Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Tenable]

You guys keep missing that it isn't just $1k. It is actually $2,600.01 that the price would need to be dropped.

You are correct, I apologize. I took the OP at face value. Even still a P3D with range limited to 15 miles is likely to be upgraded to full sticker.

 

[Beltsbear]

Maybe they know people don’t need an insentive to buy a Tesla. It’s already priced low enough. They just want to help out the poor saps that decide to buy a Bolt or a Leaf.

With an incentive like that, it will not accomplish much. People will buy as many cheap Bolts and Niro's as will be sold, but that wont be that many. The only player who really wants to make a lot of cars is Tesla. Nissan will sell some short range Leafs but they still suck.

 

[S3XY]

Likewise. The rigorous and insightful analysis from @Fact Checking, based on referenced public documents, along with such a pleasing presentational style, make these reads something of a daily addiction for me. Similar kudos to @KarenRei and @ReflexFunds. I think Karen is phenomenally quick on the draw to be hitting the target so consistently. I look for this level of quality reporting elsewhere and come up empty.

Just need to get @neroden back in the fold. He's lurking but not posting.

 

[MP3Mike]

You joke, but a simple software limit to 100 miles or so could actually work depending on Canada's criteria. Almost nobody is going to buy that, but if it makes the whole Model 3 range eligible for subsidies, Tesla will make significant additional profit from customers using their subsidy to trade up options.

We haven't seen the details to know if the limit is before, or after, options. If it is after options then Tesla selling a car for $44,999 wouldn't really help unless everyone wanted a black stripper version. If it is before options then there is some wiggle room.

 

[madodel]

Tesla should make Model 3 Canuck Edition for $44,999

Replace standard wheels/aero covers with 16" steelies and cheapest tires that are still safe.

Maybe remove some software. And offer it later as an upgrade.

Add an app store and charge for the easter eggs.

 

[humbaba]

I'd expect it to be the same charger just programmed differently.

sure, why not. But there's no point to doing that if its the same cell count.

 

[dgodfrey]

Hmm, this also raises the questions. Where did the SEC get this misquote? Who produced this misquote? What controls does the SEC have to avoid mishandling evidence? The concern here is that certain parties may be feeding the SEC with false and misleading information, and the SEC is not conduction a proper investigation to verify the accuracy of information from their sources. The SEC could be derelict in investigating a source that may be knowingly providing false information to the Government.

I know you're responding to Neroden's post but I'm using this post to address the topic of the hard 500k vs the soft 500k quote. Not a lawyer so the difference between the word "will" and "about" in this context I think is making more out of it than is really there. Yes, it was an inaccuracy in a quote that is evidence however, the gist of the complaint isn't so much about how close they get to the number or even the accuracy of the number. It's about it being material or not. It seems were grasping at anything we can to shoot down their strategy but I doubt the judge is going to focus on the semantics of that inaccuracy in their filing. Rather, it will be more to do with the previously publicly stated information being repeated which I agree becomes immaterial or a better definition and procedure as to how much oversight is given to Musk's tweets.

I think the whole idea that they can expect everything he wants to post publicly has to be vetted is absolutely batsugar crazy. How would he be able to conduct an interview if that were the case. Would he need an interpreter that repeats what Musk says into his earpiece as we see the blackened silhouette of Elon's head?

 

[bdy0627]

Incredible demand, or time to reboot the 486 under Elon's desk?

This could easily be solved if they would just jump up to a Pentium.

 

[Creekstalker]

If it is after options then Tesla selling a car for $44,999 wouldn't really help unless everyone wanted a black stripper version.

Is there an OTA update of which we're unaware or something?

 

[lukex4]

From what I’ve seen, Bolt is priced too high as well(which makes sense, it costs more than the Model 3 SR)

I see $44,800 CAD for the Bolt in Ontario... That's very suspiciously close to the max MSRP set by the Liberals.. As if GM whispered it to them...

 

[Tenable]

I see $44,800 CAD for the Bolt in Ontario... That's very suspiciously close to the max MSRP set by the Liberals.. As if GM whispered it to them...

