more precisely, not with current charging speed. People who can only afford $25000 car most likely don't own a house, and thus cannot charge at home. They have to charge at SC, and the more people owning M2, the more people will realize how painful it is. In my opinion, it has to be 200 miles in 15 min to make EV really take 50% of new car market.You don't think a $25K - $30K Tesla (before tax credits) will sell like gangbusters across the entire world?
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
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Krugerrand
Meow
Um, I don’t know but going to jail for a long while seems like a pretty good punishment for the muppets and may deter future potential muppets.
people who are buying $25000 car won't spend another $6000 for EAP, let alone $12000 for FSD.
No one can match it doesn't mean people have to buy it. ICE car refill gas speed is still way faster.
cliff harris
Member
They dont have a house... but they do actually park the car right? All you need is workplace/shopping mall car park destination chargers. It can be done, its just rubbish inertia in places like the US. GigaBerlin has thousands of chargers in its car park. Every business with a car park could do the same, and will do so over time.
The 'must refuel in 15 mins' is a silly assumption from fossil fuel days. My car is stationary 95% of my time.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
In the US at least roughly 70-75% of households have access to home or work charging already... (and some significant % of the rest are say folks in NYC, over half of which don't even OWN cars)
3.5 years ago when tested it was already 180 miles in 15 minutes at v3 chargers, and V4s are rolling out now- so already pretty close for the minority that would need to rely on em.
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Odd to say a $25k car won't sell like hotcakes, but more odd to not consider a smaller footprint car blowing up in the EU. The MY is considered large in many places there.
In the US there will be a ceiling to EV purchases for a while. There are too many people who do not want an EV, ever or want at least 1 ICE vehicle. That will and probably already has limited sales to an extent, but that's not the case in many places overseas.
In the US there will be a ceiling to EV purchases for a while. There are too many people who do not want an EV, ever or want at least 1 ICE vehicle. That will and probably already has limited sales to an extent, but that's not the case in many places overseas.
Not thousands, somewhere north of 500...
cliff harris
Member
Ok fair enough. ONLY 500 chargers in a single car park. Still evidence that its not beyond the laws of physics to install large numbers of them...
Let's see how it plays out, but frankly, I don't see many people in jail for this. I'll wait to see how this develops but I am not holding my breath.
Don't laugh, I'm still chewing on reasons for this meeting. Today's thought was brought to you by Elon's frustration with the border crisis... ha something in common, they have. Cybertruck border security in talks? Not that drones couldn't do the same, but having mobile cameras that serve to ID people re-entering perhaps. Just a thought... no need to debate it, lots of random stuff is possible. I just saw this as something they have in common.
Changing need not be high rate to be feasible (in mild climates)
A smaller car will have better efficiency.
Say 200 Wh/mile
A 15 amp outlet is rated for 12A continuous
At 120V that's 1.4 kW (or < 10m² of solar panels, which is less area than a typical parking spot of ~15m²)
Knock off 200 watts for vehicle loads
1.2 kW net charge rate
6 miles/ hour
9 hour shift = 54 miles
12 hours at home = 72 miles
Average US commute is 41 miles
200 amp split phase continuous service can handle 32 such ports
Three phase 200A: 48
A smaller car will have better efficiency.
Say 200 Wh/mile
A 15 amp outlet is rated for 12A continuous
At 120V that's 1.4 kW (or < 10m² of solar panels, which is less area than a typical parking spot of ~15m²)
Knock off 200 watts for vehicle loads
1.2 kW net charge rate
6 miles/ hour
9 hour shift = 54 miles
12 hours at home = 72 miles
Average US commute is 41 miles
200 amp split phase continuous service can handle 32 such ports
Three phase 200A: 48
Quite good numbers for Jan+Feb in EU.
We already know Q124 will be lower than Q123, the question is "by how much".
Also, there is the matter of a idle Tesla Berlin.
We already know Q124 will be lower than Q123, the question is "by how much".
Also, there is the matter of a idle Tesla Berlin.
MartinAustin
Active Member
(ordinarily I don't feed the bears)
Totally agree that buyers of a $25,000 car aren't going to be turning it into a $37,000 car by adding that option. Autonomy is $199/month.
At the moment. Who says it will stay at that price? Might come down
Plus... people who can hire someone else's autonomous car for $5/ride are going to see it as an advantage that they aren't paying for their own car any more - parking, insurance, upkeep, gasoline, oil changes yadda yadda
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Krugerrand
Meow
So glad we know with certainty. Do we have the same predictive abilities about other things that have equal short term importance?
I’m pretty sure the performance version of the Model 2 will have a very high demand in Europe. Mainly people that have a much bigger budget, but no desire to have a car the size of the Model 3.
Price is not the only reason to buy a car. Some people have hard limits on how much to spend on a car, and they will love the Model 2 (although somebody may need to calculate the TCO for them).
And my Model S already charges at 200 miles in 15 minutes, there’s no real reason why the Model 2 would charge slower.
your Model S has a big battery. When battery size is smaller, the maximum charge speed is less as well.
A $25k Tesla will sell like hotcakes in Europe and Asia and do very well in the U.S. It should easily be over 4 million units after ramping up globally.
Tesla’s brand is still very strong.
Margins are what we should be concerned about. The market will not reward mere volume. BYD shows that.
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