What came first, your EV car or the L2 charger?

[Missile Toad]

For purposes of this thread L2 is NEMA14-30 (or better), NEMA 10-30 (or better) and/or 208-240v charging.

 

[zoomer0056]

Ok pole, but why ask this question?

 

[gt2690b]

I built an entire garage before I got my first model s

 

[Missile Toad]

Ok pole, but why ask this question?

I'm trying to join forces with an EVSE manufacturer to provide charging guidance for drivers who want to depend on the vagaries of the variable wind generation in the U.S. Great Plains. If everyone has chargers before they get their car, it might be challenging to get sign-ups for this specialty EVSE/charger.

 

[ChadS]

My first BEV was a used 2003 RAV4-EV. It technically came with a 240V L2 charger, but I didn't have a 240V outlet for it so I just plugged it in to a 120V L1 outlet. We had two 240V outlets installed a few months later, just before getting our second BEV (a Roadster). Even though I had the 240 outlets and chargers to plug in to them, I used 120V for the Roadster for a long time simply because cord management was easier.

We've only purchased BEVs since, and moved 3 times. The last time (just a few months ago) we used 120V until we got an electrician to install L2 chargers, but before that we twice we had time to get L2 chargers installed before we moved (one was a new home and the builder installed them; the other needed some interior work before we could move in so we had time).

120V works for most people - it's only an issue when they drive a LOT two days in a row and can't DC charge. 120V would (and has) generally worked for me. But I like 240V charging because there's less charging overhead, and you can time it to charge completely off-peak.

 

[sleepydoc]

Well, I signed up for a MY and got less than a week’s notice to pick it up so I had to cobble together a 20A, 240V charging circuit while I got the 50A circuit wired.

 

[EVSince2011]

My first Level 2 charger was free with
my 2011 Leaf courtesy of an Obama stimulus program. It was installed before we took delivery of the car. When we moved in 2015, we had two EV's, a 2014 Leaf and a Think City. We installed a GE Wattstation Level 2 charger and used it and a Level 1 for a while. We now have the Leaf and a Model 3. We have the Wattstation and a 3rd Generation Wall connector which we bought when they were $350. We have a Tesla to J1772 adapter and a J1772 to Tesla adapter for redundancy in case one of our chargers fails.

 

[Russell]

My home (as with many homes in the US) was built with an outlet for the dryer and it's capable of L2 speeds.
So my home came with a L2 charger when I got it.

 

[fholbert]

I installed mine the week before I got my MY. Wife came home from a business trip and wanted to know what that thing was in the garage that said Tesla on it? She knew I was looking but, had no idea I’d bought a new car.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Other, I think. In a sense, both:

• I had the L2 charger installed first;
• I had the L2 charger, when the car arrived, but installed the L2 afterwards;

I already had a PHEV with a hardwired LCS-25 (20A).

Once we were firm that we were buying a BEV I bought 2 new EVSEs. (Because reasons).
We initially charged the BEV on 20A and charged the Volt on a mixture of 120V and 240V, until my electrician friend was available to wire things up.
(I _could_ have done it myself, but I trust a professional way more than myself.)

 

[WyoDude]

I was the GC for building my own house and put 14-50 outlets on both sides of the garage with dedicated heavy gauge wire when I built

 

[Sweed269]

14-50 is what you want or the wall charger.
The car uses a percentage of the power to heat the battery, run pumps and power the controller. These are all looses and the higher the power of your charger the lower the percentage of looses you get.
A standard wall outlet 10amps at 120 might have 20-30% looses just to power the car, costing you a lot more money to charge than 32ax240 or 40ax240 setups.

Heat is also the enemy. I installed a current sensing relay that turns on a fan to cool the charger when it is active.

 

[gt2690b]

14-50 is what you want or the wall charger.
The car uses a percentage of the power to heat the battery, run pumps and power the controller. These are all looses and the higher the power of your charger the lower the percentage of looses you get.
A standard wall outlet 10amps at 120 might have 20-30% looses just to power the car, costing you a lot more money to charge than 32ax240 or 40ax240 setups.

