deonb
Active Member
Cough, cough.
More coughing here.
Terminal is the only redeeming quality of OSX.
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Cough, cough.
The Bosch ibooster solved the brake feel problem and it's already Incorporated in the Tesla. It's simply a matter of matter of software to allocate how the driver user interface takes in braking/decel input. Right now all regen capacity is triggered from accel pedal because having a certain amount gives a good one pedal driving experience. If they could get a lot more regen, they may reach a point where there is simply too much on the accel pedal and the car would come screeching to a halt on an accel pedal lift off. Then it would make sense to map some regen to the brake pedal. The ibooster would make that easy.. but some people are scared of that.It wouldn't necessarily require any changes to the brake hardware at all. The car can gauge its own acceleration, so it could clearly deduce when the brakes are applied, purely from its own motion. _Amplifying_ the braking through increased regen should then be fairly simple, particularly at lower speeds. For instance, if the driver is regen-decelerating at 30mph (typically ~30kW at that speed) and touches the brake, the car could detect it and momentarily boost the regen to 60kWh to amplify the physical brake effect. This would save some wear and tear on the brakes, and regenerate energy too, though in the big picture it's quite a minor amount.
I suspect the reason Tesla doesn't do this is because it could give the brake pedal an unpredictable "feel", if the regen level couldn't adjust precisely in sync with the friction braking. If there's even a fraction of a second lag, it could feel very wrong. This also could be a safety issue at high states of charge, if the brake "feel" becomes unexpectedly different because no extra regen can be applied.
In any case, what this approach cannot do is to completely _replace_ the friction braking with regen braking, even over a narrow range. That would require a custom brake pedal setup, and would be prone to the same inconsistencies as above. I don't know if the Prius has this issue, or if its regen is consistent regardless of SOC.
You've mentioned this several times. When you say "it solved" do you mean "this product is marketed as solving the blended brake problem" or "I have tried a vehicle that uses iBooster blended brakes and I can't tell it from the real thing"? (Or some variant on one of those.) Naturally I and I'm sure others reading this thread am well aware of how Bosch markets the iBooster, and it would be great if it performs as described. OTOH, I also remember those "close as a blade or your money back" ads, which actually meant "in no sense as close as a blade, but we think you'll find the performance adequate and the convenience sufficient that you won't ask for your money back once you've tried it, and we are willing to write off the returns as a marketing expense."more info on ibooster which has been in Tesla since October 2014. Horrors! It solved the brake feel problem with ability to trigger regen from brake pedal input!
I find TACC transition from regen to brakes pretty noticeable, at least at low speeds.There is still the potential that the transition from regen to brake dust could still be a bad transition even if it isn't passed through to the brake pedal -- it would just be noticed in the braking effect in the car as a whole: perhaps an abrupt g force feeling one way or the other upon the transition from regen to brake dust. But TACC does this all the time -- applying decel through regen and then to brake dust and I've never noticed any change in the feeling.
... and from my own experience, I infer the opposite, or at least that the "I'm from Missouri, show me" maxim applies.From those two facts I infer that ibooster, and Tesla's implementation of it, solved the problem
Indeed. And as I've said elsewhere, I wouldn't be freaked out if Tesla experimented with this, unless it were at the expense of a fairly long list of other things that need improvement more urgently.(actually not a problem, but just a subtle sensation that was noticeable in some hybrids)
People afraid of technology and change will remain attached to the idea of only ever making brake dust through the brake pedal, but generally those aren't the sort of people that would buy a tesla in the first place.
I wonder if this is still true, in AWD models but also in general. It certainly seems like something the control systems could monitor and compensate for.The one place Tesla drivers need to be careful about the one-pedal driving technique is on very slippery surfaces like ice. Regen needs to be set to "low" on those surfaces in order to reduce the risk of skidding on the ice when you take your foot off the accelerator. Read Bjorn Nyland's posts on this elsewhere on the web.
Software controls the level of energy recuperation from the motors. The drive train hardware does not dictate regen on throttle lift.
On computer forums, everybody is always making car analogies so I guess it's appropriate to have a computer analogy on a car forum... or how about a music analogy... more regen = more cowbell!There are those who reported that until an over-the-air update around mid-2013, regenerative braking on the Model S was more immediate. Perhaps not exactly 'stronger'... It was probably still 60 kW... But the mapping of the GO pedal was different. Unfortunately, though plenty of people loved the sporty feel that was very much like downshifting to just the right 'gear'... A lot more folks had very vocal passengers who complained of the lack of smoothness in the transition from acceleration to deceleration. They craved a more sedate and luxurious experience that coddled rather than rattled their behinds. Tesla Motors listened, and made the change, and certain folks (bonnie and/or Captain_Zap, I believe) have lamented the decision ever since. Personally, I'd love if they added a SPORT setting to the HIGH and LOW regen settings. That way everyone could get what they wanted.
I theorized before that if someone really wanted to have 'more' regen, they might have to sacrifice initial range to get it. Either the hidden, unusable portion of the battery pack set aside for protective anti-bricking would be enlarged, with a reserve especially for regen... Or they would just never fill their cars completely, maybe only to 85% or 90%, so that the remaining amount of capacity would always be there to accept regenerative input.
Well, I use Terminal Shell in PinguyOS... occasionally.On computer forums, everybody is always making car analogies so I guess it's appropriate to have a computer analogy on a car forum... or how about a music analogy... more regen = more cowbell!
(BTW, cough, cough... I use the terminal in OSX daily)
Around town single pedal driving is what I'd want with as strong as regen as you can get. On the interstate I'd want more gentle regen.
Why is that?Around town single pedal driving is what I'd want with as strong as regen as you can get.
On the interstate I'd want more gentle regen.
I don't think that's necessarily true. Having lots of regen on the go pedal makes it more convenient to use braking and it may well encourage people to use more regen and less coasting than if the braking behavior was on the brake pedal.the decision allowed for a significant increase in range, both in EPA test cycles and in real world driving.
This is almost true for the Prius which has mild regen on the go pedal and blended regen and friction on the brake pedal. It's common for Prius owners to go for over 100,000 miles in the car between brake jobs.For the average driver it also means that your brakes and rotors will probably never need replacement.
I agree.Around town single pedal driving is what I'd want with as strong as regen as you can get.
On the interstate I'd want more gentle regen.
The level of maximum regen is not based solely on battery capacity. The S/X 90 kWh cars have the same max regen as the 18 kWh Spark EV. Yes, obviously there is a limit derived by the battery capacity, SOC and temperature; but I have no doubt Tesla could increase the max regen beyond the current 60 kW if they desired. This may require a hardware change, and may not be possible via software alone.While not the same level of regen as cars with bigger batteries,