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I won't deny that Apple has an uncanny ability to sell their products and I won't downplay the coolness of their products, but what real innovation has their $95B brought since 2011 compared to Tesla's innovation in the same time period? What could Tesla have done with $95B in those same years?

Maybe you ought to compare Apple to Intel. Because Apple has delivered serious chip improvements year after year like clockwork (for phones and iPads). If Intel had delivered like that, the chip market would look a lot different today, Apple wouldn't be planning on laptops with their own silicon, nobody would be bidding $40B for ARM. If Tesla had improved their FSD hardware at the Apple pace, wow! Not that Tesla did badly with HW3, but it's been more than a year and there's no news on HW4... I think Apple has set the standard.

That said, I have no idea how much of their R&D budget that consumed.
 
This post caught my eye so I went back over the financial statements for Apple and Tesla from 2011 until now to compare their R&D expenditures.

Tesla: About $8 billion total R&D expenditures from 2011 through 2020.
Apple: About $95 billion during the same time period.

I won't deny that Apple has an uncanny ability to sell their products and I won't downplay the coolness of their products, but what real innovation has their $95B brought since 2011 compared to Tesla's innovation in the same time period? What could Tesla have done with $95B in those same years?

If Tesla had had $95B to spend we'd be driving our Teslas around on Mars right now.
The law of diminishing returns is in play here. A phone can only be so small, it's screen can only be so clear etc.
 
The bigger the rise into Battery Day, the more concerned I grow with a selloff after -- unless we get something truly mindblowing. Thoughts? I feel like this forum has been collectively burned on this more times than I can remember. Could this time really be different?

I think the stock will rise into battery day, and more after. Auto-bidder / virtual power plants is the game changer the media and analysts don't see coming. It's real, it's operating now, and nobody really knows about it yet. All I hear them talking about is million mile battery and a bit about dry electrodes. Expectations are way too low. The scope of Tesla's energy ambitions will finally be apparent, and they already have almost $14B to make it happen.
 
Greatly expanded MY production is a cash cow ready and waiting to start being milked next year.

Good point I agree with most of what you say.

IMO Cybertruck is a similar cash cow in terms of demand and margin, but probably on a much slower ramp....

For Fremont Model Y the production the limitation is most probably paint or casting. and ramping GA

If Model 3 also migrates to using casting the combined limit of Model 3/Y at Fremont is casting and/or paint...

At some stage Tesla might want to migrate Model 3 to casting to free up body shop robots for possible redeployment at Austin.

Overall if Model Y and Cybertruck at Austin can't be done in parallel, I agree Model Y has the likely priority.

If the can be done in parallel and doing that only slows Model Y do 10-15%, IMO Cybertruck has priority.
Fair chance Elon gets personally involved in Cybertruck if it hits issues, and perhaps even if it doesn't

Maurer speculates that Shanghai GF is being built up to eventually produce 650K vehicles, 200K M3 and 450K MY. That squares with Musk statements that Tesla believes MY's potential demand will be far greater than M3.

This was not specified it could be the other way around 450K M3 and 200K MY, my logic is Model Y production didn't start in August and like Fremont is ramping up overtime...

Long term both Fremont and Shanghai will eventually make more MY than M3.

If this 450K per year run rate for Model 3 in China was achieved, that may help explain why Tesla is exporting Model 3 from China.

Perhaps it also may be that there is less Model 3 production at Fremont and more Model Y.

I've often speculated that we don't know the "run-rate" of the casting process, that seems to be partially validated by the deployment of multiple casting machines.

But I think "Paint/Casting Run-rate = No of casting machines"... Tesla will try to optimize this equation, not much point in having more casting than paint or the other way around.

I'm assuming moving to casting frees up some Stamping, it probably does if Model 3 migrates...
 
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TSLA is the largest holding in ARK's ETFs. Nevertheless, to maintain balance ARK often sells a modest number of TSLA shares on its big up days.

ARK actually bought TSLA shares at its recent bottom on September 8. ARK has not traded any TSLA shares since then despite its big up moves.

Today's trading report from ARK.

upload_2020-9-15_17-20-48.png
 
I think the main guy that did the chips for Apple is at Tesla, making their FSD chips.


Jim Keller.

He was with Apple for 4 years... Only at Tesla for 2 and he left Tesla a while ago-early 2018- he doesn't tend to stay super long at companies.

He was at the neuralink demo allegedly though which was interesting.
 
