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Curious we GM. Can’t find an answer to this. Has GM started building bolts again or are they still in limbo...meaning they are currently building zero EV’s per day...in fourth quarter 2021.

Nope. They are "planning" to start production again on December 6th:

 
I think the Hummer is supposed to be a flagship vehicle to demonstrate GM’s ability to produce awesome and exciting EVs! Also to compete with the Cybertruck to show they can do big/ bad-axe trucks better than Tesla.

Sort of like the Tesla Roadster. Or the Cybertruck… but done completely wrong.
Makes sense 10 years ago.
 
Just a point when you choose for your 1st next generation EV a huge weighty inefficient vehicle that wont sell much and will require huge battery packs you really arent interested in producing EVs in volume. How many CUVs or Sedans could be built with each battery a Hummer will need?
Apparently the answer is three. But this will probably be more profitable at least initially for them, assuming they can be sold for full price. But GM coiuld make $150k in revenue selling three smaller CUV's with 65kWh batteries, which would be much better for the environment. Now personally I like the looks of the Hummer EV, but not the weight or the price. I would be a buyer in the $60k price range. But since it is double that, I am not sure how well this will work for them. The easy answer, this is not going to make Tesla lose a single sale of any vehicle. The only interesting vehicle that GM has is the Lyriq.

Of course the real problem with the hummer is charging it. If it really is a 200kWh battery, it is so big that charging it becomes a problem. 30a 240V home charging suddenly struggles to charge it. Long road trips require 2x as long to charge assuming the charging circuit is top notch. It would laugh at a 120v charging cable.
 
Let me voice an opinion most will disagree with:
Tesla should give priority to developing Tesla Bot over solving FSD.

Most people take an incrementalist view with would posit that Tesla should keep plugging away at solving FSD, then after that it will have the bandwidth to go after the more ambitious project of training Tesla Bot. This assumes that the framework necessary for solving FSD is somehow foundational to higher AI, as if you can just build one on top of the other. Maybe.

A more radical view is that we don't really know what is foundational to humanoid AI, but we can reasonably assume that whatever grand framework can truly make Tesla Bot AI successful will be sufficient to solve vehicle autonomy. Indeed a fully trainable Tesla Bot can trained to be a valet for parking lots. If so, driving highways is not that much of a reach for further training. What Tesla is currently doing with FSD will look like machine learning by comparison. FSD will look like child's play.

So what are the big intuitive leaps that Tesla Bot needs to be a successful? I don't know, but the sooner Tesla discovers this grand framework and builds up all the supporting tech, the sooner FSD will become a trivial exercise.

Moreover, every useful task that Tesla can train the Bot to do has market potential, and much of that potential can be brought to market with minimal regulatory impedance. And much of it is much lower risk from just about any vantage point. The Tesla Bot initiative will yeild a massive stream of marketable innovation along the way to Tesla Bot Singularity.

I believe that Tesla Bot can leapfrog FSD. Sometimes you just need to focus on going to Mars. When you do that, making Earth more sustainable or the Moon more inhabitable happens along the way.
I like your thinking: Having spent almost 2 decades trying to boot-strap and mass-produces EVs, Tesla is just going to say, "Na, we are not into cars anymore - we pivoted to bots". Bold move!

To recap: There are - at least - 4 possible outcomes of FSD for Tesla.
One is never. Few here believes that, I would recon.
Off course, we don't know for sure that FSD can be achieved, but it is becomming increasingly likely that is really is a matter of time and effort.

Another is "late as in 10-15 years. And further, due to this long horizon, Tesla won't be necessarily be first, or not by much, or not best, because it will take such a long time that many will catch up. So late could mean that Tesla won't make a killing from FSD or robotaxis, but will have a more modest revenue. And bots are just another level which is beyond difficult.

(I don't think this scenario is realistic, but ... I cannot ignore it entirely. Tesla could become the victim of a a lot of really bad luck - a black swan event which would derail their lead, macro black swans - things like that.)

Yet another is "soon". Soon often means near-future or 6 month to 2 years. It is tempting, but I don't quite believe this.

