Software Update 2018.21.9 75bdbc11

[rpm001]

So many opinions on this. What a great community we have! I'll share mine, FWIW.

I'm not a fanboy, but I really love my car. My opinion has gone back and forth on this particular release.

- I admit to probably not holding the wheel as much as I should have in the past. Shame on me. This release is forcing me to hold on more. That's a good thing. It's a little more annoying for me with the reduced timing, but overall is making me hold the wheel more which makes things safer. I'll call that a plus.
- I don't have the issue that some are reporting about having to exert more force than previously.
- I do not like that the white visual indicator has reduced in size. I don't see any benefit to that, and potentially could cause me to miss it. I think this is a step back.

I've expressed in another thread (or maybe it was a few pages back in this one) that I'm generally concerned about the direction we're all collectively going with the overly negative press, the distrust from the general population about self-driving, and some (me including) dangerous behavior in AP usage. I think unless something changes quickly we might end up in a position where regulations prevent forward progress here. Think MADD but MA-AP. And maybe not just forward progress in AP development but blocking it altogether. So even if we take some temporary steps back, but overall safety is increased, then I'm in favor of it. Because I believe that AP will ultimately be safer than humans (although I don't believe it is yet in it's current form) so I really want it to succeed.

 

[BozieBeMe2]

Far too many threads on this topic I guess.

Here's an example from a different thread that I thought was in this thread.

While I will agree the sensing method Tesla choose is not ideal, it is what we have today. Those who wish to just keep their hands anywhere but on the wheel must never have experienced shorts changing encounters on the highway at speed where milliseconds count in an avoidance maneuver.

There are credible reports though of people who have experience with other Tesla cars, who find their newer Tesla requiring more steering effort to either disengage AS, or to cancel the nag. @Az_Rael is one I'd believe in this post, given her history. It's quite possible Tesla has changed steering H/W at some point, or something inside the box has changed, such that it is not calibrated the same from those of us who do not have problems with sensing "hands on wheel." In that case, Tesla needs to check into the problem further and modify what triggers sensing.

If I get a chance, I'll shoot and post a video showing how little effort it takes to cancel the nag. If others can't duplicate this simple single finger nudge of the wheel, they need to open a service center call ASAP as something has changed.

So maybe I won't have to shoot a video. I didn't watch it earlier, but @fasteddie7 posted his findings in this thread, at least for his older AP1 Tesla. Hey Fast, have you compared it with the AP2 Tesla yet? My late 2016 Ap2 has no problem with canceling nags at all.

Our AP1, 2015 MSD85 requires very little effort to cancel the AP, just a slight two finger pull. You might check your drivers settings to set what you have yours set to, ours is in the comfort setting.

 

[Joe F]

Our AP1, 2015 MSD85 requires very little effort to cancel the AP, just a slight two finger pull. You might check your drivers settings to set what you have yours set to, ours is in the comfort setting.

So as I've stated, I have no problem with nags pre or post 2018.21.9.

All it takes is one fingers worth of pressure on the wheel.

Since you said cancel AP, I'm assuming you meant cancel the nags. Canceling AS leaving TACC alone running is not what I'm referring to. That takes more than one or two fingers, and is not safe to do otherwise.

 

[luckyj]

Okay, after a regular 250mi highway trip, some additional observations. Coming from 2018.18.2:

1) AS performance is largely the same on the highway. However, it does seem to have slightly more tendency to take an exit.
2) TACC is sometimes doing some weird stuff. Several times, it got into this mode of quickly alternating between thinking it needed to slow down, then speed up, then slow down, then speed up, over and over for perhaps 5 seconds or so. I'm not sure why, there was nothing obvious to me that caused it. The set max speed was not changing.
3) Lane change seemed improved. All changes completed successfully and without any sudden veering.
4) I did get more nags, but that was due to my own tendency to take my hand off the wheel at times. Since the nags come sooner now, I saw a handful more than usuall. No big deal.

 

[Impala1ss]

Reading this thread about the proper way to hold the steering wheel seems surreal. Unlike many, my automobile is simply a tool which allows me to achieve a certain result. Being a tool, there should be instructions on how to use it correctly, and there shouldn't be 100 ways to use it properly, nor should the manufacturer refuse to tell us the correct way (and why it is the correct way) to use it. I am always unpleasantly surprised that Tesla only provides little, if any, instruction when it introduces new, or improved changes.

 

[oneday]

Reading this thread about the proper way to hold the steering wheel seems surreal. Unlike many, my automobile is simply a tool which allows me to achieve a certain result. Being a tool, there should be instructions on how to use it correctly, and there shouldn't be 100 ways to use it properly, nor should the manufacturer refuse to tell us the correct way (and why it is the correct way) to use it. I am always unpleasantly surprised that Tesla only provides little, if any, instruction when it introduces new, or improved changes.

