Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[sorka]

Electrek already has published an article about the issue:
Tesla owners see battery range drop after software update to 'improve longevity' - Electrek

Now we know it was an intentional measure and not a "bug".

Yup. Electrek wouldn't have published so quickly unless they had positive confirmation from Tesla.

Folks, it's time to start shopping for an attorney willing to take on a class. Most owners effected by this issue will have no idea what is going on. They'll be told by Tesla that it's normal degradation. A certified class will allow a law firm to send out notices to all possibly effected customers who can then be notified that it was not normal degradation and ask them to be part of the class.

 

[Sir Guacamolaf]

This is awful!

 

[sorka]

The comments are piling up quickly at the bottom of the article.

 

[Droschke]

Electrek already has published an article about the issue:
Tesla owners see battery range drop after software update to 'improve longevity' - Electrek

Now we know it was an intentional measure and not a "bug".

From Electrek:
"The company says that it is working to improve the impact of the update on the range for those owners."

I have no idea what this means. Anyone?

 

[sorka]

I tweeted the article.

Alan Waterman on Twitter

I have very few followers so it won't make much difference. Perhaps others can do the same and post the link here and I'll follow whomever tweets this.

 

[DJRas]

Electrek already has published an article about the issue:
Tesla owners see battery range drop after software update to 'improve longevity' - Electrek

Now we know it was an intentional measure and not a "bug".

Cool... that is my graph!

 

[sorka]

I was trying to respond to this post but couldn't because it was removed

 

[faughtz]

I tweeted the article.

Alan Waterman on Twitter

I have very few followers so it won't make much difference. Perhaps others can do the same and post the link here and I'll follow whomever tweets this.

Zane Faught on Twitter

 

[wk057]

Jason Hughes on Twitter

Anyone have a PT CAN (CAN3) log from a Model S affected by the rapid 85 kWh degradation issue in the latest software? Preferably at 95-100% SoC.

Have a theory, but no cars in my mini fleet have the issue. Examination of the BMS firmware isn't entirely clear on this yet.

Thanks!

 

[ord3r]

I'd even be fine with more strictness on fully charging. Like limiting it to twice a month and limiting the amount of time it can stay fully charged. Like if you charge to 100%, you better use it within 30 minutes or it will turn the AC full and actively chill the battery until the SOC drops below say 95% or heck even just chilling the battery as it approaches 100% so if you don't use it soon, you won't have 100% anymore.

BTW, limiting regen to 93% or below is going to cause accidents because unsuspecting drivers who are first subjected to this will end up rear ending other cars because their S didn't slow down like their used to and they weren't ready to move their foot to the brake pedal fast enough.

Agree on the first point, disagree on the second point. Tesla treats us like competent, even skilled, adults with regen behaviour. Read your instrument cluster and be prepared for the regen conditions. I'd rather not have this be dumbed down.

 

[sorka]

Agree on the first point, disagree on the second point. Tesla treats us like competent, even skilled, adults with regen behaviour. Read your instrument cluster and be prepared for the regen conditions. I'd rather not have this be dumbed down.

For me yes. For my wife. No. If the car suddenly behaves differently and doesn't slow down when it normally would, she'll be caught off guard. I agree with that we should be able to handle. I just don't think everyone will.

 

[ucmndd]

For me yes. For my wife. No. If the car suddenly behaves differently and doesn't slow down when it normally would, she'll be caught off guard. I agree with that we should be able to handle. I just don't think everyone will.

My car (75) has always had some amount of regen limitation above 90%. Sometimes shown on the energy dial. Sometimes not. But it’s definitely reduced.

 

[ucmndd]

This is the first post you've ever made that I disagree with. You and I always agree except for now.

• They made range claims with a disclaimer that normal degradation will reduce range over time. This is NOT degradation. It's intentionally removing access to existing capacity. They have not stated why officially and there's been no safety recall. The only thing we have to go on is a text from a CS rep and we know how reliable their information is
• They made performance claims that were never disclaimed even by normal degradation. If my 0-60 time drops significantly with or without range reduction, you can bet I'll be making a warranty claim whether it happens to be DU or battery related. This update will clearly limit performance given that it limits charge at the top and as such voltage will be lower at @ x amps given apples to apples SOC.
• Teslas still have lower rates of car fires compared to gas cars per capita. There is no reason to believe this done to prevent car fires. In fact, there's no reason to believe yet it was intentional for sure although there is a shred of maybe not so reliable communication from one Tesla employee.
• If the change was intentional, I'll bet it was done to slow degradation and reduce warranty claims. Not on my dime they don't. By your thinking, why stop at 10%. Why not reduce the access to available capacity by 30 or even 50%. After all, there's no warranty on range, right?

