Tax Bill and EV Tax Credit Discussion

[geneclean55]

hmm. I hope you are right. I read "Amendments to This Amendment" to be those amendments that actually did amend because they passed. but maybe not. If those are just all the amendments proposed, whether they passed or not, then we still don't know for sure.


View attachment 264178



edit to add: it looks 1806 was submitted by Kamala Harris, and without looking to see what it was, I doubt it was agreed to. So if that list isn't the list of amendments that actually passed, then were the F is it?

For example: amendment 1798 from Warren (D) is also on the same list as Flake's.

Amendment 1798: Strike corp reduction and estate/gift tax provisions; forgive all fed student debt.

You think Republicans voted affirmatively on that? lol

 

[bhzmark]

For example: amendment 1798 from Warren (D) is also on the same list as Flake's.

Amendment 1798: Strike corp reduction and estate/gift tax provisions; forgive all fed student debt.

You think Republicans voted affirmatively on that? lol

I agree. See my analysis further up from many minutes ago.

 

[turnbowm]

But for those buying the Model 3 it does. 7500 is a 15% discount on the first production LR model - or if you want, the way it gets to similar price with BMW 3 series. I will consider other cars without the incentives.

Absolutely. I'm sure a lot of M3 reservations will be cancelled if the tax credit goes away. Same goes for those considering a future purchase of other PHEVs and EVs (Volt, Bolt, Leaf, etc.).

 

[T34ME]

Maybe the OEMs will just reduce the price of their cars by $7,500...

 

[brkaus]

Absolutely. I'm sure a lot of M3 reservations will be cancelled if the tax credit goes away. Same goes for those considering a future purchase of other PHEVs and EVs (Volt, Bolt, Leaf, etc.).

I'll switch to a SR from an LR.

I think its too late to pickup a Bolt, Leaf this year. Haven't seen any at dealers in the area.

 

[kengchang]

Someone might have to go through the C-SPAN stream to find out

 

[AdamEKM]

Even the Senators who voted for or against the tax bill couldn't tell us exactly what was in it.

 

[Big Earl]

I'll switch to a SR from an LR.

I think its too late to pickup a Bolt, Leaf this year. Haven't seen any at dealers in the area.

Not sure where your area is, but there are plenty of Bolts in inventory around the DC metro region. 185 within 50 miles, according to Autotrader.

As for the EV tax credit, this definitely stinks for the immediate future of EV sales in the US. Tesla will do fine, but the other mainstream automakers will struggle to be competitive with Tesla being several years ahead.

As for my Model 3 reservation, I think we're going to buy it even without the possibility of the federal tax credit. The vehicle itself is too good to consider anything else and Tesla's charging infrastructure makes them the only manufacturer selling truly road trip-capable EVs. Sure you can take a Bolt on a road trip, but it gains range at half the speed of a Tesla at the few-and-far-between CCS stations.

 

[turnbowm]

To me if you wanted to continue to improve air quality and cut expenditures, continue the EV credit but only for Zero emmision vehicles, dump the plug-in credit on those "compliance" vehicles. For the vast majority of those miles able to be driven on those cars, they still put out more carbon emissions than not.

An interesting idea that has merit. As for PHEVs, the wife's Volt has an all-electric range (AER) of 38 miles, after which the gas engine (37mpg) kinks in. Her lifetime all-electric average for 27,500 miles is 86%.

 

[seattlite2004]

I'll switch to a SR from an LR.

I think its too late to pickup a Bolt, Leaf this year. Haven't seen any at dealers in the area.

I've been tempted for almost a month now on a 2017 Premier Bolt for about $38K at a local dealer....that's at least $5k off MSRP.

 

[PoitNarf]

This now takes me full circle -- I don't think the Senate bill repealed the EV tax credit. Flake's 1746 amendment didn't pass. and the repeal wasn't in the substitute bill 1618 which did pass, and we don't know the repeal to be in any other amendment that did actually pass.

