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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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Analyst discusses the Tesla killers:
Moe Salih on Twitter

Oh, man! I actually know the original story with the paelleras in the sea, and I understand just enough Spanish to follow the story along without the subtitles, but when watching this and reading the subtitles (particularly the "it's true!" bits) I'm still LMAO! This is so funny, because...



wait for it...


giphy-downsized.gif


IT'S TRUE!
 
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PT = Paint, ST = Stamping, CA = Casting, PL = plastics, BIW = body in white, DU = drive unit, GA = general assembly, MP = battery assembly (stated that cells will be delivered), SE = seats, SU = support

1. Etage = ground level, 2. Etage (right) = upper level
sections_building-png.496999

So we're looking at two levels, and at first it didn't make sense how the stamping, casting, BIW and paint sections are laid out. But I'm starting to wonder... is this, in fact, Alien Dreadnought 1.0?
 
Wait, you think Tesla is planning on having the car take up two stalls? Um, no, that's not going to happen. ;)

250kW max. At best they'll wire it to be capable of more for whenever they make "V4" Superchargers. But having just introduced V3, even that's dubious.

Why not a 200 kWh Tesla with a chargeport on either side?

Yes, it could occupy two supercharger stalls, but then only for half the time (and would liable for double blocking fees).

For non-supercharger charging, it would have additional flexibility for parking + plugging in.

Also, you could really show off at 3rd party high-power chargers (e.g. Ionity), by also using two of those at the same time.
 
And another series of interesting tweets related to China:

[496947[/ATTACH]

In Asia, red is a symbol of wealth, and positive returns on their stock market readings are denoted in red, negative returns in green, the opposite of the rest fo the World. The amount of times I have seen Mass Media reports of doom heading showing an stock photo of an Asian market readouts (with all companies in the red) is laughable. It clearly shows how out of depth Mass Media are.

EDIT: Green Pete beat me to it.
 
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That was my and @neroden's take as well - and it clearly explained the rush to control the narrative: according to later SEC documents Elon tweeted the $420 tweet from his private jet, with minimal input from other board members.

Back then Elon probably already suspected that Q3/Q4'2018 is going to be fantastic, because they knew their cost base and had a lot of pent-up demand. This was the report that I believe Elon read and which might have increased urgency and triggered the $420 tweet:


And prior August 7 we did notice weird TSLA buying pressure here on TMC, which started after the July 4th bear attack that drove the price below $300:


Note that on the $420 tweet day the price was already at around $350, $365 intraday, fueled by Q2 earnings that already showed a positive inherent cash flow (modulo working capital fluctuation) and the Saudi speculation, which was later on confirmed to be a 4% stake in Tesla.

Also note that "$420" might have been a joke in part, but it was also exactly a +20% buy-out premium over the ~$350 price levels on August 7, so a fair offer. (350*1.2 = 420)

Note how the next 2 weeks after the $420 tweet were spent (successfully) organizing a $20b buy-out consortium that emphatically did not include the Saudi PIF. The Saudis also later on hedged (shorted) their stake and invested in another EV maker, so the relationship clearly cooled down.

Bears immediately hung on to "The $420 tweet was a lie, it's impossible to take Tesla private!" false narrative and started shorting big time, helped by institutionals and eventually the SEC itself.

In hindsight, had the Saudi PIF taken over Tesla and taken it private, we'd possibly not have seen the $400+ levels of today.

So SEC confrontation aside, Elon did Tesla investors a big favor by making Tesla "uninvestable" for a year or so, this avoided the Saudi takeover (the bone-saw memes would never stop ...), and it also kept VW-Porsche from taking over Tesla at the $180 price levels earlier this year, which I'm sure they were looking at...

The German "Manager Magazin" published a well sourced piece that also quoted members of the Porsche family bemoaning Tesla's high share price ... when it was below $200:

Tesla: Daimler, BMW und Volkswagen machen Jagd auf Elon Musk

"Hunting down Tesla"

"Electro-visionary Elon Musk fails due to the downsides of the auto business. Important investors lose confidence, the German premium providers are attacking. Tesla is ready for a takeover."

...


