Excellent question. I don't know if ours is rated to run in heat pump only mode at those temps (only gets as low as low 20's ºF here for a few hours each winter) but I believe there are mini splits that do. Others here who can comment?
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V2G with PG&E, Tesla, and Ossiaco?
- Thread starter rays427
- Start date
Mine is an american standard, ducted, traditional forced air. 1 compressor, 1 indoor coil, 3 ton. I have heat strips for backup, but they don't seem to be needed or come on until less than 0F. The heat pump is supposed to work down to -10F, but I'm not so sure about that.
I was interested in using the car as battery backup using Ossiaco because it appeared it would be cheaper than buying 2 powerwalls. I could not justify 2 powerwalls at about $20,000 especially since my solar puts out almost no power during the winter. How do you folks use the powerwalls to payout the investment? I can see with PG&E revising their ev time of use I can see some advantage but not $20,000 worth.
Yep. For many, the emotion of have power if going out if worth the money. For others playing the tou game. For others, just have money to burn. For others, got SGIP help. I am going to try and play the game of using batteries at peak, and sending back whatever solar I am making, which really is not that much for that long, and thats none winter, which is zero. I just tell folks there is no ROI I can justify for batteries for folks to spend their kids college fund.
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Good analysis.Yep. For many, the emotion of have power if going out if worth the money. For others playing the tou game. For others, just have money to burn. For others, got SGIP help. I am going to try and play the game of using batteries at peak, and sending back whatever solar I am making, which really is not that much for that long, and thats non winter, which is zero. I just tell folks there is no ROI I can justify for batteries for folks to spend their kids college fund.
And college funds are the reasons we parents push kids to work and study hard and get scholarships.
The PW's are a fun toy to play with, but talk about a waste of time!! And I already had a 22K generator. Still best bang for buck IMO is just load up on as many panels as one can. I will see if I can get more crazy when my bid comes in to expand.Good analysis.
And college funds are the reasons we parents push kids to work and study hard and get scholarships.
If you look at PW and home battery in general as a financial investment then you will likely be very disappointed. Only practical way to not lose money on the "investment" based on standard financial ROI analysis is through government subsidies if you can get them.
All-electric F150 provides up to 9.6KW V2H backup power with starting price < $40K before incentives. The article also states support for TOU home load shifting is coming. Appears to have battery capacity greater than 10x Powerwall 2 at significantly lower cost?
www.greencarreports.com
First drive review: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning revolutionizes the pickup truck
The F-150 Lightning outdoes its gasoline counterpart in many respects—and charts new territory as a power broker.
It does look pretty sweet, though the 9.6kw is not for the base model and all require a high capacity charger and home transfer switch to do the V2H backup. Oh, and it has to fit in your garage…
At the rate Tesla is shipping Powerwalls the e-F150 might get to market before my Powerwall order comes in…
Cross that bridge when we get there...
All the best,
BG
At the rate Tesla is shipping Powerwalls the e-F150 might get to market before my Powerwall order comes in…
Cross that bridge when we get there...All the best,
BG
It does look pretty sweet, though the 9.6kw is not for the base model and all require a high capacity charger and home transfer switch to do the V2H backup. Oh, and it has to fit in your garage…
At the rate Tesla is shipping Powerwalls the e-F150 might get to market before my Powerwall order comes in…
All the best,
BG
Yeah, and Sunrun is partnering with Ford to put in the 80A charger and the fancy V2G thing. I can't believe they can do this, but I couldn't get some bloody powerwalls set up without an act of Congress and couldn't find someone to put in a 48A charger. Ugh.
PS, I wonder if they can do V2G if a home has the MSP within 36 inches of the gas riser hehe.
Sunrun To Install 80-amp Charge Station For All-Electric Ford F-150 Lightning
(RTTNews) - Sunrun (RUN), a home solar, battery storage, and energy services provider, said that it has partnered with Ford Motor Co. (F) to provide installation of 80-amp Ford charge station pro and home integration system for the all-electric Ford F-150 Lightning.Sunrun noted t
www.nasdaq.com
I just realized my garage is next to my gas riser. So if I park a F150 in my garage it'll be closer than 36" to the gas riser. Pending EXPLOOOOOSSIONNNNNN during V2G.
Probably not. But V2H is possible because that is behind the meter and would not involve export.
Frankly, V2G seems less and less attractive compared to V2H given the likely price POCO's would pay. Why go through all the hassle when PG&E would most likely only pay you 3 cents/kwh?
