OzTzlaBloke
Member
lol
I can log the voltages over time in true rms via bluetooth as more ammo on the supply
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Universal Mobile Connector (UMC) in Australia
- Thread starter Power Hungry
- Start date
I can log the voltages over time in true rms via bluetooth as more ammo on the supply
Another suggestion:
Test the UMC at another premises with a known higher supply voltage and see what the Car says is the charging voltage. But you will obviously need a premises with a 32A socket. This is in case the UMC itself is nerfing the supply voltage
I was surprised it was that low (the 216v limit)-
So if your 'normal' house voltage is that low - and your street supply is 63a (i thought that was the breaker just for your charger circuit) i wouldn't be surprised if you had that much droop between board-circuit-car my supply voltage is higher, and using the UMC at 10a on my outdoor power point i would see significantly lower voltage.
3ph would give you 11kw - but 7 is still probably fine for overnight charging - especially if you don't have TOU - i wanted the full 11kw to be able to both suck as much as my solar can produce, and charge from low to full between 10pm and 6am.
Oh yeah
. The operational voltage range is wide.I've tried to get my street voltage turned down as I suspect it's the cause of various electronics failures over the years. I've told Ausgrid that electronic equipment should not be exposed to 250V but when they come and measure it's always under 250V surprise surprise. I am basically above 245V (and never under 240V) even in the evenings when the electricity demand from the grid is highest in the street and even when I hit peak instantaneous electricity draw at 20kW
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Check what the Tesla reports as you turn down the current draw. If it's resistive voltage drop, you should see it rise closer to the open circuit voltage as you drop the current.
Are you using the HPWC or UMC?
(I believe the LV voltage drop limits in the Australian standard is 5% from the point of supply, so that 208V at the car with point of supply at 221 is not too far away).
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OzTzlaBloke
Member
Gday everyone. Hope your Tesla's are going great
So an update on my situation, Fiddling around in the fuse box has been of value. My supplier has taken all the logs and is doing an assessment. I was pretty impressed with my supplier - they genuinely want to do better than the Aussie standards and to offer high service levels consistently. It wont be a five minute fix but I am confident of their intent so it looks promising. Fingers crossed.
So an update on my situation, Fiddling around in the fuse box has been of value. My supplier has taken all the logs and is doing an assessment. I was pretty impressed with my supplier - they genuinely want to do better than the Aussie standards and to offer high service levels consistently. It wont be a five minute fix but I am confident of their intent so it looks promising. Fingers crossed.
OzTzlaBloke
Member
Guys would appreciate assistance here please
Inform/correct me where needed please. The big fuse I take that to be the mains supply fuse. The writing 80A means 80 amps but as I understand it, it takes a big whack to actually trip that fuse not a short intermittent spike or whatever. I note also my 63A mains thing, thats not a circuit breaker that will trip at 63A but actually just a switch. So as I understand it, the only thing limiting the situation is that big fuse where if I trip over 80A momentarily I wont actually blow that thing. I can see its sealed with tamper stuff so it seems a drama if I actually do blow it.
What does SPD slash MPD mean after the 80A as written?
The picture on the POA and the mains supply with 16mm means to me that from the point of access, its all 16mm copper to the fuse box and its in conduit.
What does SDI mains mean after the 16mm? And what does the #31463 mean?
I believe the root cause of the problem is actually from the power pole to the POA. My neighbour has a mutually shared power pole and his is way thicker than mine, like I believe mine is probably 6mm and his to be 16mm. I understand something around 2007 saw new premises get 16mm from the pole to the POA minimum for houses.
Inform/correct me where needed please. The big fuse I take that to be the mains supply fuse. The writing 80A means 80 amps but as I understand it, it takes a big whack to actually trip that fuse not a short intermittent spike or whatever. I note also my 63A mains thing, thats not a circuit breaker that will trip at 63A but actually just a switch. So as I understand it, the only thing limiting the situation is that big fuse where if I trip over 80A momentarily I wont actually blow that thing. I can see its sealed with tamper stuff so it seems a drama if I actually do blow it.