The only product I'm aware of that ever had a software update to lock out capacity was the Note 7 and that was done as a short term measure until Note 7 owners returned the phones.... FOR A FULL REFUND.

I'd be perfectly fine with Tesla updating the software to detect potentially hazardous conditions within the battery and to reduce range as long as that was accompanied by a "battery needs service" message so that the owner knows they need to make an appointment to have their battery replaced under warranty. But simply locking capacity out without any notice and any reason and doing it in such a way as to make it look like gradual degradation would be extremely slimy and I have no doubt would unite owners in a large class action.

For now, I'm going to give Tesla the benefit of the doubt and assume this a bug but that benefit of doubt will last a very short time if they don't respond to this with something other than the one screen shot of a text we've seen from an employee.

So glad I still have v8

I’ve come around a bit on my initial stance about this over the week as it’s unfolded. I still think the premise - making changes to the battery pack in the name of safety, even after the sale, even those that affect range or performance - is fair game and frankly the responsible thing to do.

But the way it was handled and (not) communicated is typical Tesla dumpster fire and is not excusable. Their explanation after the fact is weak and lame and the effects on certain cars certainly seem severe and beyond reasonable.

 

[darxsys]

I have an 85D, and I am supposed to start a 350 mile road trip in 10 minutes. I just randomly saw the electrek article and now I am scared of even checking what my range is. Wow Tesla, you are reaching new lows.

 

[faughtz]

Yup. Electrek wouldn't have published so quickly unless they had positive confirmation from Tesla.

Folks, it's time to start shopping for an attorney willing to take on a class. Most owners effected by this issue will have no idea what is going on. They'll be told by Tesla that it's normal degradation. A certified class will allow a law firm to send out notices to all possibly effected customers who can then be notified that it was not normal degradation and ask them to be part of the class.

That’s one approach, another might be CA Penal Code Section 502 c 1.

(c) Except as provided in subdivision (h), any person who commits any of the following acts is guilty of a public offense:

(1) Knowingly accesses and without permission alters, damages, deletes, destroys, or otherwise uses any data, computer, computer system, or computer network in order to either (A) devise or execute any scheme or artifice to defraud, deceive, or extort, or (B) wrongfully control or obtain money, property, or data.

 

[ucmndd]

That’s one approach, another might be CA Penal Code Section 502 c 1.

(c) Except as provided in subdivision (h), any person who commits any of the following acts is guilty of a public offense:

(1) Knowingly accesses and without permission alters, damages, deletes, destroys, or otherwise uses any data, computer, computer system, or computer network in order to either (A) devise or execute any scheme or artifice to defraud, deceive, or extort, or (B) wrongfully control or obtain money, property, or data.

That seems incredibly far fetched. You undoubtedly consented to OTA updates both in the initial purchase contract and when you clicked the “install” button for the latest update. This is certainly not computer intrusion.

 

[faughtz]

That seems incredibly far fetched. You undoubtedly consented to OTA updates both in the initial purchase contract and when you clicked the “install” button for the latest update. This is certainly not computer intrusion.

Agree, no alleged intrusion. But no permission to defraud or deceive, either.

 

[TJtv]

That seems incredibly far fetched. You undoubtedly consented to OTA updates both in the initial purchase contract and when you clicked the “install” button for the latest update. This is certainly not computer intrusion.

Did you miss all of the discussion about tesla force installing these updates even when the owner has explicitly chosen to not “click the install button”?

 

[ucmndd]

Did you miss all of the discussion about tesla force installing these updates even when the owner has explicitly chosen to not “click the install button”?

Has this happened to others beyond the OP in that long thread in the S forum? I honestly haven’t been following the thread too closely.

As I said above, likely immaterial as you’ve consented to OTA updates at purchase...

 

[bmah]

I have an 85D, and I am supposed to start a 350 mile road trip in 10 minutes. I just randomly saw the electrek article and now I am scared of even checking what my range is. Wow Tesla, you are reaching new lows.

Not everybody has experienced this loss of range, and I don't think there's a clear understanding in the community how common it is (to what fraction of cars Tesla has applied this "fix").


Bruce.