All-electric F150 provides up to 9.6KW V2H backup power with starting price < $40K before incentives. The article also states support for TOU home load shifting is coming. Appears to have battery capacity greater than 10x Powerwall 2 at significantly lower cost?
First drive review: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning revolutionizes the pickup truck
The F-150 Lightning outdoes its gasoline counterpart in many respects—and charts new territory as a power broker.
While your statement is correct, the "starting price under 40k" vehicle trim is ment for commercial applications only, and certainly does not have the ability to do "9.6kW". The vehicle they expect regular people to start with is the XLT, that supposedly starts in the mid 50s, (before incentives) and still does not come with the 9.6kW battery at that price point.
While I think this vehicle will be successful, with the top battery trim offering "up to" 300 miles (and that wont be the mid 50k version), I am hoping people are not buying into that specific hype of "up to 9.6k battery starting under 40k" because that configuration doesnt exist.
2022 Ford F-150 Lightning's Trim Levels Explained
The new electric pickup is available in XLT, Lariat, and Platinum models, and a base model is coming, too. This is the equipment each one gets.
www.caranddriver.com
(XLT starts at 55k, lariat starts at 59k, and the "XLT" is the entry level "non work truck" version)
GenSao
Member
While your statement is correct, the "starting price under 40k" vehicle trim is ment for commercial applications only, and certainly does not have the ability to do "9.6kW". The vehicle they expect regular people to start with is the XLT, that supposedly starts in the mid 50s, (before incentives) and still does not come with the 9.6kW battery at that price point.
While I think this vehicle will be successful, with the top battery trim offering "up to" 300 miles (and that wont be the mid 50k version), I am hoping people are not buying into that specific hype of "up to 9.6k battery starting under 40k" because that configuration doesnt exist.
2022 Ford F-150 Lightning's Trim Levels Explained
The new electric pickup is available in XLT, Lariat, and Platinum models, and a base model is coming, too. This is the equipment each one gets.
(XLT starts at 55k, lariat starts at 59k, and the "XLT" is the entry level "non work truck" version)
I agree the XLT would be the minimum trim and it comes with the Standard Battery. You'll have to pay extra to upgrade to the Extended Range Battery if you want the 80-amp Ford Charge Station Pro included, otherwise it is an extra cost. See page 35-36 of Ford's online brochure.
"Ford is also teaming up with the nation's leading solar company, Sunrun, to facilitate easy installation of the 80-amp Ford Charge Station Pro and home integration system. " Sunrun can facilitate the installation of additional required equipment and the home transfer switch required to disconnect the home from the grid. I imagine the hardware and install cost can be easily $4K-6K on top of the purchase price of the vehicle.
The installation cost of the 80A Ford charger could qualify for the federal tax credit when installed with solar.
If its 4-6k thats not bad (comparatively speaking) if one is comparing it to the typical powerwall setup. Since this car is being sold "the regular way" through dealers, one TMCer already has been told that their reservation was going to be subject to "market adjustment" pricing (read, markup above list).
This certainly is not the "ford lightning" thread, but for the purposes of the V2H discussion and this vehicle, people really need to understand what the cost to get this vehicle is, if one of the reasons they are choosing it is for that feature. I havent seen how much adding the extended range battery to it is (which adds the 9.6kW capability), but we have seen that the vehicle which comes with the extended battery included is the top trim "platinum" one, and is 70K+.
Actual pricing will certainly vary and likely be higher than base price for most buyers which is common in the auto industry. Everyone remembers the $35K M3.
Based on the article you referenced, XLT (~$55K) is the minimum trim with 2.4KW inverter which could be more than adequate V2H for many people that just need backup power to keep refrigerator, electronics and/or cpap machine going during grid outages. The 9.6KW inverter option is likely < $2K since the 7.2KW for F150 hybrid is only $750 based on what I have seen.
In the extreme, assuming whatever eF150 trim/package that includes the all singing and dancing version of V2H is $90K (full loaded top trim price before incentives How Much Will the 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning Cost?) that still appears to be quite a bit cheaper than any existing home battery system of equal capacity that I am aware of. It seems home battery vendors may have pretty heft margin after all.
if "keep the fridge running" is the goal, there are a number of smaller generator solutions that would be much much less than this. People dont want to just run the fridge or they would have small, inexpensive generators.
In any case, as people say "choice is good". People will still need transfer switches, etc to enable this, it wont be a $500 wall connector., but will likely be less than the entire powerwall solution. When someone is chasing a market leader, they normally offer more value.
