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Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

Droschke

Active Member
Mar 8, 2015
2,543
4,489
Future
With full thanks to David for his class action, I think this settlement is very pathetic. What Tesla did was to convert my car from a Travel car to a town car. I bought my 2016 S70 to do long distance travelling, which I did until Spring of 2019, Now, I can not use practically for any out-of-town travel due to capping and significantly due to charging time. That is not what I bargained for !!!!!!

If you are impacted by battery capping, your VIN# should be on the list Tesla maintains and your car's status should be under one of the categories listed in post#1, under the "Latest" section right at the top of the page. The Chargegate, for the reasons explained earlier by David, was not part of this lawsuit.

FYI, I'm still capped and suffer severely from Chargegate. Nevertheless, I support the settlement outcome. You can't have it all.
 
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cpa

Active Member
May 17, 2014
3,207
4,261
Central Valley
I'm sorry to say that, at least from this side of things, the lawsuit appears to have been severely bungled. Nobody applied any public heat to Tesla over this. The results could have been so different if a proper, aggressive law firm had handled this case. Pfft.

I don't know civil procedure. I ain't no shark in a three-piece suit with an Armani briefcase and a Montblanc fountain pen on my $25,000 cherry wood desk. I'm just a guy with a green eye shade, sleeve garters, and a mechanical pencil on a $1,200 desk that I purchased in 1995ish.

It is possible that an amended complaint would have set any potential mediation back another two years. It is possible that too much time had lapsed to file an amended complaint unless preliminary discovery revealed a correlative or causative situation with the original complaint.

As said upstream, holding Tesla's feet to a public bonfire would not have resulted in any constructive talks, despite what we perceive as a pittance, considering that the class wound up being shy of 1,750 US owners.

Sure, we all wanted the best possible result. But sometimes in life we need to accept the best result possible.
 

cpa

Active Member
May 17, 2014
3,207
4,261
Central Valley
I'm still fully capped but have not noticed the the AC fan in the cabin to be reset to setting #1. Has Tesla looked into this for you?

Um, I try not to contact Tesla Service via the handy-dandy phone app unless there is a definitive problem that I can point to and say, "Look! The windows don't work!" Nebulous issues result in pen pal communications or with a phone call from their person whose speech is only slightly slower than the speed of sound. And, I don't want to shell out $200 or whatever the spot price is today for a "diagnostic check" only to receive the standard, "your car is within specs."
I lose about 2 miles a day with the car parked and plugged in. That's always been the case for me even when I was not capped.

I don't know precisely where in the future you are currently stationed. Here in the present, I am in the hot interior valley of California. :) With daytime highs consistently 100-105, and overnight lows consistently 68-75 and our garage that won't even cool down at night to much below 80, perhaps there is more bleeding off of juice or other prophylactic measures that sap about 6-8 miles per day.
These obscure updates and the negative consequences for the owners prove we really don't 'own' these cars. Need regulations to stop this kind of abuse.

In our fairy tale, legislation would pass easily with bipartisan support to punish companies that tinkered with their products after purchase that reduced utility or performance. In our real world, they will let the marketplace and court system ferret out winners and losers.

Tesla may have an epiphany down the road if their market share starts to drop because of their corporate philosophies. Until then, Tesla will maintain its hard line approach and incur the occasional 7-and-8 figure settlements.
 

Droschke

Active Member
Mar 8, 2015
2,543
4,489
Future
I don't know civil procedure. I ain't no shark in a three-piece suit with an Armani briefcase and a Montblanc fountain pen on my $25,000 cherry wood desk. I'm just a guy with a green eye shade, sleeve garters, and a mechanical pencil on a $1,200 desk that I purchased in 1995ish.

It is possible that an amended complaint would have set any potential mediation back another two years. It is possible that too much time had lapsed to file an amended complaint unless preliminary discovery revealed a correlative or causative situation with the original complaint.

As said upstream, holding Tesla's feet to a public bonfire would not have resulted in any constructive talks, despite what we perceive as a pittance, considering that the class wound up being shy of 1,750 US owners.

Sure, we all wanted the best possible result. But sometimes in life we need to accept the best result possible.

There is a term for those that criticize other people but they themselves do not have any proper experience of the activity the other people have been doing. They are called armchair critics.

On Edit:
And, I'm referring to the critics of the settlement.
 
Last edited:
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Droschke

Active Member
Mar 8, 2015
2,543
4,489
Future
Um, I try not to contact Tesla Service via the handy-dandy phone app unless there is a definitive problem that I can point to and say, "Look! The windows don't work!" Nebulous issues result in pen pal communications or with a phone call from their person whose speech is only slightly slower than the speed of sound. And, I don't want to shell out $200 or whatever the spot price is today for a "diagnostic check" only to receive the standard, "your car is within specs."


