Tracking P85D delivery thread

[breser]

From my DS:

Based on your Model S current production notes, it looks like your Model S will not complete production until the last few days of December. That being said, we do have a way for you to still qualify for claiming the Tax Credit on your 2014 Taxes.

In years past, we found that this time of year many customers travel at the end of the month or want to be able to claim their purchase on their 2014 taxes, rather than 2015. Despite not getting into their Model S until just after December has transitioned into January, we are able to ship your car prior to years end.

In order to do this, we have the Model S Ship directly from Fremont CA to owners homes. By having the vehicle directly shipped, and not have it stop at an additional Tesla location, the dates on all our paperwork will remain in 2014 and the truck can arrive at the customer’s home after the new year at their convenience. We have a few years history of doing this for the end of year customer due to travel and tax incentive deadlines. Once your Model S arrives at your home, you can set an appointment with the service center or the gallery for the 30min walkthrough orientation, should you feel a run through on the car would be helpful.

I hate to have to keep posting about this but, I think this is bad advice on Tesla's part. I would talk to your tax professional about the tax credit. The law says the vehicle must be "placed in service" within the tax year. Placed in service is defined by the IRS as being available for your use. So I don't believe you'd qualify for the 2014 tax credit if you did it this way. I'm honestly shocked that Tesla is in effect giving tax advice here. More than likely the IRS wouldn't notice this but I personally wouldn't push my luck on this.

Relevant tax code: 26 U.S. Code § 30D - New qualified plug-in electric drive motor vehicles | LII / Legal Information Institute
Example of where the IRS explains what "placed in service" means in the context of depreciation: Publication 946 (2013), How To Depreciate Property

 

[wk057]

I may have missed it but, has anyone received next gen seats yet? My DS had no information on any changes to my seats... and they're covered in the pic he took. My assumption based on data here, though, is that it won't have them. Any other out-of-the-black-hole folks take delivery yet and maybe have an answer?

I'll find out in about 63 hours in any case...

 

[andrewket]

I hate to have to keep posting about this but, I think this is bad advice on Tesla's part. I would talk to your tax professional about the tax credit. The law says the vehicle must be "placed in service" within the tax year. Placed in service is defined by the IRS as being available for your use. So I don't believe you'd qualify for the 2014 tax credit if you did it this way. I'm honestly shocked that Tesla is in effect giving tax advice here. More than likely the IRS wouldn't notice this but I personally wouldn't push my luck on this.

Relevant tax code: 26 U.S. Code § 30D - New qualified plug-in electric drive motor vehicles | LII / Legal Information Institute
Example of where the IRS explains what "placed in service" means in the context of depreciation: Publication 946 (2013), How To Depreciate Property

If the car does not transit another tesla location, and is shipped directly to the buyer's home, title passes while the car is in California when it ships. This is legit, and has been done before.

 

[stevezzzz]

Update from my DS: after a full three days in production, my car is now 'in paint'. Which means that it could be several more days before it gets through the general assembly line, I guess, and more days in burn-in and inspection. I'd say a 12/29 delivery (my last day in Denver this year) is in jeopardy, but there's nothing to do but wait and see.

 

[Andyw2100]

I may have missed it but, has anyone received next gen seats yet? My DS had no information on any changes to my seats... and they're covered in the pic he took. My assumption based on data here, though, is that it won't have them. Any other out-of-the-black-hole folks take delivery yet and maybe have an answer?

I'll find out in about 63 hours in any case...

Yes.

I can look for the post, and will (I'll come back and edit) but one poster was surprised to find he had next gen seats both in front and back. He posted pictures.

Edit: The user is Volt. Here's the thread, with pictures: Got a nice surprise picking up my P85D tonight

 

[GetAmped]

Yes.

I can look for the post, and will (I'll come back and edit) but one poster was surprised to find he had next gen seats both in front and back. He posted pictures.

Yes, per my posting in the Interior section, I sat in an about to be delivered P85D in Toronto with the VIN 62114. The car had Black Next Gen seats in the front and the newer (not Next Gen but big headrests) in the back.

 

[wk057]

Yes.

I can look for the post, and will (I'll come back and edit) but one poster was surprised to find he had next gen seats both in front and back. He posted pictures.