TSLA is the largest holding in ARK's ETFs. Nevertheless, to maintain balance ARK often sells a modest number of TSLA shares on its big up days.

ARK actually bought TSLA shares at its recent bottom on September 8. ARK has not traded any TSLA shares since then despite its big up moves.

Today's trading report from ARK.

View attachment 588630

ARK has almost doubled this year... Cathie is dunking on those overpaid Wall Street scrubs.
 
I'm watching the apple event. It's amazing that the company with a larger pile of cash company in the world devotes a section of a annual event to a silicon watch band with no buckle as a major development. I can't even imagine what tesla could accomplish with that same cash pile. This is just making me feel more and.ore confident Tesla is going to be the world's most massive company in the world and hold that title for a long time.

Voted disagree due to the fact they actually didn't treat a "silicon watch band with no buckle" as a major development.

It was a very minor brief part of the new Apple Watch announcement, a product which has quickly developed into the closest thing we have to the Star Trek "tricorder" in that it is a relatively cheap mass market device measuring multiple human health vitals in real time in a completely non-invasive manner, and saving peoples lives every day via inbuilt alerts of impending health issues and automated 911 communication in the event of incapacitation.

Apple has and continues to spend tens of billions of dollars in health tech research to make very accessible products that is better than what was only previously available in very high cost specialist devices.
 
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Maybe you ought to compare Apple to Intel. Because Apple has delivered serious chip improvements year after year like clockwork (for phones and iPads). If Intel had delivered like that, the chip market would look a lot different today, Apple wouldn't be planning on laptops with their own silicon, nobody would be bidding $40B for ARM. If Tesla had improved their FSD hardware at the Apple pace, wow! Not that Tesla did badly with HW3, but it's been more than a year and there's no news on HW4...
Apple is in a different position than Tesla. I don't expect an HW4 announcement until it can be made like this: All cars made from the beginning of the month now have HW4. I doubt if HW4 can run the current code (and if it could, it wouldn't be worth Tesla's time porting), so I don't expect to see HW4 until the rewritten code is released.
 
Maybe you ought to compare Apple to Intel. Because Apple has delivered serious chip improvements year after year like clockwork (for phones and iPads). If Intel had delivered like that, the chip market would look a lot different today, Apple wouldn't be planning on laptops with their own silicon, nobody would be bidding $40B for ARM. If Tesla had improved their FSD hardware at the Apple pace, wow! Not that Tesla did badly with HW3, but it's been more than a year and there's no news on HW4... I think Apple has set the standard.

That said, I have no idea how much of their R&D budget that consumed.
AP isn't a phone SoC that you release a new one every year...
 
Honestly, Apple is no longer really a growth company but is kinda priced like one.

Growth, Profitability, and Financial Ratios for Apple Inc (AAPL) from Morningstar.com

They've essentially been flat since 2015, with revenues and profit growth since then below the nominal growth of the world economy as a whole (~3% pa).

Company wide growth rate hides the rapid growth in new Apple product lines. The iPhone line reached maturity mid-decade and since then has had "lumpy" performance with up and down years, while Apples "Wearables" (Watch) & "services" segments have had high growth rates. Services revenue has doubled over last 4 years, and with its services gross margins approaching 70%, it is most of the reason why the company is worth ~$2 Trillion. If it doubles services revenue again, Apple will be earning $70 Billion gross profit from the services segment alone (in addition to the ~$70 Billion in gross profit it already gets from other product segments).

In terms of future products that Apple has been pouring tens of billions of R&D into, it falls into 4 main categories:
- Core tech: relentless development of software and silicon for its annual product updates
- Health, which manifests as Apple Watch hardware & Software features.
- Augmented Reality, which manifest currently as AR software APIs for iOS devices with cameras & lidar sensors, but is undoubtedly for AR glasses coming at some point over next 12-24 months, which is their next major new product line bet.
- Automation Intelligence, which was focused around an autonomous car project, which whilst it still has test cars on public roads seems to have been downsized significantly to a research project versus the previous indication it was going to release its own EVs (Apple had talks about acquiring Tesla in 2013 for this purpose).
 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/09/14/us-savings-rate-coronavirus/

Most — 79 percent — are squirreling the money away in their checking or savings accounts. Only 24 percent have increased their contributions to retirement accounts, 17 percent have invested in the stock or bond markets, 5 percent have put it into real estate and just 3 percent have invested in other assets, such as cryptocurrency.