nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Then I pay over $400 a month of electricity for a family of 4 during the pandemic.
Sounds like you need more solar or more batteries or more of both...
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Then I pay over $400 a month of electricity for a family of 4 during the pandemic.
Sounds like you need more solar or more batteries or more of both...
Then I pay over $400 a month of electricity for a family of 4 during the pandemic. I don’t even have a pool or crazy appliance.
If you don't mind me asking, what was your bill last year for July in both kWh and electric costs? Have you switched out all of your incandescent lights for LED versions? I was using 9,388 kWh in 2017 and switched all of the lights over to LED and dropped the usage down to 6,950 kWh in 2018, went up to 7,144 kWH in 2019 with higher summer heat = higher AC usage.
A single 60W bulb on for 24 hours a day for the 30 day month is 43.2 kWh and with PG&E rates around $0.26/kWh (transmission, generation, taxes, conservative fee due to overusage, etc) that is $11.23/month. I know it's insane for a single light to cost that much each month, but that is how the math works out. A 60W equivalent LED is only 8.5W, so 6.12kWh and $1.59/month. Ok, so you don't have every light on 24 hours a day, so how about 5 hours (6:00pm - 11:00pm) that is $1.87 vs $0.27 ($1.60). Buy them at Costco in bulk (60W 40 pack for $58.99 = $1.47/each) and they pay for themselves in less than a month.
I (personally) have no problem with that. Heat pump water heaters are one of the most energy efficient options out there. Bonus points when that energy is produced (mostly) cleanly.Silicon Valley Clean Energy is certainly pushing all electric households. They have rebates for replacing gas water heaters with heat pump models.
Chalk that up as opportunity cost, or cost of the lesson?Yeah that's why I'm in the process of getting PV + Battery. But that means I've been burning money paying these PG&E jerks each month they've gouged me.
Chalk that up as opportunity cost, or cost of the lesson?
Doing the conversion couple years ago when the rebates were stronger (or when politics wrote obviously on the walls) would've saved you capital on installation, and all costs leading up to now?
I appreciate all the efficiency changes you've invested in to reduce your usage, but like Jevon's Paradox -- being more efficient doesn't mean you'll use less. It still boils down to the top energy-users, and is it within your "energy" budget.
Running the blower nearly 24/7, or whatnot, seems to have blown your "budget". Then, you fall into PG&E's penalties. In comparison, I run my blower 24/7 (on Ecobee's schedule), I have the least efficient SEER (10), but I struggle to use my utility's energy in order to not pay them monthly for under-usage. I have even switched the guest bathroom's one light-bulb to incandescent just because the fluorescent can't deal with the motion-sensor dimmer anymore.
Thanks for the heads-up. It's a 22 year old air-handler that turns on variably, for 10 minutes or so, under Ecobee's control with a MERV 13 filter. It runs at ~500 watts -- 18 kWh this week, 99.4 kWh this month according to TP-Link smart-plug it's plugged into. I generated 662 kWh since Aug 20th (with the 50% reduction from smog/ash), so using very little in my scheme of things. I'm due for a full-system replacement whenever the air-system actually breaks down.If you're running your blowers 24/7 you should check to make sure they're Constant Torque ECM motors. Almost all newer residential HVAC systems will have these and just about any variable speed HVAC system will have these.
The older PSC blower motors will burn money since they consume a lot of energy even at lower CFM airflow and static pressures.
In my case I spent extra time specing out the air handlers, UV Air scrubbers, MERV 16 filters, and re-did the plenums for optimal flow and cleaning potential. So, I personally do not think the equivalent of two 60 watt bulbs on my two ECM blowers running constantly is pushing my tiered energy rates from "Tier 1" into "Tier you gonna get %$*!ed".
I think PG&E just doles out useless Tiered rates for any home that is expected to run AC's. And that's a load of crap IMO since it's often over 100 out here.
If you're running your blowers 24/7 you should check to make sure they're Constant Torque ECM motors. Almost all newer residential HVAC systems will have these and just about any variable speed HVAC system will have these.