Edit: The user is Volt. Here's the thread, with pictures: Got a nice surprise picking up my P85D tonight

Thanks. I'm guessing I won't have them then since his car was post-black hole.

 

[gpetti]

Sweet!

I don't want to worry you, but there has been talk here of the heated steering wheel not being something that can be retrofitted. The reason that has been thrown out for this is that supposedly a completely different wiring harness is used. (I believe that was the term.) Of course this could be wrong. I hope it works out for you.

My DS told me it was definitely not retrofittable. I had also asked the question whether this was a policy decision or a technical reason but we never got a response. I can't for the life of me figure out why they didn't make sure that the feature was retrofittable given that they were just releasing a new flagship car with a bunch of the owners being repeat owners paying a bunch of cash to get the latest and greatest technology. Or, as others have suggested, hold back building of the cars with the winter package. Obviously adds some complication but they have created a whole new realm of complication and annoyance factors.

 

[bollar]

If the car does not transit another tesla location, and is shipped directly to the buyer's home, title passes while the car is in California when it ships. This is legit, and has been done before.

It still doesn't meet the IRS definition of "in service". It satisfies Tesla's need to transfer ownership so they can arguably recognize revenue, but those who say it doesn't allow the new owner to apply for the tax credit have a point.

 

[breser]

If the car does not transit another tesla location, and is shipped directly to the buyer's home, title passes while the car is in California when it ships. This is legit, and has been done before.

I've already explained several times now how the title passing doesn't matter. That's an additional restriction not the only restriction. The scenario being described does not clear the "placed in service" limitation of the tax code.

The definition of placed in service means it's available for use. I can't fathom what tortured logic gets people to conclude that the car is available for use before you've received it. The IRS gives several examples on the link I've shared and looking at the examples I can't see how a car that's in transit qualifies.

I'm sure doing it this way is great for Tesla because of course this means the car is delivered and off their books. But I don't see how it helps with the owner take the tax credit in 2014. I doubt the Tesla employee understands this bit of the tax code and is just trying to be helpful, so don't take my point here to mean that Tesla is doing this maliciously. I think they're simply ill informed.

So I'll repeat my advice, before accepting this if you care about getting the credit in 2014 you should speak to your tax professional.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding like a broken record, but everyone keeps ignoring what I'm saying.

 

[commasign]

I've created a google docs spreadsheet where we can track this.

Andrew - can you update the google doc with option for mixed NextGen and regular seats? I.e. I got NextGen in front and regular seats in rear. Also, the comment column no longer allows free form text for some reason.

 

[jgsuperstar29]

Thanks. I'm guessing I won't have them then since his car was post-black hole.

You never know - mine was a black-hole-sun car and according to my DS I'm getting Next Gen front seats, but not rear. I'm sort of still skeptical, but I'll find out in about 17 hours...

(edit - looks like that's what happened with our fellow Black-Holer Commasign per the above post that went up as I was writing this)

 

[WarrenInCA]

I've already explained several times now how the title passing doesn't matter. That's an additional restriction not the only restriction. The scenario being described does not clear the "placed in service" limitation of the tax code.

The definition of placed in service means it's available for use. I can't fathom what tortured logic gets people to conclude that the car is available for use before you've received it. The IRS gives several examples on the link I've shared and looking at the examples I can't see how a car that's in transit qualifies.

I'm sure doing it this way is great for Tesla because of course this means the car is delivered and off their books. But I don't see how it helps with the owner take the tax credit in 2014. I doubt the Tesla employee understands this bit of the tax code and is just trying to be helpful, so don't take my point here to mean that Tesla is doing this maliciously. I think they're simply ill informed.

So I'll repeat my advice, before accepting this if you care about getting the credit in 2014 you should speak to your tax professional.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding like a broken record, but everyone keeps ignoring what I'm saying.

I googled "placed in service". Looks like even if you receive your car in 2014, but say take it to a shop to have it wrapped or such, and the job isn't completed before January 1, then you cannot take the credit in 2014!

Tax Court addresses “placed in serviceâ€￾ date

 

[Richg]

Mine went into production at the same time as another Florida car, his is on a truck, mine still in production. Let's hope still for year-end Tampa delivery. Guess production times might vary due to perhaps patch painting or something else. I know it's going to be close, but I still have faith in my DS.

