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Superchargers super-slow

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Logical Fallacy: Argument from Ignorance.

You're making the claim, the burden of proof is on you, no one else.

False. The "null hypothesis" is also a claim.

TeslaEV claims that "Tesla is NOT throttling supercharging."

There is no proof either to my or his claim. Only Tesla knows the answer. But I think it is more likely than not, that software is being used to set the charging rate. The precise algorithm and reasons behind the algorithm remain a mystery to everyone except Tesla.

No one has come up with any viable explanation to explain the lowered charging rates that doesn't involve a software limitation. I'd love to hear some logical counter argument.
 
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One pattern I saw on a recent road trip was to see the rate quickly ramp to say 110KW when first plugged in but then immediately start dropping and find a stable point in the 70s or 80s. If the car thinks it should be charging in the 70s or 80s why ramp up to 110 in the first place?
 
One pattern I saw on a recent road trip was to see the rate quickly ramp to say 110KW when first plugged in but then immediately start dropping and find a stable point in the 70s or 80s. If the car thinks it should be charging in the 70s or 80s why ramp up to 110 in the first place?

Most likely there are some software tweaks and safety systems in place that kick in. The car starts charging unrestricted, then some safety feature kicks in and reduces the rate.
 
False. The "null hypothesis" is also a claim.

TeslaEV claims that "Tesla is NOT throttling supercharging."

There is no proof either to my or his claim.

That's not what null hypothesis means. Null hypothesis isn't an assertion of anything, which is exactly the point of it. It's the baseline from which a testable hypothesis is derived. I think you are conflating this with the colloquial concept of a position being possible/plausible, which is different from a position being proven.


No one has come up with any viable explanation to explain the lowered charging rates that doesn't involve a software limitation. I'd love to hear some logical counter argument.

Do you have a dataset of all supercharger usage for the past year that includes charge rates, charge duration, starting/ending charge percentage, battery size/age, temperature during charge, and period between charges? That would be required to put together any trend analysis. It's not possible to analyze anecdotes.
 
Do you have a dataset of all supercharger usage for the past year that includes charge rates, charge duration, starting/ending charge percentage, battery size/age, temperature during charge, and period between charges? That would be required to put together any trend analysis. It's not possible to analyze anecdotes.

No, do you?

Bottom line is, only Tesla knows what is really going on. Your guess is as good as mine, which is at least as good as TexasEV. It is impossible for Tesla fans to claim as fact that Tesla isn't throttling charging rates.

Like someone mentioned above, assuming this isn't something nefarious, the most plausible explanation is new software that artificially limiting charging based on sensor data either in the car on charging hardware.
 
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No, do you?

I do not. Hence, I am not performing analysis or making conclusions

It is impossible for Tesla fans to claim as fact that Tesla isn't throttling charging rates.

This position isn't being asserted.

Like someone mentioned above, assuming this isn't something nefarious, the most plausible explanation is new software that artificially limiting charging based on sensor data either in the car on charging hardware.

We just agreed that we do not have a dataset to analyze. Anecdotes cannot be analyzed. Thus, it is not possible to identify patterns, which is required before the process of explanation can begin. There is nothing to "plausibly explain."
 
So I've been talking to some other owners who are using the exact superchargers as me but getting 30kW+ higher charge rates than I am under identical circumstances.

So, at least in my case, it appears that the issue is with my car and not with the superchargers. I've reached out to my local (2.5 hours away) service center to hopefully get it in for serious analysis.
 
Do you use local superchargers frequently? I wonder if they throttle frequent local users, or have some other surreptitious algorithm. This is pure speculation on my part.

Throttling people that abuse the system would do the opposite. It would keep them occupying a Supercharger even longer. Looking at my logs (I have supercharged more than 500 times) also throws out that theory. The reduced rate is not happening at local stations but randomly at stations far away from home. I also had times where I lost access to my home charger for a week and used local Superchargers all the time and never saw any throttling.
 
Do you use local superchargers frequently? I wonder if they throttle frequent local users, or have some other surreptitious algorithm. This is pure speculation on my part.
And remember under the new 'rules', local supercharging is not a no-no any longer. Smacks of 'we were always at war with Eastasia' sort of thing, but now anyone can use any Supercharger for anything. It's *preferable* to charge at home, if it's at all possible (before I get yelled at :confused: ). But the point is, there can't be any algorithm for tracking people by home address, etc., even though that could have been a possible idea, say, a year ago.
 
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So I've been talking to some other owners who are using the exact superchargers as me but getting 30kW+ higher charge rates than I am under identical circumstances.

So, at least in my case, it appears that the issue is with my car and not with the superchargers. I've reached out to my local (2.5 hours away) service center to hopefully get it in for serious analysis.

What is your build? Ask them to open a TDS with engineering (technical diagnostics session). I once had this done.
 
I charged at Southampton, NY SC on Friday night and got a very good result. Rolled in with 37 rated miles in the tank and plugged into stall 2A. there was another Model X plugged into a stall way on the other end of the line in what felt like 4A or B which is closer to the amenities at this location. i got 115/116 kW and 115/114 kW for over 10 minutes and replenished 110 miles in 20 minutes which I consider very, very good. I hung out for about 40 minutes until my car had 220 miles "in the tank" and then went off to get something to eat.

One thing I did notice is that it dropped form 115 kW to 90 kW and then after a few minutes it dropped to 60 kW and then 50 kW. By then the SOC on my battery was pretty high so I wasn't complaining.