"The Tesla dream still glows in Diess, according to top VW managers familiar with his thinking. He believes that Volkswagen can benefit from Tesla's battery and, above all, software expertise. "He would get in immediately if he could," says one of his top people. The money is there too, for the beginning a participation is enough. It was more difficult with the approval of the major shareholders, the families Porsche and Piëch."​

Right after they leaked this to Manager Magazin, Porsche family members "denied" the report:


I think they wanted to drive the price down a bit more by creating the impression that despite Diess being the super best friend ever of Elon, they are still not interested in bailing out Tesla - and then gobble up Tesla for the EV tech.

Then early September, they were on again:

Tesla: Wolfgang Porsche schließt Beteiligung nicht aus - manager magazin

"Volkswagen co-owner Wolfgang Porsche apparently does not rule out a stake in the US electric car maker Tesla."​

I think they were still under the impression that the Taycan would pressure Tesla, and that Tesla has cash flow troubles and needs a bailout.

Lucky for us, VW-Porsche miscalculated, Q2 already drove the share price to $250 levels, and Q3 financials started the rally to $420 ... and Elon never had any interest in selling Tesla's assets to VW.

I don't think VW-Porsche has the money to take over Tesla at these price levels - and Elon would not agree to a one-sided partnership that gives Tesla's software crown jewels to Volkswagen - which I think VW had in mind in the summer.

So yeah, IMO Tesla investors dodged two takeover/dilution bullets in the span of a single year ...

The possibility of takeovers needs to be understood too when buying options: in a takeover much of the time value of an option can go to zero, which wipes out deep out of the money option holders.

Take notes. That right there, folks, is how you conspiracy theory.
 
Lead article from spiegel.de, one of the biggest German news sites: Tesla: Vorsprung durch Technik, ätsch - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Wirtschaft

In short: Tesla is currently winning.
Headline: "Vorsprung durch Technik, ätsch" (borrowed from Audi; ätsch = tee-hee = sniggering derisively)

Talks a lot about the wins in the last year:
  • Shorts got a bloody nose
  • Record deliveries
  • Market cap close to VW. German OEMs were not able to sell EVs.
    Rapid speed of GF3
  • Model Y will be released (link to nice overview of the car, sadly citing Bob Lutz that it looks ugly...)
  • Cybertruck preorders
  • Elon achieved his goals, skeptics are impressed
Talks about the upcoming GF4 and planned capacity of 500k vehicles.

Of course the end of the article is reserved for the outlook of wallstreet analysts.
  • Tesla has to prove that it's profitable
  • Concerns about an inflated EV market due to subsidies (looking at US for the coming quarter)
  • There were always a negative variables arising when analysts were optimistic
Article ends with Elon saying that he doesn't want bad karma by celebrating his triumph (referring to Wall Street Journal by John Stoll).


People in Germany get better, more accurate, info about Tesla from our MSM. I think GF4 in Berlin will accelerate this mindset of more objective reporting.
 
It is all the rage at the moment to promote ‘theories’ about myriad things, including the specific on about Saudi investment in TSLa and ‘420’. The facts beg for all sorts of weird ideas. A popular one right now among otherwise well-informed posters is that there was some sort of ‘hostile’ action planned by “the Saudis”.

it seems a few basic facts might help rectify this problem:
1. The Public Investment Fund is the Saudi vehicle used for almost all offIcial foreign direct investment.
2. Private Saudi investments are not connected with that. Those have periodically been quite splashy, and have involved huge holdings in US financial institutions including both Citicorp and JPMorgan Chase (different people, different times).
3. The PIF has NEVER made a single investment that could remotely de described as hostile (sine 1971, and still after reorganization in 2014). NOT ONCE.
4. The PIF does sometimes take odd positions, 5% of Uber, SoftBank deal, <5% of TSLA.
5. The TSLA position was disclosed to Tesla, although they never reached 5%. Based on Saudi statements, Al Jazeera and others at the time I believe there was a stated intention to invest a major position in TSLA so long as Tesla would help Saudi Arabia with Neom:

Saudi Arabia to invest $500 billion in fully automated city

All that is so grandiose and spectacular that it obviously made Elon very excited.


Politics intervened;
the fantastical prospect of Neom became more implausible as it became clear that transcending Egypt and Jordan plus Saudi would present so many impediments that it began to seem like the United Arab Republic, the Gulf Cooperation Council (look them up) and other abortive schemes.

