A responsible driver knows the limitations of his/her skills, his/her car and his/her tires.
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Winter tire recommendations
- Thread starter colinb
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
Does not help if somebody else cause an accident or if an animal suddenly step out on the road. Accidents also happens to the most responsible driver. Here in Sweden it's law to have winter tires if you are driving on roads with winter condition.
You just determined that probably somewhere around 95-100% of drivers aren't responsible drivers.
Winter tires aren't legally required in winter here, but the driver is legally required to ensure that the tires are good enough for the conditions. The issue goes under the reckless driving rules. If the police stop you (or respond to an accident you've been involved in) in conditions where they deem that winter tires are necessary, you can get fines or lose your licence for months or years.
mknox
Well-Known Member
True in a lot of areas. I believe Quebec, Canada requires winter tires, and I wish Ontario did as well. There has been some chatter about insurance discounts for those who use them.
Now we’re tilting at windmills. If I, as a responsible driver, drive on my All-Seasons let’s say 40% slower than you do on your snow tires, then my risk is the same. I’ve compensated for the longer stopping distance and poorer cornering by driving responsibly (ie slower).
How in the world did I just determine that? This certainly isn’t my experience in Colorado. The great majority of drivers here are cautious, if not overly cautious in winter conditions; it’s the 1% egomaniacs who cause the rest of us grief.
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Colorado has what is colloquially known as the “Chain Law”. It normally is only invoked on the high mountain passes during extreme weather. There are two levels of restriction. The first level is only very rarely implemented. Note that the Colorado Department of Transportation specifies that AWD vehicles meet either level even with only conventional treads.
1. Chains Only
When this level is in effect, use of conventional, steel-link chains is required. Four-wheel drive vehicles are permitted to operate without tire chains.
2. Chains or adequate snow tires required
This level requires the use of snow tires or traction devices such as cable chains, etc. Snow tires must have the mud and snow (M/S) or all weather rating from the manufacturer on the side wall.
When chains are not used to satisfy the requirement, the following standards apply:
Conventional mud and snow tread with (M/S) with or without studs and a minimum tread depth of 1/8". Studded tires can be used year round in Colorado.
Tires of the all weather type bearing the mark M/S with a minimum tread depth of 1/8".
Wavy snow-treads with steel wire protruding. (Whatever that is)
Four-wheel drive vehicles (all four wheels engaged) with adequate tires: Adequate tires for four-wheel drive vehicles include those with conventional tread with a minimum tread depth of 1/8" and those listed above.
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Skiers and mountain dwellers are more likely to put on a set of snows for the winter. Flat-landers typically use all-seasons unless they have a second set of rims, in which case they may run summer and winter/all weather tires, depending on the season. Snows are not used that much since we rarely see big snow on the plains. Since everyone else is driving on all-seasons, you aren't going to be going anywhere quickly when that happens anyway. Our great insolation results in clear roads within a day or two following most snows. Unfortunately my unpaved driveway isn't as forgiving. All seasons coupled with AWD are fine, but RWD even with my Sottozero M/S winter tires doesn't cut the mustard when the approach to my garage turns into a sheet of ice. I don't think snows would help that much, unless they were studded, but then you have fairly noisy tires when running on our typically dry roads.
Hugh Mannity
Mediocre Member
not sure if anyone has looked at all WEATHER tyres for their cars, good alternative to full winters in that you can run them year round. I plan on putting the WRG3 on the X when it comes - currently they only go as high as 19" though, perhaps 21's are coming soon .....
InTheShadows
Active Member
Our 19" X-ice 3's just came today. Getting them mounted next week. Will let you know our thoughts after our first snow storm.
Just put my 20" wheels with Pirelli Cinturato P7 All Season tires back on. (removing my 21" turbines with OEM Contis) AHHHHHH. So much smoother and better handling, plus infinitely better as the weather turns. I have no clue why I took them off for summer. I guess I still like look of turbines with lower profile, and the Contis still have some tread left to amortize. But the Pirelli all season 20s are noticeably better - ALL the time.