What does SPD slash MPD mean after the 80A as written?
The picture on the POA and the mains supply with 16mm means to me that from the point of access, its all 16mm copper to the fuse box and its in conduit.
What does SDI mains mean after the 16mm? And what does the #31463 mean?
I believe the root cause of the problem is actually from the power pole to the POA. My neighbour has a mutually shared power pole and his is way thicker than mine, like I believe mine is probably 6mm and his to be 16mm. I understand something around 2007 saw new premises get 16mm from the pole to the POA minimum for houses.
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SPD = Service Protection Device
MPD = Meter Protection Device
See here
SDI = Single core Double Insulated
#31463. Not sure exactly but I think it is the 4pole 63A RCCB (residual current circuit breaker).
However a 4pole is for 3phase electricity and a 2pole is for 1phase electricity (in which case it would be #31263)
MPD = Meter Protection Device
See here
SDI = Single core Double Insulated
#31463. Not sure exactly but I think it is the 4pole 63A RCCB (residual current circuit breaker).
However a 4pole is for 3phase electricity and a 2pole is for 1phase electricity (in which case it would be #31263)
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Did you get the grid operator check the street voltage? Another way is to turn off all the loads in the house and re-measure using the GPO in the meter box (if there is one)
"Point of attachment"
See here
OzTzlaBloke
Member
Great stuff thanks Quickst
My case is pic A being overhead service - supply from overhead distribution mains
The cable run is approx 29m from the power pole to the POA on what I think is 6mm
Its a 100 year old house. I understand 40A therefore max despite all the 63A 16mm mains supply and stuff from the POA onwards. How the hell the ducted air conditioning ever got installed in that state before me in this residence escapes me. Forget about 7KW for the Tesla the ducted air con alone ontop of usual domestic loads.
Why do I have sinking feeling that despite this being grid side stuff to fix it, means, the grid isnt responsible for paying lol I need 16mm for that 29m run.
My case is pic A being overhead service - supply from overhead distribution mains
The cable run is approx 29m from the power pole to the POA on what I think is 6mm
Its a 100 year old house. I understand 40A therefore max despite all the 63A 16mm mains supply and stuff from the POA onwards. How the hell the ducted air conditioning ever got installed in that state before me in this residence escapes me. Forget about 7KW for the Tesla the ducted air con alone ontop of usual domestic loads.
Why do I have sinking feeling that despite this being grid side stuff to fix it, means, the grid isnt responsible for paying lol
I need 16mm for that 29m run.Yes you pay for the upgrade and also the "Daily supply charge" in your electricity bill
Older houses are only 6mm
You will need a Level 2 electrical contractor.
If you are going to upgrade the service lines , the electrical contractor will likely also advise you to upgrade the Mains Box.
Maybe even go 3Phase while you are at it if you need the power.
OzTzlaBloke
Member
If we assume single phase 63A domestic on 16mm wiring not just mains supply from POA to fuse box but the POA to the power pole as well which is a 29M cable run from POA to Pole. Im still getting concerned around amperage given one Tesla will pull 32A no problems given the size of the battery banks its only a fractional C rate @ 32A. So its more or less continous while charging @ 32A, only when its off does it come back from that demand.
63A - 32A - Budget of 31A left
So Im doing an audit of typical use cases in my residence like a) always on wattage estimates b) "activity" type wattage estimates excluding big stuff like ducted reverse cycle air con. I have continous gas hot water and gas cooktops with an electric oven. Where Im confused is moving from the maximum amperage of the ducted air con to what it tends to average out at over a period of time. Similar to I know the fridge will pull hard on start then settle around 550W ongoing.
31A left where the plaque on the air con is saying max draw of it can be 27.5A jeezz wow
So my concern would be allot less if the nominal ampacity was like 12A and not say pegging to 27.5A 88% of the time. I'm in the dark here guys.
