tesla apparently didn't choose to make a large number of powerwall 1.
 
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I believe he honestly believes what he's saying when he's saying it. I reject the notion that he is intentionally lying to investors and the public at large.

Those are subtly different, but close enough to the same.

I've not seen anything of real note he said, especially recently, that turned out to be straight up untrue. He misses his own deadlines with shocking regularity, but I don't think that's out of anything but the ceaseless overoptimism that got him to where he is today. I think he intends to meet them, but reality gets in the way. I hope the relatively small magnitude of the misses in timeline recently are indicative that he is getting better at compensating for reality.

Among Tesla bulls, let's just say there are those who take Elon's words as the ultimate authority and don't question/doubt them, and then there are those who filter his words through a realty filter of sorts (note: usually this is developed over time by the individual). For those who filter, some use a timing filter of sort (ie., Tesla timing is often late by X months or years). Or some use a risk filter (ie., Elon tends to downplay certain risks or gloss over them, for example he didn't share about the FWDs needing to be completely redesigned until well after the fact).

Those of us that use a filter doesn't mean that we're less of a fan of Elon/Tesla or less of a TSLA bull. We might just see risks and things a bit differently than how Elon/Tesla portray them to be at times. Perhaps we're more "level-headed" bulls (vs religious bulls).
 
In case there was any doubt, this vote is done and the merger will pass. The only out now would be a major SP decline or major institution flipping its vote last second.

As I think I described in an earlier post, I'm very familiar with tracking votes like this one. Elon is working with his proxy solicitor and getting daily (or more) updates on the vote tally. They are probably also conducting institutional shareholder outreach, which is where you invite your largest holders to have 1-on-1 calls to discuss the merger rationale and answer any questions they have (within the limits of what's allowed legally).

Based on those calls, the Company will have a pretty good idea if the institution is in favor of the vote. You can tell from tone and the tenor of the questions (plus they like to drop some obvious hints here and there). The solicitors also have a lot of contacts at these places. Once the big vote results come in, the solicitor can discern (usually with 95%+ accuracy) who just voted and how they voted. At some point, it becomes close to set in stone how the vote will end up, unless a big institution changes its vote at the last second. I can generally track where votes will end up within 2% of the actual final vote as the voting date draws near for clients.

TL; DR: When Elon said he's pretty sure he has the votes, he does in fact already have the votes. I listed the 2 possible outs above; decide for yourself what the probability of those events is and invest accordingly.

Thanks for your insight. Something I have trouble understanding is that if you know this, then wall st. should also know this. So we should see the gap close to what, less than 5% tomorrow? For some reason, I suspect we won't. Perhaps I will be surprised tomorrow.
 
Thanks for your insight. Something I have trouble understanding is that if you know this, then wall st. should also know this. So we should see the gap close to what, less than 5% tomorrow? For some reason, I suspect we won't. Perhaps I will be surprised tomorrow.
Keep in mind there is a large chunk of investors out there who do not believe what Elon says and many are funds. Him saying the vote is locked up or that SCTY has a 0% chance of BK holds no sway with them.

Also I think the election is having an outsized effect. Fear can lead to a larger probability of a SP decline that could kill the merger.
 
I think it comes down to timing.

Let's look at their cash needs:

For Model 3 launch (going through Q4, 2017), assuming 250,000 unit build plan
$1.2 billion for the equipment for Fremont for initial Model 3 production
Let's call it $25 million for finishing up Gigafactory phase 1
$75 million each quarter capex in addition for Superchargers and various retail/service build outs worldwide
$125 million for installation of equipment, Fremont expansion that is not equipment

That's $1.65 billion to launch the Model 3, but that doesn't count the parts up front ramp. Now, if they can get suppliers to take delayed payment terms that they implied, then the ramp isn't as bad if the launch goes relatively smoothly unlike the Model X launch.

Cash on hand is $3.1 billion. They would like to have $1 billion in cash and they have access to another $750 million in ABL.

Now, the issue is the timing of the 500,000 unit build plan for 2018. For that, we have at least:
Spending $400 million on Gigafactory phase 2, of which has already started in Q3, 2016
Spending $3 billion to expand Fremont again
Ongoing expansion of Superchargers and retail/service locations in 2018.

So the issue is when does the capex spend for 2018 hit? Some is already hitting with Gigafactory expansion. They will likely spend the $400 million spread through 6 quarters, or roughly $70 million each quarter until the last quarter. Panasonic starts their investment in that section in Q3, but really in Q4 of 2017. If it takes 2-3 quarters to have the factory expansion done, and Tesla does the 500,000 unit build plan in two sections, then the capex spend for the first section would likely start in Q3 of 2017. Then the next section would be Q4, 2017 to Q1, 2018. Of course, that amount doesn't happen all at once.

