UP vs MPP Coilover

[kbecks13]

Would be great for both UP and MPP to post more technical information like spring rate, compression, rebound etc about their products. Great to see 8x10 glossy of the coilovers, but it does not tell me much about how it would handle. MPP has one graph, UP none.

Idk, what benefit would that really have? There isn't much data in terms of changing suspension on Model 3, so i don't think we as owners would really be able to look at that data and say "oh, this is the better choice" and make decisions based on that. Plus if they share that information they are basically giving competitors the benefit of all the testing and tuning that they've done on the suspension.

Seems like the best bet for now is to trust people who review the suspension (like Top Gear for UP or Speed District for MPP) and make decisions based on that. I can't really think of another car that would handle similar to the Model 3 given the battery pack location and all that!

 

[MountainPass]

Would be great for both UP and MPP to post more technical information like spring rate, compression, rebound etc about their products. Great to see 8x10 glossy of the coilovers, but it does not tell me much about how it would handle. MPP has one graph, UP none.

We simply can't share that information, we spent a lot of money to gain it. Flights, rentals, shock dyno testing, and many years of suspension tuning experience that you can't put a monetary value on. We at least expect our competitors to invest that time and money themselves, rather than us serve it to them on a platter!

 

[bradhs]

I want the exact same ride but 1" lower. How can I accomplish that?

We simply can't share that information, we spent a lot of money to gain it. Flights, rentals, shock dyno testing, and many years of suspension tuning experience that you can't put a monetary value on. We at least expect our competitors to invest that time and money themselves, rather than us serve it to them on a platter!

 

[MountainPass]

UP coilovers are not DFV. That technology is exclusive to Ohlins branded Road & Track coilovers.

UP doesn't state which components of the coilover come from Ohlins. It could be a totally irrelevent part.

All we could tell from the description is they are assembled in the USA, and made in a mysterious land not worthy of mention.

 

[dfwatt]

We simply can't share that information, we spent a lot of money to gain it. Flights, rentals, shock dyno testing, and many years of suspension tuning experience that you can't put a monetary value on. We at least expect our competitors to invest that time and money themselves, rather than us serve it to them on a platter!

Exactly. The first thing that would happen would be a Chinese company cloning your kits, undercutting your price structure, and potentially putting you out of business. What would help would be track times pre and post kit install, at various stages and increments of build-out. Tires/wheels first perhaps, then suspension kit plus tires, then more radical suspension kit plus wheels/tires.

 

[MountainPass]

Exactly. The first thing that would happen would be a Chinese company cloning your kits, undercutting your price structure, and potentially putting you out of business. What would help would be track times pre and post kit install, at various stages and increments of build-out. Tires/wheels first perhaps, then suspension kit plus tires, then more radical suspension kit plus wheels/tires.

We have been able to do those comparisons, such as our Speed Academy test where we had to revert the car to stock then modify it again all during one day at the track for recording times. We were also able to help Cameron compare his P3D+ times with stock vs. MPP suspension!

 

[kbecks13]

We were also able to help Cameron compare his P3D+ times with stock vs. MPP suspension!

@Odiemac do you happen to have times for pre and post coilovers at Laguna Seca (or anywhere)? Would be super interesting!

 

[Odiemac]

@Odiemac do you happen to have times for pre and post coilovers at Laguna Seca (or anywhere)? Would be super interesting!

I’d say the coil-overs alone are worth up to 2 seconds a lap, but could be potentially worth more time to people with less track experience. The stock suspension can generate grip, but it’s way leaned over on the bump stops so can behave erratically in a bumpy corner. You can push through the eractic feel to set a time, but it’s not confidence-inspiring.

Definitely recommend coil-overs, not only is the track performance great, but the street ride is better in some ways! Even the stock car is riding its rubber bump stops way too often with the soft stock springs.

 

[kbecks13]

I’d say the coil-overs alone are worth up to 2 seconds a lap, but could be potentially worth more time to people with less track experience.

Awesome, i should get about 10 seconds then

Now can you slap in some UP coilovers and let us know how they compare?

 

[dfwatt]

Thanks, I'll have to check out the Speed Academy videos!