Then Elon began to understand that the prior PIF professional managers were being displaced by a group of undereducated over-opinionated fools who actually imagined that Trumps pretty son-in-law Knew something, since he was well connected in Israel including some of the former Intelligence people who were supplying the Saudi surveillance technology via Cyprus.

Saudi paranoia plus US administration gross incompetence combined with generally unrealistic economic planning to make Elon fully aware that those ideas would never happen.



Then came “the Kashoggi Affair”, coupled with Deep anger with Al Jazeera thus Qatar. There were a sequence of events before, during and after these that pretty much destroyed any plausible way to do a TSLA, especially when Saudi revenues were dropping and it was becoming very hard to buy off the Saudi Shia populace, much less even Kurdish and Sunni Iraqis etc.

We need nothing else to explain what happened. My opinion is humble, I really do not understand much of what has happened. OTOH, I have known PIF senior management since it’s inception and dealt with/lived in/worked in several Gulf countries and have shared board seats with senior Saudis who are still around. I am very reticent to suggest I really know because I do not.

Everything about the “funding assured”, “420” and all the rest sounds just like dozens of deals I have been around. Some of this stuff really happens, but not since MBS.

Everything I just said is available in public records. We need zero imagination.

Elon is a practical person. Once he discovered some of these things he knew it would be foolish to proceed.

I think he learned a great deal about geo-politics in a very short time. Now he’s doing the GF-3 and GF-4 deals in a mature way.

Interesting, BTW, tat Tesla will sell in Israel this year. Jordan now is covered by Superchargers and Israel will be within a few months. What is next?
 
That's not the point. The point is that what they installed comes that way, with two pedestals fed by one cabinet. The fact that there's two pedestals is not indicative of anything. It'd be more work for them to make it have only one pedestal than to have two. :) I was countering the argument that the fact that there's two pedestals means that the car is supposed to for some reason have two separate charge ports that can be used simultaneously (which would be ridiculous design regardless)

So you're telling me we're not going to see a Semi on the Nurburgring?
 
So you're telling me we're not going to see a Semi on the Nurburgring?

Actually, that would be highly amusing ;) At least if they upped the truck's top speed.

Wonder if someone could make a car carrier capable of cornering without fishtailing wildly or rolling over. Would be hilarious to have Semi simultaneously haul multiple "moderately sporty" cars around the ring faster than they could drive it ;) At unveiling it was announced that it can do 0-60 in 5 seconds when empty (and Tesla's drive units have become more powerful since it was unveiled), so, so long as the payload weight isn't too heavy... ;)
 
Bloomberg: Musk to Come to Shanghai for Debut of Made-in-China Tesla

Rumors that Elon going to china for Model 3 deliveries.

Also includes some FUD about Chinese demand from GF3 being only 21k vehicles for the year. Also some FUD about competition in China.

Quote from the article: "But the Palo Alto, California-based company won’t be the sole global EV brand targeting those buyers".
It goes on to say that:
- Audi E-Tron, debuted in November at a starting price of about 693,000 yuan ($99.4k)
- Daimler's EQC electric model became available in October and starts at 580,000 yuan ($83.2k)


Article fails to mention that Telsa Model 3 starts at 323,800 yuan ($46.4k)
 
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On how far Tesla is ahead of the others: One of my pet peeves with my old Audi was that they never updated the software. I mean, I didn't expect wonders from a legacy car maker but the obvious stuff that newer models could do anyways, why not throw a bone to the existing owners?

I thought this is history since the eTron can do OTA updates. However, Audi seems to not even update software of cars that are literally only a few months old: Audi upgrades e-tron electric SUV in Europe with more range and efficiency - AudiWorld Forums



Also German Audi forums are (rightfully) quite upset about this...

From my 15 years of experience with Audi I can see that for an owner who wishes for an improvement to their car, Audi still thinks that this should simply be done via a new sale...

With substantial developments now happening in software, they need good luck with that...
 
Actually, that would be highly amusing ;) At least if they upped the truck's top speed.

Wonder if someone could make a car carrier capable of cornering without fishtailing wildly or rolling over. Would be hilarious to have Semi simultaneously haul a bunch of "moderately sporty" cars around the ring faster than they could drive it ;)

Especially if it beat the Taycan's time :D
 
  • Funny
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