There should be training videos available on the touch screen.

 

[dailo]

Wonder how they can calibrate the required sensitivity for each steering wheel, since I imagine there is probably variance for every vehicle. Ever since this update I actually stopped getting any nags on my normal commute, so wondering if the different postings of folks moving the wheel and the alert not going away is due to the algorithm not picking it up correctly.

 

[boonedocks]

Wonder how they can calibrate the required sensitivity for each steering wheel, since I imagine there is probably variance for every vehicle. Ever since this update I actually stopped getting any nags on my normal commute, so wondering if the different postings of folks moving the wheel and the alert not going away is due to the algorithm not picking it up correctly.

I believe this is true and I believe it can be reset:

Possible "fix" for the nags

 

[_jal_]

Today was the first time I drove over 65 with this release on the interstate. Yikes. Others have complained about it on previous releases, but this is the first time I've ever had the right-side-lane-bias problem. It seemed to only happen as the car went over 65 or so. All of a sudden it would drift to the right. I couldn't stand to pass trucks without taking over as it was just so close. And like others who have complained, the display showed it biasing right. Really a PITA. At first I thought I had engaged TACC but not actually AS. One time on a big curve I thought it was going to actually change lanes it was heading even further to the right.

Also, on one of my test roads it crosses the lane line to where the lane line may be under the driver seat or so when taking a curve to the left at 27 MPH.

Here's a video on the highway. I was totally focusing on driving while passing the truck so you can only see the display and how it shows the car off center; I didn't want to engage in cinematography. At the very end I got a couple of seconds of the side view mirror so you can see how close the car actually is to the lane. At the very end it is basically on the lane so I had to take over

 

[vraev]

I thought it was just me. Every time I take it to service centre (160kms away) it goes quiet.

Omg. I even went on couple of test drives...both times I cannot reproduce the sound. I guess Tesla ensures the surrounding roads are perfectly even to make these sounds “seem normal”.

 

[clostridium]

Far too many threads on this topic I guess.

Here's an example from a different thread that I thought was in this thread.

While I will agree the sensing method Tesla choose is not ideal, it is what we have today. Those who wish to just keep their hands anywhere but on the wheel must never have experienced shorts changing encounters on the highway at speed where milliseconds count in an avoidance maneuver.

There are credible reports though of people who have experience with other Tesla cars, who find their newer Tesla requiring more steering effort to either disengage AS, or to cancel the nag. @Az_Rael is one I'd believe in this post, given her history. It's quite possible Tesla has changed steering H/W at some point, or something inside the box has changed, such that it is not calibrated the same from those of us who do not have problems with sensing "hands on wheel." In that case, Tesla needs to check into the problem further and modify what triggers sensing.

If I get a chance, I'll shoot and post a video showing how little effort it takes to cancel the nag. If others can't duplicate this simple single finger nudge of the wheel, they need to open a service center call ASAP as something has changed.

So maybe I won't have to shoot a video. I didn't watch it earlier, but @fasteddie7 posted his findings in this thread, at least for his older AP1 Tesla. Hey Fast, have you compared it with the AP2 Tesla yet? My late 2016 Ap2 has no problem with canceling nags at all.

I'm not disagreeing that it takes very little force to avoid the nag especially with the new version. My car is a late 2016 AP2 just like yours. My issue is simple - if I've got both hands on the wheel and I'm paying attention I shouldn't get the nag. When I get the nag it means the car thinks I haven't been holding the wheel for 20 seconds (or whatever the time period is now). And if some idiot smacks into me while I'm on autopilot and they pull the logs and the car says I didn't have hands on the wheel because of the bogus sensing mechanism that's going to greatly complicate my battle in the aftermath of the crash. Which troubles me quite a bit.

I'm glad that we agree that the sensing method is suboptimal. It bothers me that the sensing method actually nags me far less when I have a single hand on the wheel down near the 5 or 7 o'clock position rather than the proper way to hold a steering wheel that has airbags in it at 9 and 3. The car should encourage appropriate behaviors not encourage bad ones.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

I'm not disagreeing that it takes very little force to avoid the nag especially with the new version. My car is a late 2016 AP2 just like yours. My issue is simple - if I've got both hands on the wheel and I'm paying attention I shouldn't get the nag. When I get the nag it means the car thinks I haven't been holding the wheel for 20 seconds (or whatever the time period is now). And if some idiot smacks into me while I'm on autopilot and they pull the logs and the car says I didn't have hands on the wheel because of the bogus sensing mechanism that's going to greatly complicate my battle in the aftermath of the crash. Which troubles me quite a bit.