The last option is "sort of close".
Could be 1 year, could be 5 years. A lot of uncertainty.
The problem is, for each new victory, each new special-case that FSD suddenly is able to pull off, other hard cases arise. Not because they were hidden, but usually because we wouldn't have thought it remotely possible before that FSD could handle such a complex case. And we discover that it has to handle these things in order to really drive well.

There is a sub-case of "sort-of-close" in which self-driving is doable, but really, *really* hard. ("Close-but-hard-cubed")
Hard as in landing and re-using rockets. Hard as in only team Elon can do it - and it still takes half a decade. Good thing: No competition because it is just at the very edge of human abillity to pull off.
That scenario lend itself to very peacefull co-existence re. ressource allocation wrt bots versus FSD. Because the best path toward FSD merges with the best path towards bots.
My guess is that team Elon has concluded that the above scenario is the most likely. And that solving FSD is so very hard that you almost have to built a digital clone of a primate in order to succeed. (I have avoided saying digital clone of a human on purpose)

And when you reach that, the bot-body is just another 'sleeve' as they say in Altered Carbon.
Dump the car-sleeve, don the bot-sleeve . Download bi-pedal locomotion sub-routines.
Good to go (pun intended)

TLDR:
You have a good point, and I kind of agree the bot is the most important thing.
But given the "close-but-hard-cubed" scenario, which I find the most likely, the paths merge between FSD and bot.
And doing it that way allows Tesla to operate in sort of de-facto stealth mode re. the bot untill they are ready - and continue on plan with making cars and lots of money.
Very few people are taking the bot seriously right now.
But they will.
 
Mod: I want to try a new guideline. It seems that almost all postings that mention a politician's name become the kind of political postings that eventually need a moderator's action. I don't want to do "cleanup in Aisle 3". So, if a posting mentions a politician's name, even by proxy like "Stupid Florida Governor", it gets nuked as soon as I see it. Even if you wanted to say "Biden's Build Back Better", you could always just elide the name... who needs quadruple alliteration anyway?

This should enable reasonable discussion of economic consequences of policies without getting into the other kind of stuff that causes us to ban all politics.

I'll try it for a few weeks. We'll see.

-- ggr
Noble experiment. Instead of gossiping and bickering about personalities and politicians, perhaps we can have more reasoned discussion of policies relevant to TSLA.
 
His speech all about how Ford and GM will save the world. Gm blah blah blah, Ford blah blah blah. Not a word of Tesla.
I can't wait until these dinosaurs (Ford and GM) die out. It is clear they are playing a pretend game when it comes to EVs. They are the problem, NOT part of the solution. They make promises funny noises about EVs while their output is still 99% ICE.
If SMR is right, they both will be bankrupt before the decade is over and we can finally forget about the ICE-age they represent (and try to prolong as long as they can).
Wish there was a hibernation technology so I could sleep through a decade without getting older -- it would probably be good for my investment portfolio too as I could not mess it up by unnecessary trading, just plain ol' HODL.
 
Now we know why the thing is over $100,000. If one can find a wrecked one with an intact battery, one could build a good electric RV with that thing. Of course assuming the battery itself is designed well, which would be a bad assumption because the rest of the hummer can't be designed well if it needs a battery that big. Seriously, four of them could power a semi.


*3,600 pounds…
(1,630kg)
😳
That’s just the pack weight. They also have to build a heavier truck capable of carrying that monster pack around.

It has a small truck bed and seating for 5 people. It’s arguably less capable than the Rivian for most purposes.
 
Just a point when you choose for your 1st next generation EV a huge weighty inefficient vehicle that wont sell much and will require huge battery packs you really arent interested in producing EVs in volume. How many CUVs or Sedans could be built with each battery a Hummer will need?
It's the GM version of Milton's power point slides.
 
I can't wait until these dinosaurs (Ford and GM) die out. It is clear they are playing a pretend game when it comes to EVs. They are the problem, NOT part of the solution. They make promises funny noises about EVs while their output is still 99% ICE.
If SMR is right, they both will be bankrupt before the decade is over and we can finally forget about the ICE-age they represent (and try to prolong as long as they can).
Wish there was a hibernation technology so I could sleep through a decade without getting older -- it would probably be good for my investment portfolio too as I could not mess it up by unnecessary trading, just plain ol' HODL.
I fear another tax-payer funded bailout. It would be Un-American to lose those great Union Jobs!...
 