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mknox
Well-Known Member
Without too much shame, snow tires are one of those items that can work out really well, used. Obviously, low tread=no good, but within certain limits playing with widths and aspect ratios can work out well. Currently, looking at a set of 255/40/19's (Bridgestones) and deciding if I want to spin the odo 2.4% faster 
. There are trade-offs and safety margins, and generally a few safe opportunities in between.
. There are trade-offs and safety margins, and generally a few safe opportunities in between.
InTheShadows
Active Member
Without too much shame, snow tires are one of those items that can work out really well, used. Obviously, low tread=no good, but within certain limits playing with widths and aspect ratios can work out well. Currently, looking at a set of 255/40/19's (Bridgestones) and deciding if I want to spin the odo 2.4% faster
I would be careful going wider. I read a post about someone that used non tesla recommended tire chains and ended up cutting into their a arms. I don't think there is much room to play with.
mknox
Well-Known Member
I'm no tire expert, but have been told by those who are that narrower tires are actually more effective in the winter.
Cottonwood
Roadster#433, Model S#S37
That is the advice that I have received as well. On my Jeep Cherokee, my experiences have backed this up. Also, narrower tires allow chains to fit much easier.
InTheShadows
Active Member
We had our X-ice 3's put on to day.
I'm not impressed. It was raining when I left the tire shop and the tires spun when I pulled out on the street. I was even gentle because I never drove in them before.
The wet traction is horrible. I almost feel like I am driving on ice.
A few hours later the roads were dry (65 deg F) and I was getting on the highway. I accelerated at the merge point from 55 mph and the traction control was busy all the way to 70 mph.
A little later I was at a red light accelerated to 30 then pressed the accelerator to around 110kw (halfway between 80 and 160) and the tires broke loose on dry roads again.
I don't feel confident in the turns and I haven't had a quick stop yet.
I bought these because the Primacy's were awesome! I'm really wishing I would have gone with the sottozeros now. I hope the tires are awesome in the snow.
I'm not impressed. It was raining when I left the tire shop and the tires spun when I pulled out on the street. I was even gentle because I never drove in them before.
The wet traction is horrible. I almost feel like I am driving on ice.
A few hours later the roads were dry (65 deg F) and I was getting on the highway. I accelerated at the merge point from 55 mph and the traction control was busy all the way to 70 mph.
A little later I was at a red light accelerated to 30 then pressed the accelerator to around 110kw (halfway between 80 and 160) and the tires broke loose on dry roads again.
I don't feel confident in the turns and I haven't had a quick stop yet.
I bought these because the Primacy's were awesome! I'm really wishing I would have gone with the sottozeros now. I hope the tires are awesome in the snow.
If the high was 65 it's a bit early to put on snow tires:
When Should I Put on My Winter / Snow Tires? - Make Driving Fun with Performance Tires & Wheels | Tire Rack
All tires are slicker when they are brand new, so they will get better, but they are going to perform nothing like your Primacys. They are designed for snow and ice traction.
I ran the XIce 3 last winter and was very pleased with their performance. However, my priority is getting up an icy 14% grade. If you won't be driving during the bad storms and just want a tire to run in cold weather, get a performance winter. If you want to be able to drive regardless of the road conditions, get a tire like the XIce 3.
InTheShadows
Active Member
Thanks for the info. It's not uncommon for us to get snow storms late October. I had 2/32 on the rear and 3/32 on my fronts. I didn't want to get caught in any snow with the Primacy's.
Yesterday was a bit warmer than normal. I hope they get better as they wear a bit.
I definitely err on the side of caution. I slid off the road a few years ago (pre Model S) when it snowed in June, my summer tires didn't do well on the ice.
I lived in PA for 6 years (Allentown area) so realize storms can come early, same can happen here in Utah. Just realize on warm days like that the rubber is going to be extra soft.
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