Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Nocturnal]

Disruption in the oil industry is upon us.

lOil Prices Must Drop Sharply To Compete With EVs | OilPrice.com

I saw this one. $10 a barrel oil would be required to compete with auto transportation in the long run. I really liked the comment about renewable energy having a short run marginal cost of nearly zero.

Last coal train rolls to Arizona power plant as closure looms for major polluter

would like a word

​

 

[Skryll]

This is the same as the group of people who will never buy an IPhone.

Here is the funny thing: Friend of mine got a 2019 Honda Accord Hybrid. Despite having driven my Model 3. I was shocked and asked him what led to that decision. Initially he just mentioned apple carplay, always having liked honda, then lower initial cost and high 48mpg eroding the total cost of ownership argument, and him liking the quiet sound insulated cabin experience. Digging a bit deeper, the other reasons turned out to be the horrorstories he heard about service experience through my wife (2016 model 90d at dublin service center with a comedy of errors and struggles over the years), the extra effort they saw us go through charging on a roadtrip we went on together, the impression of dishonesty he got from going to tesla.com/model3 and having to click to see the actual purchase price instead of 'after savings' price, and probably all the FUD he ingested through his apple news feed.

What gets me is that he will even replace the other gas car rather with a honda electric car than go tesla, despite all the reasons I give him how far ahead the tech is. It's sad, because I know he would enjoy the tesla more, but he just can't see it, and the test ride itself did not solve this.

 

[qunqun]

pfff I saw somebody extract the chip from the keycard and embedded into her arm.

pfff I saw somebody extract the chip from the keycard and embedded into her arm.

I think the ring cost less than $40, do you know how much cost her? I have to compare the cost to decided
which way to go.

 

[Tslynk67]

Here is the funny thing: Friend of mine got a 2019 Honda Accord Hybrid. Despite having driven my Model 3. I was shocked and asked him what led to that decision. Initially he just mentioned apple carplay, always having liked honda, then lower initial cost and high 48mpg eroding the total cost of ownership argument, and him liking the quiet sound insulated cabin experience. Digging a bit deeper, the other reasons turned out to be the horrorstories he heard about service experience through my wife (2016 model 90d at dublin service center with a comedy of errors and struggles over the years), the extra effort they saw us go through charging on a roadtrip we went on together, the impression of dishonesty he got from going to tesla.com/model3 and having to click to see the actual purchase price instead of 'after savings' price, and probably all the FUD he ingested through his apple news feed.

What gets me is that he will even replace the other gas car rather with a honda electric car than go tesla, despite all the reasons I give him how far ahead the tech is. It's sad, because I know he would enjoy the tesla more, but he just can't see it, and the test ride itself did not solve this.

Let's be honest, it's understandable that he was put off by all that. Regardless of whether you think Neroden was a bit over-the-top, service has been an issue for a lot of people - although I think with the new app booking system there's a more systematic approach (I made my annual inspection appointment through the app and the next day I got a call from Tesla to check the points I listed and to agree logistics = good!).

For me, the crying shame here is that the guy was perhaps convinced that EV's were good, but then not feeing comfortable with a Tesla, didn't have any real alternatives to turn to. Does it really matter if he buys a Honda EV over a Tesla? No. But it does matter that he does buy an EV and not an an ICE and on this occasion we failed.

Tesla will not succeed alone, we need other manufacturers. We need other manufacturers to come with better EVs than Tesla. Competition will spur innovation and reduce costs.

 

[Joe F]

Huh? So I'm supposed to buy a Taycan, then?

I guess that frees up your calendar for next Monday. Omg, what to do with the free time now!

 

[EVNow]

It’s not offensive, merely only funny to residents of the northern hemisphere.

Edit: so I guess it depends who the target audience was for that tweet. If it’s to encourage Australians to order, inverting the image would only serve to alienate. If it’s to boost the corporate image in the north, a “look how we’ve grown” statement, then fine, have a laugh.

I don't think any one group can pass a judgement on what should or shouldn't be offensive to another group.

Usually communication groups in a company have a "geopolitical" teams to vet the communication for sensibilities.

 

[EVNow]

Prime Minister has already indicated that in event of a loss, he will trigger a genera election as of 14th October.

He can ask for a vote on election but needs a 2/3rds majority. Labor can vote against. Esp because PM can change the election date after getting consent for election.

 

[Tslynk67]

He can ask for a vote on election but needs a 2/3rds majority. Labor can vote against. Esp because PM can change the election date after getting consent for election.

PM "promised" not to change the date - that being said, he a congenital liar like Trump.

Anyway, potentially more turmoil, if the markets, rest of the world even cares any more

 

[Bet TSLA]

I could go on and on...

I'm sure you could. It takes the same TSLAQ mindset to believe Apple FUD as Tesla FUD.

 

[Doggydogworld]

Except that Tesla doesn't:
Have elaborate Cayman Island tax avoidance schemes

Tesla avoids taxes the old fashioned way - by avoiding profits

Develop proprietary data cables,...

Connect a scanner to your Tesla's legally-required OBD-II port and tell me how much useful info you get.