Could that be my 3.5% daily target in sight once more?

I can't speak for anyone else, but I do enjoy owning a stonk providing these meager, yet, consistent returns. 😁
Getting a 3.5% increase consistently for the next 200 trading days would have resulted in a modest 972.9- fold increase of the share value. But alas, at the close, we were only up 3.25% for the day. My single TSLA share will thus only appreciate 1.0325^200=599.81- fold to 653,196.62. Under these adverse conditions, I guess I need to buy a second share for early retirement. 🤷‍♂️

Edit to add:
Not much good can be said about this darn virus which killed millions already and is far from being done yet. However, there has rarely been a more impressive demonstration of exponential growth before that everyone can relate to.
 
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The last option is "sort of close".
Could be 1 year, could be 5 years. A lot of uncertainty.

For FSD I'm in this camp, the reason for the optimism is I sort of expect a surge of improvement say going for 99.9 to 99.999 relatively fast as things just click,
Then from 99.999 on it is a real slow grind through obscure edge cases, with occasional regressions.
For Robotaxis 99.999 might not be enough for regulatory approval, but it might be enough to start the process.
If Tesla is finding FSD this difficult, I'm tempted to conclude everyone else is at least 2-3 years behind and more likely to fall further behind.

For the Bot the main commonality is both need Dojo.
The training set is different as the Bot will be targeting industrial / domestic environments..
The Bot will probably start operations in a single environment which it can map. in this case a HD map is very useful. The Bot is unlikely to move outside that mapped area for sometime. Then the Bot needs to be trained to recognise and act on objects in that environment. The Bot can initially learn by copying humans, training datasets may be able to be humans carrying out the task they want the Bot to do.

So the Bot is in an entirely different progression path, it starts out behind but can possibly learn quite fast even given a limited set of data, it can always stop and ask for instructions. Regulatory approval is easier.

IMO the Bot was done for the following reasons:-
  1. It will be useful in Tesla factories, and on Mars.
  2. To keep and recruit top AI talent, by having a meaningful challenge.
  3. Because it is an opportunity that can be tapped by Tesla AI.
  4. Elon fears someone with fewer morals will eventually do it.
 
Rivian and Lucid are priced not for what they have done, but for what Tesla has done. Full Stop.
Screen Shot 2021-11-17 at 6.27.32 PM.png

Will the Real Energy Disruption Company please stand up.

EDIT: Rivian and Lucid are the good guys, BEV manufacturers, and I applaud them. Simply making fun of their current market cap, only possible due to Tesla's valuation which we all here know is an energy disruption company that also happens to make BEVs.
 
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For FSD I'm in this camp, the reason for the optimism is I sort of expect a surge of improvement say going for 99.9 to 99.999 relatively fast as things just click,
Then from 99.999 on it is a real slow grind through obscure edge cases, with occasional regressions.
For Robotaxis 99.999 might not be enough for regulatory approval, but it might be enough to start the process.
If Tesla is finding FSD this difficult, I'm tempted to conclude everyone else is at least 2-3 years behind and more likely to fall further behind.
Ha, ha, ha… he said 99.9%.. I‘d be surprised it it’s as even in the 9x % at this point.

I have a new idea for FSD, but I’m not going to post it here. I’m sending it direct to Elon. Maybe we’ll see it come to fruition. ;-).
 
Long time member, owner (x4), and hider in the shadows of this thread for the last few years (thanks to all of you for all that I have learned from this specific TMC thread!).

First post:

An investment in TSLA is an investment in Elon. They are quite obviously intertwined. If anyone wants to see what the boss is doing and once again inspire your continued investment in him , TSLA, and humanity see the link:


Amidst the share sale, tax and political conversation I find the video above once again awe-inspiring and grounding towards our mutual mission.
 
So the Hummer's battery weighs more than an SR and less than an SR+ Model 3. Yikes!
A gas guzzler with an ICE is no different than one with a large pack and poor efficiency, these are not green vehicles but power sucking bricks that crush cars. Same product different fuel type. Worse for the environment in all aspects.