I know that I have no house side master breaker only a switch. The only big master breaker is that supply side 80A fuse which according to the meter swap sparky wont blow on momentary spikes and basically takes a crap tonne to actually blow it wont go on 81A or anywhere close. So I believe I can do like 90A-100A, as the smart meter now installed I think wont be happy beyond 100A. Atleast on spec reading the new smart meter.
Sorry guys for the long posts. Ill try to give back things I know with putting in the time here to help other topics out that I know well. This stuff Im not very experienced in with residential power.
63A - 32A - Budget of 31A left
So Im doing an audit of typical use cases in my residence like a) always on wattage estimates b) "activity" type wattage estimates excluding big stuff like ducted reverse cycle air con. I have continous gas hot water and gas cooktops with an electric oven. Where Im confused is moving from the maximum amperage of the ducted air con to what it tends to average out at over a period of time. Similar to I know the fridge will pull hard on start then settle around 550W ongoing.
31A left where the plaque on the air con is saying max draw of it can be 27.5A jeezz wow
So my concern would be allot less if the nominal ampacity was like 12A and not say pegging to 27.5A 88% of the time. I'm in the dark here guys.
I know that I have no house side master breaker only a switch. The only big master breaker is that supply side 80A fuse which according to the meter swap sparky wont blow on momentary spikes and basically takes a crap tonne to actually blow it wont go on 81A or anywhere close. So I believe I can do like 90A-100A, as the smart meter now installed I think wont be happy beyond 100A. Atleast on spec reading the new smart meter.
Sorry guys for the long posts. Ill try to give back things I know with putting in the time here to help other topics out that I know well. This stuff Im not very experienced in with residential power.
Why wouldnt you just charge the tesla slower over longer periods, and don’t charge it at all on days that the aircon needs more draw or other appliances such as oven/cooking are on?
That AC unit is rated at input power of 3.12kW (cooling) / 3.59kW (heating) - that's 14A / 16A. The 27.5A would just be worst-case brief surge at startup.
Do you have electric hot water? That would usually be another 15A when it's heating.
You can always dial down the car's draw in the app if you're having problems with nuisance tripping.
The best person to speak to would be your electrician. But I think you should be Ok assuming the supply side to house is OK - especially charging overnight when loads are lower.
I've always said that in a single phase setting, do not assume that there is spare uncontended 32A capacity in a 63A setting.
If there is not enough capacity, then there is not enough capacity. In those cases try 20A
It should still charge with time to spare with overnight charging.
Note the air con is like the Fridge. Initial starting always draw high current.
80A. Never go beyond "rated". It's not about how close you can get to the breaking point.
Don't worry about the max draw, a C curve 63A breaker won't pop on the startup spikes same as the 80A fuse. Even if it hits 100A spike no issue. It's to protect your 16mm cable and that will have no issues. Your Sparkly will give the same advice. But you are far better off with a 63A breaker popping instead of your 80A service fuse.
The SPD/MPD thing is just your mains are in conduit all the way from the connection point on the house to the meter box. Mine got upgraded but the 16mm mains is not in conduit. so the SPD is on the connection point and the MPD is inside the fuse box. (2 separate fuses)
The SPD/MPD thing is just your mains are in conduit all the way from the connection point on the house to the meter box. Mine got upgraded but the 16mm mains is not in conduit. so the SPD is on the connection point and the MPD is inside the fuse box. (2 separate fuses)
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OzTzlaBloke
Member
Thanks so much. Cafz did you look that data up elsewhere? Where/how did you figure out those amp values?
I have gas cooktop and continous gas hot water. I believe the electrical part of the Rinnai hot water is around 150w
Yes I just looked up the datasheet from the model number in your photo.
If your main switch really isn't a circuit breaker (if it says C63 on it, then it is), I'd get that replaced with a MCB. It's the current standard, and as @Borgy says, you don't want your service fuse to pop, you'd be without power until you can get a level 2 electrician on site.
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