The real question is whether or not Tesla gets TE profits in 2017 in order to pay for the 2018 500,000 unit build plan. It seems that the Model 3 launch is not the problem, it's the timing of the capex for 2018 and the Model 3 launch S curve that will determine things. Clearly, if Tesla had an extra $1 billion or $2 billion, Tesla could freely choose to start the expansion to the 500,000 build plan pretty much directly on the heels of the 2017 expansion.

@techmaven Thanks for laying this out in numbers! Super helpful contribution for discussion.

First, if we assume your 250k unit plan of $1.65 billion plus parts... then I think it's probably reasonable to add at least $400M to parts (but probably more). In that case, we're looking at $2 billion. Also, I would imagine that more is needed for the GF than just $25 million to supply packs for 250k units.

Second, I think there's a decent probability that SCTY is a cash drain in 2017. In Q3 earnings call, Elon said "I expect SolarCity to be approximately cash neutral, all things considered, next year." (http://seekingalpha.com/article/401...-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single). I take that as he hopes that SCTY is cash neutral but that there's a fairly good chance that it will be a cash drain. In fact, if it was clear that SCTY would be a positive cash contributor in 2017, then Elon would have said that... and he didn't. The question then becomes how big of a cash drain can SCTY be next year? That, I don't know the answer to... and I don't know if anybody does.

Third, in Q3 earnings here's what Elon said in his second comment on cap raise:
"But I stand by what I said earlier which is, currently, if we did not go out and raised a bunch of money – our current plan says we don't need to raise any money. It gets a little scary in terms of how much capital we have in the bank relative to our sales volume, but at least currently raised capital is something that's nice to have, not a necessity. And maybe it's a smart move to de-risk things and all that."

Now, I want to focus on what he said about "it gets a little scary in terms of how much capital we have in the bank relative to our sales volume". I think this is an important sentence he added. We all know that Elon has made very bold financial bets in the past with his own money because he has a high risk profile (not in a bad sense). Elon's ok with things not working out at times, because he knows he can recover (ie., spending all his money on TSLA, SCTY, SpaceX and borrowing friend's money). So if things are "scary" to Elon, then that means it's really scary. Now, we don't really know exactly what he meant by that, but I'll give my interpretation. I took it as Tesla could afford not to raise capital but that their cash in bank would get so low that it would be scary (ie., few hundred million dollars in bank). Again, this is Elon talking and he's gone through several near bankruptcies with his companies. So, if it's a "little scary" to Elon that means it's going to be terrifying to analysts and investors. Again, this is debatable and it's just my take. Tesla, at this size, really needs a good chunk of cash in the bank because they are a capital-dependent business and can be exposed to additional risk if lending markets freeze up in case of a recession. If there is a recession next year, and Tesla is down to their last $300M in cash, and they're forced to raise money but the markets are in a severe downturn, it could get very very nasty. We're talking about possible double digit stock price (ie., a recession could sink TSLA stock price by 30-40% or more, and Tesla's precarious cash position could sink it another 20%). This is something that should be avoided, and that's why a capital raise really isn't "optional" but it is "needed". With Tesla, they really shouldn't drop their cash balance lower than $2 billion, or else that's just entering a place of precarious cash position... especially for a company that's trying to sell roughly $15 billion in autos next year (ie., $10 billion in S/X and $5 billion in Model 3 assuming 100k cars at $50k asp due to earlier orders leaning toward performance/etc). Actually, I'd be more comfortable if Tesla didn't drop under $3 billion in cash at all next year. Now, I know others will disagree with me and that's fine. Ie., "Elon says Tesla will be fine, so they will be fine". But my question would be for a company that's selling $15 billion in autos (which is a capital intensive business), how much would cash in bank would you want that company to maintain especially in case there's a recession? And then, add on top of that a cushion for SCTY which, as I shared earlier, might burn some cash as well in 2017.
 
. Once again, what it has to do with my objection to @mmd claim that Vermount's Green Mountain Power provides "subsidies"?

I apologize for being busy with other matters and not responding within the 27 minutes you allotted between 8:33 am and 9:00 am to respond to your initial demand. You seem to be increasingly impatient and irritable lately; what is bothering you? If my attempt to provide information about and a link to Tesla Energy's greatest source of subsidies for its products added to your angst, I again apologize. Others, not as clued in as you, seemed to appreciate the information.

From the context of MMD's post about "a line item of Tesla energy in the quarterly reports" I interpreted his comment about subsidies to refer to subsidies in general and to be world-wide in scope. Certainly, it's implausible that MMD thought the volume of Powerwalls GMP was purchasing from TE for its pilot program warranted a separate line item in Tesla's financial reporting.

However, if you prefer to interpret MMD's comment as applying solely to subsidies provided by Vermont's GMP, "have it your way" as they used to say at Burger King.

PS, FWIW, GMP used to operate in California's market a decade and a half ago before its offerings became un-competitive; their website states they continue to be involved with RECs (Renewable Energy Credits) nationwide, including in Califorina
 
Keep in mind there is a large chunk of investors out there who do not believe what Elon says and many are funds. Him saying the vote is locked up or that SCTY has a 0% chance of BK holds no sway with them.