 

[meltoots]

The initially estimated delivery quoted by my DS, prior to going into production, was the weekend "around 12/22". My car came out of production on 12/16 and I emailed my DS again today to inquire about the exact delivery date. He said that the vehicle has not been loaded on a transport yet, but might get here "late on the 23rd", for delivery on the 24th. If this holds true and depending on how big the truck is, your car might be on the same transport, since Cincinnati and Columbus are not that far apart. We obviously won't know until the transporter actually leaves the factory. I have yet to receive my final bill though. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks electrish! I have heard nothing today. I still feel like they will let me know when the delivery begins. I'm trying so hard to be patient! It would be awesome if we got a Xmas eve car. I am really hoping I hear something tomorrow, but not sure. I get emails from Magz Baillio, a delivery orientation specialist in Palo Alto, but I do not have a local DS yet. Looks like that happens once we need to schedule a delivery. Do you have a local DS? I will also keep you posted if I get any info this weekend. I am hopeful that they have enough to get a few to Ohio real soon!

 

[Bet TSLA]

I can't for the life of me figure out why they didn't make sure that the feature was retrofittable given that they were just releasing a new flagship car with a bunch of the owners being repeat owners paying a bunch of cash to get the latest and greatest technology. Or, as others have suggested, hold back building of the cars with the winter package. Obviously adds some complication but they have created a whole new realm of complication and annoyance factors.

As with any high tech device, your car was obsolete the day it shipped. This is a general truth nobody can avoid, and certainly not Tesla. So get used to disappointment, or buy a new car every month.

 

[yak-55]

I finished production on the 18th, but I have absolutely no additional information. Two emails to DS have gone unanswered. No new documents, request for payment or anything. I've been assuming it's on the truck with others, but that may be wishful thinking. I believe RichG is in our same group, but apparently still in production....

With email not working, I'll start calling them tomorrow. Any of you getting updates from Georgia (DS) or Tampa (SC) ?

@docgarner, @zzzzdoc, @boeing777, @Craig, @Yak-55, @berryja, we could have a car hauler heading for the Sunshine State via Marietta I would think. Any word from your DSs?

 

[3s-a-charm]

Noticed that nobody has had a P85D delivered with Matte Obeche trim... for what it's worth.

Would love to see some interior photos of delivered cars with Grey Next Gen Seats (even just front) if anyone has received them?

 

[AlMc]

I've already explained several times now how the title passing doesn't matter. That's an additional restriction not the only restriction. The scenario being described does not clear the "placed in service" limitation of the tax code.

The definition of placed in service means it's available for use. I can't fathom what tortured logic gets people to conclude that the car is available for use before you've received it. The IRS gives several examples on the link I've shared and looking at the examples I can't see how a car that's in transit qualifies.

I'm sure doing it this way is great for Tesla because of course this means the car is delivered and off their books. But I don't see how it helps with the owner take the tax credit in 2014. I doubt the Tesla employee understands this bit of the tax code and is just trying to be helpful, so don't take my point here to mean that Tesla is doing this maliciously. I think they're simply ill informed.

So I'll repeat my advice, before accepting this if you care about getting the credit in 2014 you should speak to your tax professional.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding like a broken record, but everyone keeps ignoring what I'm saying.

You are 100% correct and the IRS has a legitimate case against you if you do not have the vehicle 'in service'. The question is whether you are willing to take the chance. Do you have a specific case where the IRS has gone to court over a situation similar to what TM is suggesting? I am not trying to be confrontational just saying there is a bit of a gray area here. Personally, if I literally drive my car for the first time Jan 3rd after taking actual delivery that day but I have the car paid for, the Cali title in my name and the car 'in transit' by Dec 31st I will take that chance. I would NOT take the chance if I did not meet that criteria.
I accept that I may risk an audit and have to explain my actions and I do not suggest anyone do as I do without accepting the possible consequence that you may be in deep s**t.

 

[wk057]

Well, I don't know how Tesla is shipping these, but, my DS said my car was loaded on a transport in the afternoon of the 16th, and he sent me a picture of it sitting in the lot at Devon PA this evening, roughly 72 hours after he said it was loaded. That's about 2900 miles in 3 days, which is pretty impressive. Only way I could see that happening is with a double driver truck.