Heat is also the enemy. I installed a current sensing relay that turns on a fan to cool the charger when it is active.

I don't know why this got down voted presumably people believe HPWC is the only way to go even though you mentioned that as another option.. then again maybe it's because you misspelled losses

 

[sleepydoc]

14-50 is what you want or the wall charger.
The car uses a percentage of the power to heat the battery, run pumps and power the controller. These are all looses and the higher the power of your charger the lower the percentage of looses you get.
A standard wall outlet 10amps at 120 might have 20-30% looses just to power the car, costing you a lot more money to charge than 32ax240 or 40ax240 setups.

Heat is also the enemy. I installed a current sensing relay that turns on a fan to cool the charger when it is active.

While technically correct and a 10A 120 really isn't a good option, 14-50 is overkill for the majority of people. A 220 - 30 or 40A circuit is plenty of power and avoids wasting money on heavier copper wire. Depending on the situation, a 240-20A may be fine.

 

[gt2690b]

While technically correct and a 10A 120 really isn't a good option, 14-50 is overkill for the majority of people. A 220 - 30 or 40A circuit is plenty of power and avoids wasting money on heavier copper wire. Depending on the situation, a 240-20A may be fine.

Meh.. the wire size is a small fraction of the cost of an install plus it's worth planning for a 2nd EV in the future.. not to mention you'll get the money back on the wire size with the efficiency gains.. 50' of 6/3 is only $50 more than 8/3

 

[Tronguy]

Had the 2018 M3 on order and was looking to charge same. At that time, availability of the Gen 2 WC was hit or miss at Tesla's web site, so, after checking availability with the local Service Center the week before the car showed, went down to the SC, laid out my $500 and change, and got the beast.

We then got the car and immediately left on a long vacation. When we got back, called an electrician, got a bid we liked, and they installed it. Still there.

@Missile Toad, your use case sounds interesting. As it happens, solar went in on the roof, no battery, back in 2008. With NJ's Net Metering approach to life and a seeming error in the state-mandated equations used to estimate yearly energy generation, we've had ~2 MW-hr of extra capacity since the install. With M3/MY, that give us around 8000 miles of free wandering around the landscape a year.

So, I kind of wonder: Is your EVSE crowd simply going to hook up a generator with a semi-regulated 240 VAC to the EVSE gear? Or is there a battery involved? How big a windmill does one need to generate, I dunno, 10 kW of power over time? At what average windspeed?

The inverters used on the solar systems around here are designed to pop off line in an instant with either frequency or voltage variations on the grid-tied load, the idea being not to electrocute line workers in case of an outage. Would your windmills do that, or are they designed not to hook to the grid at all?

 

[sleepydoc]

Meh.. the wire size is a small fraction of the cost of an install plus it's worth planning for a 2nd EV in the future.. not to mention you'll get the money back on the wire size with the efficiency gains.. 50' of 6/3 is only $50 more than 8/3

I did the install myself, so the difference was not an insignificant amount of the total cost and the efficiency gains of 50 vs 30A are insignificant. Don't forget, many people don't have 400A service. If you have 150A service to your house adding a 50A circuit may require upgrading, adding several thousand dollars to the cost.

 

[gt2690b]

I did the install myself, so the difference was not an insignificant amount of the total cost and the efficiency gains of 50 vs 30A are insignificant. Don't forget, many people don't have 400A service. If you have 150A service to your house adding a 50A circuit may require upgrading, adding several thousand dollars to the cost.

You're gonna downvote someone that suggests the most efficient install just because you only have 150A service at your house? You are one cutthroat internet badass

 

[sleepydoc]

You're gonna downvote someone that suggests the most efficient install just because you only have 150A service at your house? You are one cutthroat internet badass

Well, the ‘downvote’ was intended as a disagreement to saying you 50A was all people should consider (which I explained in my response).

The downvote to your last post was just to be a jerk!

 

[gt2690b]

Well, the ‘downvote’ was intended as a disagreement to saying you 50A was all people should consider (which I explained in my response).

The downvote to your last post was just to be a jerk!

He didn't say it's all you should consider he just said you want 14-50 or an HPWC (which incidentally could be 30a)..