Also I think the election is having an outsized effect. Fear can lead to a larger probability of a SP decline that could kill the merger.
What does stock price got to do with merger approval? The conversion rate is set at 0.11 without any caveats. Right?

I have seen some folks mention about $170 as the TSLA stock price at which deal gets killed. I don't see that anywhere in the S4 documentation. Am I missing anything?
 
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What does stock price got to do with merger approval? The conversion rate is set at 0.11 without any caveats. Right?

I have seen some folks mention about $170 as the TSLA stock price at which deal gets killed. I don't see that anywhere in the S4 documentation. Am I missing anything?

Interesting. I don't see it in the S-4 either. Someone said it earlier and I ran with the implication it meant (that SCTY @ less than 18.70 is a surefire bet so long as the merger happens), but I don't see that as an escape clause. Anyone know where that idea came from?
 
I think only the first month's payment + tax credit hits revenue for the other 32% of Teslas sold. I'm not sure how previously-sold lease accounting cars hit the revenue line in Q3--maybe just the 3 months of payments for each of them?

You are correct about the 32% residual risk dynamic. It's not the just the first month's payments but all that were "realized" during the quarter, i.e if a car was leased near the beginning of July it would be nearly three months of payments under GAAP. NO tax credits ever get into Revenue for Tesla direct leases (Tesla has no USA tax liability for the foreseeable future because of tax losses ($2.2 billion) carried forward).

You are also correct about the RVG cars from prior quarters. RVG car will continue to add 3 months of revenue under GAAP until those obligations either expire or are exercised. IMO, it's part of the reason why non-GAAP reporting (lease revenue) has been discontinued; the other reason is the SEC's admonitions.
 
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This makes no sense for a company that already holds $2B in future value and is continuing to grow..

Apparently, based on questions on the call, the value is comprised as follows:

Remaining payment stream on 20 yr leases--$3.1B ( just those un-sold to raise capital?)
Payment Stream renewals between 20 to 30 years $0.9 B (no technological advancement will make those 20 yr old panels obsolete???)

Recourse debt $ 2 B

Net $2 B, (IF you believe the renewals are realistic--Elon said if they don't renew or buy the solar roofs when their existing roofs start to leak, the old panels will be re-purposed.)
 
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@techmaven and @DaveT,

Thanks for the thoughtful discussion.

One issue I was curious about is how you factor cash generated from S/X sales into your analysis. In Q3, Tesla generated $597M in cash ($424M in cash flows from operations and $173M from sales to leasing partners). Given likely increasing margins (and increasing sales in 2017) it seems reasonable to assume that if anything this number would go up.

But conservatively assuming $600M per quarter in cash generation that is another $2.4B available for CapEx and Model 3 ramp related OpEx for Q4 2016-Q3 2017, plus whatever is generated from TE, which seems likely to be substantial.

Would be interested in your thoughts on how cash generated from S and X factors into the capital equation.
 
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Among Tesla bulls, let's just say there are those who take Elon's words as the ultimate authority and don't question/doubt them, and then there are those who filter his words through a realty filter of sorts (note: usually this is developed over time by the individual). For those who filter, some use a timing filter of sort (ie., Tesla timing is often late by X months or years). Or some use a risk filter (ie., Elon tends to downplay certain risks or gloss over them, for example he didn't share about the FWDs needing to be completely redesigned until well after the fact).

Those of us that use a filter doesn't mean that we're less of a fan of Elon/Tesla or less of a TSLA bull. We might just see risks and things a bit differently than how Elon/Tesla portray them to be at times. Perhaps we're more "level-headed" bulls (vs religious bulls).

Wow. Just wow. :(

You do realize same team, right?
 
What does stock price got to do with merger approval? The conversion rate is set at 0.11 without any caveats. Right?

I have seen some folks mention about $170 as the TSLA stock price at which deal gets killed. I don't see that anywhere in the S4 documentation. Am I missing anything?

Interesting. I don't see it in the S-4 either. Someone said it earlier and I ran with the implication it meant (that SCTY @ less than 18.70 is a surefire bet so long as the merger happens), but I don't see that as an escape clause. Anyone know where that idea came from?

Page 68 of the merger proposal shows SolarCity wanted a termination clause if Tesla went below $175, but it appears they didn't get their wish. This Fortune article appears to confirm that fact. Count me in as curious on how the $170 rumor got started.

Update: This post is the first reference to the $170 rumor that I could find.
 
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Just that in the next two decades, solar products will be far more advanced and far cheaper than the 80% output from 20 yr old panels.(just a guess, no promises).

Sure, but doesn't the revenue assume reduced rates are negotiated beyond the 20 yr contract? People tend to be pretty lazy about these things, so as long as Tesla/stcy offers them a fair reduced rate extension or purchase option, majority probably go along with it vs option of having solarcity come back climb all over old roof to take down panels, hire new gen solar contract to climb all over old roof to replace...
 
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