 

[seattlite2004]

From what I’ve seen, Bolt is priced too high as well(which makes sense, it costs more than the Model 3 SR)

A local dealer is offering a $10K discount off the $43K Premier trimmed Bolt. Yep..it has a high MSRP but no one pays MSRP.

 

[Pras]

Given CAD/USD is near Historical lows, Tesla can use some FX hedging and minor car option pricing changes to ensure they stay at $45k or below.

 

[bdy0627]

There was an earlier comment here about complaints about new order delays on social media with screenshots. I suspect Tesla saw it too from the server logs and delayed the price hike.

I can very well imagine them seeing unprecedented peak order flow that broke or significantly slowed down one of their payment processing backends. You wouldn't notice it unless you were trying to pay with a credit card in the relevant time period.

Tesla could have listed half a dozen easy and true reasons for the delay, why are people like @schonelucht rushing to accuse Tesla officials of lying about the reason, without any evidence whatsoever?

SMH.

Well, he is @schonelucht. His job here, which he appears to take seriously, is to question everything Elon/Tesla does and apply a negative interpretation when there is ambiguity.

 

[JRP3]

sure, why not. But there's no point to doing that if its the same cell count.

The discussion was about the MR, so different cell count.

 

[TheMrX]

I see $44,800 CAD for the Bolt in Ontario... That's very suspiciously close to the max MSRP set by the Liberals.. As if GM whispered it to them...

it is also 44 800$ in Quebec.....
Don't forget that Canada helped in the rescue of GM in the financial crisis (2008-2009)
GM, Chrysler make plea for $10-billion to stay afloat

This is reeeally p***ing me off right now as I was on a good way to convince my wife to buy a model 3.

I don't know if Tesla needs to address this though. We know there is no demand problem, we are still production constrained. But then I guess sending cars to Canada is a lot cheaper than in China or Europe so maybe they can lower the price a bit.

As others pointed out, I think it will depend more on the details of the rebate, if it is indeed before option we are really good to go (I hope).

 

[tinm]

Timothy B. Lee at ArsTechnica is a reliable Tesla basher and FUDster, and he's at it again today:

Musk defense “borders on the ridiculous,” SEC tells court​

It would be nice if anyone with Ars Technica street cred could push back a bit and insert a few factoids into the discussion.

I have no idea what Timothy B. Lee's problem with Elon is, but his reporting is viscously slanted and biased, roughly on the level of Dana Hull and Linette Lopez. This goes well beyond just click-bait journalism.

He has numerous past ties to right/libertarian-leaning think tanks often with notable Koch Brothers ties, including Cato Institute, Fraser Institute, Templeton Foundation, Mercatus Center, and Institute for Humane Studies.

Gosh, that might be the reason.

 

[bdy0627]

But how did they process all the preorders for model 3 when they had 400k in like 24 hrs? FYI I've changed sides on Tesla now. Sorry I'm a bear and buying puts.

At the low end of the range? That's very risky at this point. This is the time to sell puts, unless you are so fed up with TSLA that you are more interested in making a stand than making money.

 

[EVNow]

It is a malfunction - the server is not supposed to get too busy. Esp., in this cloud computing era when you can expand your compute power at will depending on need.

This got a few dislikes. So let me explain.

When we test for performance on load - if the website doesn't load or if the CPU (or RAM etc) go above a threshold like 90% - those are always logged as issues to be fixed.

BUT, I completely understand why this happened. Nobody thought there would be such a high usage scenario. So, they didn't design for it / test for it.

 

[Sparky]

Meanwhile in Norway:
Tesla Driver ‍‏ @m_xalher "Norway's NAF (= AAA) review of Model 3 says it has "hysterical amounts of power", competitors are "pre-historic", car scores highest ever for any EV, and arrives "way too early for the competitors"

Edit: Added the text from the tweet.
Also, bought some AMD yesterday and more this morning since I had decided no more TSLA until after delivery #s in April. But jeez, the reports from "the front" seem sooo positive and I keep questioning my reasoning for staying away 2 more weeks.