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Taycan Takedown
- Thread starter evalst2018
- Start date
Yea just watched it as I opened this thread. Funny that Bjørn brags about pronouncing Porsche correctly but keeps saying Taycan WRONG as does about 99%. While a little obtuse It is not pronounced Tay-can or Taken. It is pronounced Tie-con.
Tie-con
CarlK
Active Member
The title is misleading. It set a record for 4dr electric sedans. 7:42 is still a little slower than what Panamera got. A little disappointed that Porsche can't or does not want to disrupt its ICE cars.
7:42 is front drive level record, same as civic type R. For the price point above 150k I would expect it to go at most 7:30.
@MountainPass waiting for your model 3 Nordschleife spec!
I am glad porche is distracting us with useless facts around aspects of the car that don't really matter. I do not remember the last time, I took into account lap times at nurburging by a professional driver when making a car purchase.
But the facts that matter:
- Range is considerably less than a cheaper Model S ( 370 vs 300(?) 20%less)
- acceleration is not even as fast as a 2015 P85D, most folks dont need to race the car 30 times in a row down a track (useless datapoint)
- Only seats 4
- Limited charging network with sub par user experience
- Costs 20% more
But the facts that matter:
- Range is considerably less than a cheaper Model S ( 370 vs 300(?) 20%less)
- acceleration is not even as fast as a 2015 P85D, most folks dont need to race the car 30 times in a row down a track (useless datapoint)
- Only seats 4
- Limited charging network with sub par user experience
- Costs 20% more
Eno Deb
Active Member
Right. If any Tesla came close to such a time, I'd bet people here would start 4th of July fireworks.
7:42 is excellent for a heavy sedan. That's Cayman GT4 territory.
Porsche is not distracting us with useless facts. Porsche is pre hyping and doing a GREAT job of it. Also it is NOT a fact that it is not as fast. It is SPECULATION. Porsche COULD very well be sandbagging on the performance and saying it is about 3.5 for a surprise. On Sep 4 is the reveal and then the hard numbers will be announced.
I doubt it ... if they want to keep selling ICE cars. But they should be capable of having a 0-60 under 3 seconds.
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AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
The Taycan is going to be far more of a driver’s car than Model S.
The charging network is an issue.
If it gets 300 miles of EPA range ( I thought it would be less but it appears to have a very large battery), that would be pretty remarkable - there are very few vehicles with that much range right now.
This looks like it is going to be an excellent car that people can actually drive on a daily basis, based on what we know. We should all be thrilled.
The only major issue I see for acceptance is the charging network. The cost is a non-issue for Porsche owners.
I would be extremely surprised if it does not end up at sub-3 seconds 0-60 (not including rollout) for the highest trim level.
Eno Deb
Active Member
Right. If any Tesla came close to such a time, I'd bet people here would start 4th of July fireworks.
7:42 is excellent for a heavy sedan. That's Cayman GT4 territory.
Of course!!!!!....as long as Tesla didn’t lose the other benefits as stated earlier. But as a consumer who drives in normal traffic looking for a vehicle, I’d sure rather have what Tesla currently offers.
Eno Deb
Active Member
Honestly, if I were shopping for a car in this price class right now, I'd be tempted by the Porsche over a Model S just because it will likely have immaculate build quality and a service organization that doesn't take months in the bodyshop to repair damages from a fender bender. By the time the Taycan is delivered in the US, the Electrify America network will be usable for most road trips, similar to the supercharger network a few years ago.
I always enjoy reading your thoughtful posts Alan.
There's a lot of contentiousness on this thread. Some of it no doubt comes from the fact that Porsche has earned an enormous amount of respect for their undeniable performance car and racing car achievements. And yet the performance weaknesses of this very expensive Taycan relative to both the slightly less expensive Tesla S and the much less expensive Model 3 Performance are undeniable.
I think it illustrates just how far out in front Tesla is currently, in relationship to the critical Tech areas of motor, electronic, battery and charging technology. I do think the Taycan on the other hand underscores how the Model S is badly in need of a chassis, battery, and overall refresh. I'm sure they could incorporate some of the cooling technology that was put into the Model 3 to make its performance more repeatable, while giving it a much better and less ponderous feeling chassis.
From its side, the Porsche Taycan is saddled with relatively poor range, and (IMHO) even poorer styling from the Panabanana Americana
. But I'm sure it's going to be a great driver's car, at least relative to its weight, which is likely north of 4600 lbs. Even aside from that, it's got some real issues - I'll be stunned if it can do 200 miles at 80 miles an hour without running into nailbiting range anxiety, so it's 0 to 200 kph time is pretty much irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. Similarly, all the hype about repeatability (obviously aimed at the Model S's Achilles' heel) is of interest only for people who care more about bragging rights than about living with the car on a day-to-day basis.So I think the Taycan illustrates that even the elite "real" auto manufacturers are serious finally about EV's, points to some areas that Tesla needs to work on, especially on its flagship sedan, but also confirms Tesla's fundamental advantages in the core technologies that will break or make electric vehicle acceptance and transition.
And it sure does give @MountainPass a target on Nurbergring! Can't wait to see them beat it!
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Eno Deb
Active Member
The Taycan is software limited to 250km/h.
Unlikely. The Taycan in this trim level has much faster top-end acceleration and better brakes.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
I wonder if this is the high performance version of the Taycan...did it say? I didn’t have time to research...
We’ll see. We’ll need to see the specs. Unlikely to be faster than a P100DL of course but I am talking overall performance. It looks likely to be impressive.
We’ll see. If it has a 95kWh battery like the incredibly inefficient e-tron, I think that 200 miles should be no issue. It is true that every other manufacturer seems to struggle with efficiency. We’ll see how Porsche does with their transmission (which may help at 80mph) and aero. They should be set up for success.
I said ~200 miles in an earlier post - but with the speculative 95kWh battery it should do much better than that. I guess I expect 230-250 miles at 80mph (EPA range will be higher of course). We will see. It’s actually the thing I am most interested in. It’s likely to be awesome in nearly every other respect. For the price, it should be!
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