I'm glad that we agree that the sensing method is suboptimal. It bothers me that the sensing method actually nags me far less when I have a single hand on the wheel down near the 5 or 7 o'clock position rather than the proper way to hold a steering wheel that has airbags in it at 9 and 3. The car should encourage appropriate behaviors not encourage bad ones.

The main this is for your arms not to be blocking the airbag,
8 and 4 is also OK. 7 and 5 might be too. 6 is not because of stuff at the bottom of the wheel. 10 and 2 is bad because your arms are also in the way.

 

[Nick's Life]

Hey, I uncovered that the Nag Warning time is directly related to your speed. It appears to be: 40-45 sec at 40-50 mph, 30-35 sec at 65 mph; 25-27 sec at 70 mph; 23-25 sec at 75 mph; 18-20 sec at 80 mph. I'm pretty sure my Model 3 was 60 sec for all speeds before. My Model S HW1 was 3 mins for all speeds.

 

[jdw]

Today was the first time I drove over 65 with this release on the interstate. Yikes. Others have complained about it on previous releases, but this is the first time I've ever had the right-side-lane-bias problem. It seemed to only happen as the car went over 65 or so. All of a sudden it would drift to the right. I couldn't stand to pass trucks without taking over as it was just so close. And like others who have complained, the display showed it biasing right. Really a PITA. At first I thought I had engaged TACC but not actually AS. One time on a big curve I thought it was going to actually change lanes it was heading even further to the right.

Contrary to what you'd expect, I have found that gently pushing the wheel even further to the right causes the car to push back to the left and eventually recenter itself in the lane. Previously, I had fought the car trying to gently nudge it back a little to the left, but had no result with that. YMMV, but has worked repeatedly for me for a few days now. I'm hoping that it will eventually stick ...

 

[Az_Rael]

If I get a chance, I'll shoot and post a video showing how little effort it takes to cancel the nag. If others can't duplicate this simple single finger nudge of the wheel, they need to open a service center call ASAP as something has changed.

I messed around with the nags today just to see what the update had done. I hovered my hands over the wheel to induce the nag several times. Then I experimented with how much force was required to dismiss it. What I found was that in my car it was variable. Sometimes I could dismiss with just a brush of a couple of fingers, but other times it required a firm grip and downward force to dismiss. I tried driving with a lighter touch than my normal "AP Grip" also to mixed results. It wasn't eliciting the nag at the shortest interval, but the nag would still come up more often than my "AP Grip" method. (My "AP Grip" is a very firm hold of the wheel at ~4 o'clock with one hand applying a constant downward pressure to the wheel)

I think the torque sensor was tweaked to be a little more sensitive on my car than previously overall. I can avoid nags 100% of the time with my AP Grip method which wasn't always the case previously. However, my AP steering force required to disengage is just as high as it has always been, so they didn't change that. I imagine that folks who have a looser steering wheel than me probably can dismiss a nag all the time with just a couple of fingers.

 

[mrbulk]

Seems ever since first learning to drive I acquired the (bad) habit of hooking a wrist over the steering wheel somewhere, except now I do it a little left or right of center, just enough to put a small tug against Autopilot so it knows I'm there, but not enough to disengage it.

 

[daktari]

Yesterday we had some heavy rain. Anyone else noticed the autowipers do not go to full speed (continous) on setting low-1 or high-2? The fastest mine would wipe was 5 second intervals. It varied between 5 and 50 seconds in auto. I prefered manual full continous.

 

[Gig103]

Today I experienced the nag not clearing with my hands on the wheel. So I jiggled the steering wheel and it still nagged!! That is the most frustrating part b/c I tend to keep my hand rested on the wheel as we're supposed to, but it still thought I didn't have my hands present and the car never failed to realize it before. The amount of force I needed to shut up the nag ended up disengaging AP instead.

2014 AP1.

 

[conman]

Yesterday we had some heavy rain. Anyone else noticed the autowipers do not go to full speed (continous) on setting low-1 or high-2? The fastest mine would wipe was 5 second intervals. It varied between 5 and 50 seconds in auto. I prefered manual full continous.

I've not been happy with the auto wipers at any stage since they never seem to wipe frequently enough nor do they like going to a continuous wipe mode except in a torrential downpour.

 

[SA321]

2015. AP1. After this upgrade car crossed visible (and displayed) line into upcoming traffic lane in place where it had no issues in the past under similar weather conditions. Car cannot centre in the lane. The nagging is totally irrelevant as the AP is now unusable and for me personally is more dangerous than normal driving.