Increase the price of their products every year without adding significant innovation

iPhone X has no innovation over iPhone 1?

Tell users they are using the product wrong when it's actually a malfunction of the device

Except when EAP drives under a semi trailer or into a concrete divider -- that's unquestionably user error.

I'm 100x more likely to buy a Tesla than an iPhone, but not if it means I have to wear blinders...

 

[Intl Professor]

I find this progress even more astonishing than the rate the building went up.

Are we sure it won't already spit-out some M3's this year?

Also the density of the machinery implies serious engineering even on the mere placement of the machines. Kudos to Jerome and staff.

 

[StealthP3D]

It's sad, because I know he would enjoy the tesla more, but he just can't see it, and the test ride itself did not solve this.

I don't give people test rides (boring), I let them drive the damn car. That works!

As an added bonus I get to see their smiles of delight as they experience one-pedal driving and instant, silent torque.

 

[Buckminster]

New photos of Gigafactory Shanghai equipment.

Can anyone explain what the yellow robots do? Doesn't seem to be a line running between them.

 

[mongo]

Connect a scanner to your Tesla's legally-required OBD-II port and tell me how much useful info you get.

Not required on a Tesla:
Per EPA:

Or National Alternative Fuels Training Consortium:
Diagnostic Scan Tools and Electric Vehicles

Although electric vehicles are not required to comply with OBD-II DLC connector standards or use the OBD-II CAN communication protocol, many do. Notable exceptions include some of the smaller EV manufacturers, such as Tesla, which use proprietary scan tools.

Except when EAP drives under a semi trailer or into a concrete divider -- that's unquestionably user error.

EAP did not replace the driver. Crashes are the responsibility of the human.

 

[elasalle]

Thought .. can there be a product like "Insurance On Demand" ... this would disrupt the whole Car Insurance
You sign up for Tesla Insurance.
Tesla Auto detects who drives and auto-enrolls you for insurance when you drive, auto un enrolls as soon as you stop driving?

So if I don't drive for 2 weeks, I pay $0 for insurance ....

 

[Doggydogworld]

It would be interesting now to see how they ramp up. We know 3 rampup wasn't good - and they had no experience. Is GF3 going to be better ?

GF3 should ramp much faster:

1. Musk isn't involved (I sometimes joke he's barred from the premises, haha)
2. We already know the parts all fit together​

The main risks:

1. Design "improvements" using new parts that don't fit together on the first try
2. Parts sourced from different vendors that have slight differences
3. Equipment from different vendors that makes parts with slight differences​

I think these risks are low, especially at first when most parts will come from the same vendors or be made in Tesla's US factories using the same Tesla machines. They can substitute local production gradually, testing each part or subassembly without holding up the rest of the line.

 

[Doggydogworld]

Not required on a Tesla:
Per EPA:
View attachment 450013
Or National Alternative Fuels Training Consortium:
Diagnostic Scan Tools and Electric Vehicles

Good info, thanks. I'd heard CARB originally mandated OBD-II, but did not realize the federal rule was also tied so closely tied to emissions regs.

That said, most car companies provide a wealth of non-emissions diagnostic information via OBD. It's great for independent garages, DIYers, hot rodders, etc. Tesla very conspicuously provides nothing. Nor to they provide shop manuals or similar info, except very narrowly where required by law. They are the opposite of 'open' in this regard. That's OK, but let's not pretend otherwise.

Crashes are the responsibility of the human

I wasn't talking about legal liability, and I'm aware of the fine print. Here's my question - does a typical customer think driving under semi-trailers or accelerating into parked fire trucks is the proper way for Enhanced Autopilot or Full Self Driving to function, or would they call it a bug?

 

[Cherry Wine]

GF3 should ramp much faster:

1. Musk isn't involved (I sometimes joke he's barred from the premises, haha)
2. We already know the parts all fit together​

The main risks:

1. Design "improvements" using new parts that don't fit together on the first try
2. Parts sourced from different vendors that have slight differences
3. Equipment from different vendors that makes parts with slight differences​

I think these risks are low, especially at first when most parts will come from the same vendors or be made in Tesla's US factories using the same Tesla machines. They can substitute local production gradually, testing each part or subassembly without holding up the rest of the line.

Dangerously close to a wholly-positive post from you. ;-) (This is said mainly in jest.)

 

[mongo]

OT

Good info, thanks. I'd heard CARB originally mandated OBD-II, but did not realize the federal rule was also tied so closely tied to emissions regs.

That said, most car companies provide a wealth of non-emissions diagnostic information via OBD. It's great for independent garages, DIYers, hot rodders, etc. Tesla very conspicuously provides nothing. Nor to they provide shop manuals or similar info, except very narrowly where required by law. They are the opposite of 'open' in this regard. That's OK, but let's not pretend otherwise.

Tesla now provides access to service manual information outside of Massachusetts (for a fee)*:
Welcome | Tesla Service

* I have not signed up so I can't say what they give individuals access to.

 

[Electroman]

There is no daily quotum of posts that needs to be reached.

Hmm.. I didn't know that