The older PSC blower motors will burn money since they consume a lot of energy even at lower CFM airflow and static pressures.
In my case I spent extra time specing out the air handlers, UV Air scrubbers, MERV 16 filters, and re-did the plenums for optimal flow and cleaning potential. So, I personally do not think the equivalent of two 60 watt bulbs on my two ECM blowers running constantly is pushing my tiered energy rates from "Tier 1" into "Tier you gonna get %$*!ed".
I think PG&E just doles out useless Tiered rates for any home that is expected to run AC's. And that's a load of crap IMO since it's often over 100 out here.
Well that 120W running for 24 hours is 2.88kwh. The baseline in the SF Bay Area is currently 10.3-10.8kwh/day, so this is 27.4% of your baseline low cost usage. Running things 24/7 adds up quickly.
Thanks for the heads-up. It's a 22 year old air-handler that turns on variably, for 10 minutes or so, under Ecobee's control with a MERV 13 filter. It runs at ~500 watts -- 18 kWh this week, 99.4 kWh this month according to TP-Link smart-plug it's plugged into. I generated 662 kWh since Aug 20th (with the 50% reduction from smog/ash), so using very little in my scheme of things. I'm due for a full-system replacement whenever the air-system actually breaks down.
How much total-power is your blowers using to push you from Tier 1? Do you have something like a Sense monitor (which mostly doesn't work), or lots of energy-monitoring smart-plugs, to quantify your usage and then you can narrow your optimization focus?
Sorry I'm just jumping into this thread, but sounds like you should do everything to take advantage of the extra sun/heat you have there. I'm in SCE territory where Tier 2 is only $0.27 / kWh comparatively. The grandfathered TOU plan, it's $0.56 / kWh during peak 2-8pm (aka A/C) hours. So gotta deal with it by getting out of their game.
My son in AZ is more than 2x of thatY..., my monthly consumption was just shy of 1,000 kWh. ..
...
My son in AZ is more than 2x of that
16 therms = 464kWh; A HPWH uses ~70% less energy than a gas water heater so you would only need ~140kWh. During the summer I would expect ~90% of gas use is for water heating unless you're running a soup kitchen.
If your son used a monthly 2,000 kWh in my zip code under PG&E's BS-Baseline-Tier-Rate (no EV) during August 2020, then his electricity bill would be like $900.
I still want to see the "average family" that PG&E talks about that only uses 309 kWh of electricity in a month. There's no way this "family" lives in a part of the USA that was hitting 100F+ during a state-wide-shelter-in-place-order.
OP here. The 75 gallon gas storage water here is still working well onto it’s 16 years of operation. I am finding that replacement is in the $2900 range with extra cost attributed to the extra installer due to the size of a 75 gallons storage. I am still interested in the heat pump water heater (HPWH), but now considering using one to preheat the water, and using a series of control valves to build up a system HPWH inline with a gas storage water heater, and a way to by-pass either. I can go with smaller and less expensive and easier to handle (self-install) and maintain in the long-run. The HPWC between the 50, 65 and 80 gallon sizes all have the same heat pump/engine. Has anybody tried this or am I too impractical or having my imagination go unchecked? This is also in the garage, and wonder whether jurisdictions allow this, and does the HPWC require a pedestal to be built regardless if there is no ignition source?
Induction is better then gas!There are also local municipalities trying to ban natural gas in new construction, ahead of any statewide efforts, for similar reasons.
One effort going on near me. Don't think most folks would mind much about gas vs heat pump water heater - but take away gas burners for cooking, the pitchforks came out en masse. Then add that their mayor is an exec for one of the regional electricity CCA's, huge controversy.
Holeydonut you need to move out of that liberal state or quit complaining about your rate. I pay 8 cents on tri-county cooperative, some pay 4 cents on the commercial state system.
It is caused by the way your state votes, and California politicians think the rest of the county should follow suit. communism sucks, and they want to lower my standard of living...
I was raised out there, I had nightmares when I was a kid about the Mountains/hills on fire (well sort of, I was saving the cute blonde girl down the street). Weather patterns are cyclical and it don’t help that arsonists are contributing to the problem.