I don't know precisely where in the future you are currently stationed. Here in the present, I am in the hot interior valley of California. :) With daytime highs consistently 100-105, and overnight lows consistently 68-75 and our garage that won't even cool down at night to much below 80, perhaps there is more bleeding off of juice or other prophylactic measures that sap about 6-8 miles per day.


In our fairy tale, legislation would pass easily with bipartisan support to punish companies that tinkered with their products after purchase that reduced utility or performance. In our real world, they will let the marketplace and court system ferret out winners and losers.

Tesla may have an epiphany down the road if their market share starts to drop because of their corporate philosophies. Until then, Tesla will maintain its hard line approach and incur the occasional 7-and-8 figure settlements.

There is a Future City in Kentucky and a Future City in Illinois. I fortunately live in neither one :)

Where I am, the temperature is not as high as Central Valley, CA, but it can get hot. Nevertheless my vampire drain is not as high as yours, observation-ally. And, I do not blame you for not reaching out to Tesla for issues as such. Who wants to be received as an unintelligent customer and to be given a moronic answer?

On the topic of the much needed EV regulations to stop the free rein possessed today by the companies leveraging their over-the-air software updates to act on their own authority and in their own benefit, we need such regulations. At least that's what my hope is. We need transparency on what these updates are going to do. "Fix minor bugs" message after you install the software when they have already taken a big chunk of your battery capacity away is utterly unacceptable.

Cheers.
 

bigsmooth125

Member
Oct 16, 2012
163
295
United States
You mean you did not amend your lawsuit to include chargegate? This seems like a most basic oversight on the class action's part. Tesla got a really sweet deal from people who did not demand enough. Restoration of range and/or $625 is a pittance and an insult. What you think you can get and what you actually get have nothing to do with fact and reality, and everything to do with how well you can bully the other side. Too bad none of that happened here, and too bad the plaintiffs negotiated with themselves and left everything on table.

I'm sorry to say that, at least from this side of things, the lawsuit appears to have been severely bungled. Nobody applied any public heat to Tesla over this. The results could have been so different if a proper, aggressive law firm had handled this case. Pfft.
I respect everything DJRas did on our behalf but I would have rejected the paltry settlement and gone to trial.
 
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Chaserr

Hyperactive Hyperdrive
Sep 5, 2017
2,666
5,597
Logan
I respect everything DJRas did on our behalf but I would have rejected the paltry settlement and gone to trial.
You still can. The settlement offer is paltry enough and dodges both the safety and charg issues that they themselves bring up in their "charge and thermal settings" fire safety admission on the day 2019.16 was released to make accepting this offer somewhat pointless, but a great starting point now that they have admitted to capping the top of the battery off intentionally and then hiding that fact for years.

Charge and thermal settings are still on the table for safety reasons. If this was just a small number of $650 fixes Tesla would have fixed all of us 18 months ago. This was just the amount of time it took them to come up with this particular story.
 

DJRas

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
May 9, 2017
646
2,951
Victorville, CA
You mean you did not amend your lawsuit to include chargegate? This seems like a most basic oversight on the class action's part. Tesla got a really sweet deal from people who did not demand enough. Restoration of range and/or $625 is a pittance and an insult. What you think you can get and what you actually get have nothing to do with fact and reality, and everything to do with how well you can bully the other side. Too bad none of that happened here, and too bad the plaintiffs negotiated with themselves and left everything on table.

I'm sorry to say that, at least from this side of things, the lawsuit appears to have been severely bungled. Nobody applied any public heat to Tesla over this. The results could have been so different if a proper, aggressive law firm had handled this case. Pfft.
Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, LLP (lieffcabraser.com/) (my legal team) is one of the top class action litigation teams in the country. Tesla hired Morrison & Foerster (MoFo.com) a top corporate defense law firm.
Read the rest of the paragraph about the charge-gate issue determining damages and grounds.
We did not negotiate this among ourselves and there is nothing left on the table. Battery capacity has been restored for all but a handfull of unique cars and many more have now had their batteries replaced under warranty.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion having never been involved directly in a lawsuit of this type yourself.
 