I didn't need to SC but the road in front of my home was flooded due to high tide and I figured I'd wait for the water to go down rather than damage my car. So it was more about killing time then SCing.

I was very pleased with the SC result and now I am wondering if it is just Tarrytown and Paramus SC that give me poor results and if these are giving me poor results b/c I am a "local" to there chargers. My car had been in the shop for 2-3 weeks in May and I just got it back early last week (rear passenger quarter panel repair) so I haven't had much of a chance to test out the SC. Last month in Tarrytown my SC experience was terrible but it was a pretty crowded SC day. I would also try JFK SC which is "local" to me if it weren't such a PITA to get to traffic-wize.
 
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I was very pleased with the SC result and now I am wondering if it is just Tarrytown and Paramus SC that give me poor results and if these are giving me poor results b/c I am a "local" to there chargers.
No, defective supercharger stalls are defective for everyone. Please don't start this "locals are getting throttled" conspiracy theory nonsense all over again.
 
I was in Augusta Maine this Memorial Day weekend, and attempted to charge at the 8 port supercharger there. I was the only one there the whole time. The first port I used (I was at 5% capacity), charged at first at 95 kW, and then slowed down to 65 kW. I felt the handle and it was very warm so I moved to a different port. That got me the 98 kW that I expect from my 75D.

I placed a call to Tesla support and got a call back in about 25 minutes (right before I left) and I was told that I was correct, the handle on 1B was overheating. I asked if their Supercharger department was going to fix this but did not get an answer.

The strange thing is that the phone call was less about the slowness of the port and more the Tesla employee telling me that FSD is hard, and that it will eventually be better (I never mentioned FSD in my phone call) which I thought was strange.

I eventually parked sideways in the location so I could use two different ports to test the speed difference.
 
No, defective supercharger stalls are defective for everyone. Please don't start this "locals are getting throttled" conspiracy theory nonsense all over again.

God it feels like we can't even speak to our experience without getting our head chewed off on this forum anymore.

@TexasEV:

You need to relax. or otherwise learn how to talk to people. your response was uncalled for and not appreciated. If you don't like what I have to say feel free to block me.
 
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God it feels like we can't even speak to our experience without getting our head chewed off on this forum anymore.

@TexasEV:

You need to relax. or otherwise learn how to talk to people. your response was uncalled for and not appreciated. If you don't like what I have to say feel free to block me.

Agreed. Try to say anything negative about Tesla here and the "fanboys" come out of the woodwork and call you a "troll". Most of these fanboys have ownership or positions of TSLA stock or somehow subscribe to the cult mentality that Tesla can do no wrong. Best to ignore them so real consumers like us can get an honest opinion about the product and ownership experience, both good and bad.
 
I had an interesting experience yesterday. Pulled up to the Mt. Shasta supercharger with 12% of the battery left(Ignore my sig, I just upgraded to the 75), took stall 2A, temperature outside was in the low 90's. There was a Model X on 2B, so I expected to charge at around 45-50kW. Instead, on plugging in, it showed 15kW(with a 4 1/2 hour estimate on charging to full). That lasted for about 10-15 minutes, before the rate suddenly went up to 40kW. 10-15 minutes later, it went back down to 15kW and that cycle repeated until the Model X eventually left, and the rate shot up to 95kW and did the normal slow taper down as the battery filled.

I've seen fluctuations like that before on defective chargers, but in those cases, it fluctuated even when mine was the only car there and the handle would get hot.
 
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I sent the following case to Tesla last week after a service center Seattle visit. They are escalating the case to engineering. I took pictures of the charge screens to corroborate this:

"I am currently charging at the Centralia supercharger. I arrived at 2:34pm with 10% SoC, outside temperatures in the mid 80s, driving a car that was well warmed up (3.5 hour drive to the service center this morning, several short charging spurts at the service center, then 2.5 hour drive [heavy traffic on I-5] to the supercharger here in Centralia), and I picked a stall that wasn’t being shared with another Tesla (I plugged in at 1A – no Tesla on 1B).


After allowing a few minutes for the charge to ramp up, my charge rate was only 50 kW at 13% SoC. At 20% SoC, I was charging at 52 kW. At 31% SoC, I was charging at 52 kW.


These slow charge rates prompted me to move to stall 3A. There was no Tesla at 3B. My car suddenly jumped up to 84 kW at 33% SoC. At 41% SoC, I was charging at 86 kW. For reference, 87 kW is the fastest I have been able to supercharge since last summer. Last summer, shortly after taking delivery of the car, I was able to supercharge much faster than that.


At 42% SoC, A model X entered and hooked up to stall 3B. From what I have read, the newly arriving Tesla’s charge rate should be throttled since I was here first. However, after the X hooked up, my charge rate plummeted to the 40 kW range. By 49% SoC, I was maxing out at 56 kW. By 59% SoC, My max rate was 49 kW.


At 60% SoC, it was now 3:14pm. I started charging at 2:34pm. That means it took 40 minutes to get a 50% charge.


Regardless of the throttling, I know that these speeds, even my max speed, is not normal. There must be some explanation as to why my charge speeds are so slow now. I have used many superchargers in 3 different states since last fall and, no matter the conditions, I cannot charge faster than 87 kW. Most of the time I am charging MUCH slower than that (as demonstrated by the case above)."