@ohmman I move to change the thread title

edit to add: this analysis agrees: Federal EV tax credit appears to have been left intact and unchanged in the Senate's tax bill. • r/teslamotors

Good investigative work! I hope you’re right!

 

[TEG]

This whole situation feels like a gut punch that knocked the wind out of me. I am sick to my stomach.

 

[bhzmark]

To confirm that the Senate bill did not include a 30D repeal, we need to find the text of these amendments that did pass:

 

[kengchang]

This whole situation feels like a gut punch that knocked the wind out of me. I am sick to my stomach.

Only 3~5 GOP House members from CA out of 35 voted no on the House Bill. Who exactly are they working for? Trump it seems.

 

[RubberToe]

Someone in the California legislature needs to introduce a bill Monday morning to increase the EV incentive from $2,500 to $5,000. Most recent quarterly cap and trade revenue supporting these was $862 million.

Governor Brown is a bit of a showman. He should sign the bill that afternoon and make it effective 1-1-18.

Democrats have supermajorities in both houses. Steam roll the neanderthal Cretins.

RT

 

[Webeevdrivers]

We’ll, this tax credit thingy is an American thing right. I get the impression that a lot of Tesla’s are exported. I can’t see this tax thing affecting that at all. It may be a boost for the Bolt and any remaining first generation leaf stock (if there is any) to sell in the next 29 days but for the rest of the world it means nothing for someone’s decision to buy an EV.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

This now takes me full circle -- I don't think the Senate bill repealed the EV tax credit. Flake's 1746 amendment didn't pass. and the repeal wasn't in the substitute bill 1618 which did pass, and we don't know the repeal to be in any other amendment that did actually pass.




I think which amendments were agreed to is found at this page which shows amendments that passed, ruled out of order, or lay still born.

View attachment 264179

1746 seems to be in the still born category: no "Latest action" showing that it passed:

View attachment 264180


This now takes me full circle -- I don't think the Senate bill repealed the EV tax credit. Flake's 1746 amendment didn't pass. and the repeal wasn't in the substitute bill 1618 which did pass, and we don't know the repeal to be in any other amendment that did actually pass.

@ohmman I move to change the thread title

edit to add: this analysis agrees: Federal EV tax credit appears to have been left intact and unchanged in the Senate's tax bill. • r/teslamotors

Somebody posted something a couple of minutes ago on reddit suggesting that in fact it repeals it.


Federal EV tax credit appears to have been left intact and unchanged in the Senate's tax bill. • r/teslamotors

If this PDF is the bill:
https://www.congress.gov/115/bills/hr1/BILLS-115hr1pcs.pdf
On Page 76, it strikes Section 30D, which is the EV tax credit.

 

[bhzmark]

Somebody posted something a couple of minutes ago on reddit suggesting that in fact it repeals it.


Federal EV tax credit appears to have been left intact and unchanged in the Senate's tax bill. • r/teslamotors

If this PDF is the bill:
https://www.congress.gov/115/bills/hr1/BILLS-115hr1pcs.pdf
On Page 76, it strikes Section 30D, which is the EV tax credit.

That pdf is not what passed the Senate. That is merely the House bill that the Senate started with, but it was totally replaced with the amendment in the form of a substitute bill S. 1618. This substitute Senate bill, in its original form as of Nov 30 did not contain the 30D repeal. The substitute bill itself was only amended 3 (maybe 4) times but none of those amendments was Flake's evil 1746 but we still can't confirm what was in the amendments that were adopted.

 

[powertoold]

Moral of the story: no one in the US even knows what passed in its entirety, lol

 

[K-MTG]

Someone in the California legislature needs to introduce a bill Monday morning to increase the EV incentive from $2,500 to $5,000. Most recent quarterly cap and trade revenue supporting these was $862 million.

Governor Brown is a bit of a showman. He should sign the bill that afternoon and make it effective 1-1-18.

Democrats have supermajorities in both houses. Steam roll the neanderthal Cretins.

RT

I wish they also get rid of the $300k income cap...with pricing of property these days in the O.C even that is not enough.