We have been able to do those comparisons, such as our Speed Academy test where we had to revert the car to stock then modify it again all during one day at the track for recording times. We were also able to help Cameron compare his P3D+ times with stock vs. MPP suspension!

So you must be pulling well over 1G in the corners with that setup to get those times? My guess is something around 1.05 G . . which is serious stick. Do you have any formal data on lateral acceleration?

 

[MountainPass]

Thanks, I'll have to check out the Speed Academy videos!


So you must be pulling well over 1G in the corners with that setup to get those times? My guess is something around 1.05 G . . which is serious stick. Do you have any formal data on lateral acceleration?

We sure do!

1.33 lateral G's on RE71R street tires. Cameron would have exceeded that by quite a bit on his Hoosiers at Laguna.

 

[jgrgnt]

I’d say the coil-overs alone are worth up to 2 seconds a lap, but could be potentially worth more time to people with less track experience. The stock suspension can generate grip, but it’s way leaned over on the bump stops so can behave erratically in a bumpy corner. You can push through the eractic feel to set a time, but it’s not confidence-inspiring.

Definitely recommend coil-overs, not only is the track performance great, but the street ride is better in some ways! Even the stock car is riding its rubber bump stops way too often with the soft stock springs.

Interesting. I've had some uneasy moments when going through fast corners and hitting a bump or dip in the road. Like the rear end suddenly became very "loose". Is this because the car is sitting on the bump stop when it encounters the dip? I could imagine how that would throw the car into an unpredictable state.

 

[beastmode13]

We sure do!

1.33 lateral G's on RE71R street tires. Cameron would have exceeded that by quite a bit on his Hoosiers at Laguna.

Cool this is the data I’m looking for. FWIW. I pre-ordered the performance coilover plus control arms when it was announced some months ago.

 

[MountainPass]

Cool this is the data I’m looking for. FWIW. I pre-ordered the performance coilover plus control arms when it was announced some months ago.

Awesome! The coilovers won't be much longer at all

 

[beastmode13]

Awesome! The coilovers won't be much longer at all

Would it ship before Xmas? If not I will not be able to install them until Feb/March. Xmas break is my designated DIY install time. Suspension, brakes and wheels/tires.

 

[MountainPass]

Would it ship before Xmas? If not I will not be able to install them until Feb/March. Xmas break is my designated DIY install time. Suspension, brakes and wheels/tires.

Definitely not before Xmas, they have to ship from Germany.

 

[Odiemac]

Interesting. I've had some uneasy moments when going through fast corners and hitting a bump or dip in the road. Like the rear end suddenly became very "loose". Is this because the car is sitting on the bump stop when it encounters the dip? I could imagine how that would throw the car into an unpredictable state.

Yes, I think that's quite possible. A stock P3D+ car only has about an inch of suspension travel before it starts engaging the bump stops, and the rubber bump stops are definitely going to inject some weird behavior at the cornering limits.

 

[kbecks13]

Yes, I think that's quite possible. A stock P3D+ car only has about an inch of suspension travel before it starts engaging the bump stops, and the rubber bump stops are definitely going to inject some weird behavior at the cornering limits.

Dang that little? Really can't wait to get my coilovers installed, should have something special to show you guys at the next Tesla Corsa

 

[bradhs]

Yes, I think that's quite possible. A stock P3D+ car only has about an inch of suspension travel before it starts engaging the bump stops, and the rubber bump stops are definitely going to inject some weird behavior at the cornering limits.

Are you sure? 1" is nothing.

 

[Dave EV]

Are you sure? 1" is nothing.

That's common on modern vehicles from the factory. Sometimes you'll find a car that is resting on the "bump stops", stock. Your typical OEM bump stop is fairly long and highly progressive, so the first inch or so of engagement doesn't do that much, but the rate of the stop goes up quickly from there. You should think of your typical OEM bump stop as less of a "let's stick a bit of rubber in there to keep things from bottoming out too hard" but instead of a secondary spring that adds to the spring rate progressively.

More reading on bump stops here:
The Bump Stops Here - Tech Talk - Modified Magazine

It would be interesting to see what MPP and UP does with the bump stops on their coilovers, but your typical coilover will typically use a bump stop that is more of a bump stop and less of a secondary spring.