MP3Mike

Well-Known Member
Feb 1, 2016
16,155
36,447
Oregon
Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, LLP (lieffcabraser.com/) (my legal team) is one of the top class action litigation teams in the country. Tesla hired Morrison & Foerster (MoFo.com) a top corporate defense law firm.
Read the rest of the paragraph about the charge-gate issue determining damages and grounds.
We did not negotiate this among ourselves and there is nothing left on the table. Battery capacity has been restored for all but a handfull of unique cars and many more have now had their batteries replaced under warranty.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion having never been involved directly in a lawsuit of this type yourself.

If you could go back and you knew for a fact that Tesla was going to complete the remediation in a few months, would you go through with the law suit again? Do you feel that the effort worth the outcome? (I suspect that you put in way more than $1,625 worth of your time.)
 

MP3Mike

Well-Known Member
Feb 1, 2016
16,155
36,447
Oregon
@DJRas do you know what happens if multiple people owned an impacted vehicle during the covered period? Who gets the $625?
  • The owner at the start of the period?
  • The owner at the end of the period?
  • The current owner?
  • All the impacted owners get the full amount?
  • All the impacted owners split the $625 equally?
  • All the impacted owners split the $625 proportionally based on how long they owned during the covered period?
 

Gixx1300R

Member
Dec 30, 2017
729
1,233
orlando
Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, LLP (lieffcabraser.com/) (my legal team) is one of the top class action litigation teams in the country. Tesla hired Morrison & Foerster (MoFo.com) a top corporate defense law firm.
Read the rest of the paragraph about the charge-gate issue determining damages and grounds.
We did not negotiate this among ourselves and there is nothing left on the table. Battery capacity has been restored for all but a handfull of unique cars and many more have now had their batteries replaced under warranty.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion having never been involved directly in a lawsuit of this type yourself.
I must be one of those handfuls since my battery is capped at 62kw, it was 77kw before all of this happened. Much thanks for all of your efforts
 
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DJRas

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
May 9, 2017
646
2,951
Victorville, CA
If you could go back and you knew for a fact that Tesla was going to complete the remediation in a few months, would you go through with the law suit again? Do you feel that the effort worth the outcome? (I suspect that you put in way more than $1,625 worth of your time.)
Short answer, YES.
I was never about the money. I knew we wouldn't get new batteries ($20k).
I believe we would have never gotten remediation and would have remained capped without the lawsuit and the data we were able to present. Remember that Tesla claimed for months that this was "normal degradation" and not covered at all with no recourse and only "very few cars were affected".
 

DJRas

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
May 9, 2017
646
2,951
Victorville, CA
@DJRas do you know what happens if multiple people owned an impacted vehicle during the covered period? Who gets the $625?
  • The owner at the start of the period?
  • The owner at the end of the period?
  • The current owner?
  • All the impacted owners get the full amount?
  • All the impacted owners split the $625 equally?
  • All the impacted owners split the $625 proportionally based on how long they owned during the covered period?
I cannot disclose details at this time. You will no doubt see it in the court records before I have a chance to post it.
 

keshkkeshk

New Member
Mar 28, 2021
3
5
ca
U
Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, LLP (lieffcabraser.com/) (my legal team) is one of the top class action litigation teams in the country. Tesla hired Morrison & Foerster (MoFo.com) a top corporate defense law firm.
Read the rest of the paragraph about the charge-gate issue determining damages and grounds.
We did not negotiate this among ourselves and there is nothing left on the table. Battery capacity has been restored for all but a handfull of unique cars and many more have now had their batteries replaced under warranty.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion having never been involved directly in a lawsuit of this type yourself.
How exactly you go by and find if Battery capacity has been restored? I don't have any tools or gadgets that measure cells voltages.
 

fbitz777

Member
Apr 6, 2016
432
567
Wexford, PA
Out of curiosity which is the first software version that restored the lost/capped range?

MY '17 X75 is now on 2020.48.37.6 and definitely still capped (as I get REGEN at 100% SOC)

However after the 2020.48.37.6 was deployed to my car two weeks ago (why such a delay?) my Chargegate was fixed for me....I am getting my nice predictable charge curves and times (70 minutes to charge 0-100%)
 

Smiles83

Member
Sep 22, 2016
76
165
Edmonton
Elon Musk addresses the settlement on twitter
 

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jpvdheijn

Member
Oct 30, 2018
708
614
Baarle-Nassau, NL
That will NEVER be paid.
I tried to follow this claim against tesla in Norway. I don't know what happened after the media jumped on the bandwagon in May. Tesla had time until 17th of June to react and guess what it is all silent. Seeing how much effort it took for @DJRas to get to this outcome with his team. And knowing that supercharging rates are not specifically mentioned in any document of tesla makes me feel this will defenatly not be paid.
 
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