2017 Investor Roundtable:General Discussion

[FredTMC]

What's the lowest kW you get when you're "slave" to the car next to you? Is it much lower than the 72kW for these dedicated ones?

Secondarily, does the car not tell you how many 120kW open positions there are and how many "slave" positions there are, so you can pick the faster ones if you need a faster charge?

I'm still of the opinion that Tesla needs to add 1x L2 Destination charger slot for every 4 SuperCharger slots for those busy locations where someone may not need Super Charge speed, or just wants a "little extra" while they're shopping, etc. I get the feeling that there are a number of people who opportunity charge at Super Chargers who don't need to.

I'll try to answer.

I'm smart about supercharger spots (of course). I always look for an unoccupied pair first.

If there's only "slave" spots left, then the KW rate depends on how much power the other car is currently pulling. Worst case is the car next to you is charging at full speed (low state of battery) and he'll pull over 100KW. In this case, I may only get ~20KW. When this "worst case" happens, I sometimes move quickly to a new slave spot looking for more favorable results.

The best result happens when you're slaved next to a guy who is nearly topped off. Yippie.

 

[MartinAustin]

What's the lowest kW you get when you're "slave" to the car next to you? Is it much lower than the 72kW for these dedicated ones?

Secondarily, does the car not tell you how many 120kW open positions there are and how many "slave" positions there are, so you can pick the faster ones if you need a faster charge?

I'm still of the opinion that Tesla needs to add 1x L2 Destination charger slot for every 4 SuperCharger slots for those busy locations where someone may not need Super Charge speed, or just wants a "little extra" while they're shopping, etc. I get the feeling that there are a number of people who opportunity charge at Super Chargers who don't need to.

The charger pair supplies 145kW to each pair of stalls. If one car is using 120kW, the other can get a maximum of 25kW.

The car doesn't tell you anything about which stall is which. You have to walk around and look at the labelling, and move your car if you think you need to.

There is no such thing as a "faster stall" - if both stalls in a pair are available, they're both "faster" until someone starts using one of them.

And - the lifeblood is only sucked out of a charger pair if a highly-discharged car pulls up to charge. If you are supercharging with your car at a 33% starting SOC, then it won't use all the 120kW... perhaps 70kW. Which means there's 75kW still available for the other stall. So - just to re-iterate, this problem only exists when people pull up to the Supercharger with almost empty batteries.

 

[DurandalAI]

@FredTMC @MartinAustin ,

Thanks for the replies. It seems to me that the stalls should be able to report to Tesla the current used by each stall, and then have your car "assigned" to the smartest stall choice. So if your battery is at 10% then you need an unused stall. If your battery is at 80% and can only accept 50kW, then you should be assigned to a stall that has another car already on it that is charging at 70kW, leaving the higher kW stalls available for those who need it the most. This makes me really surprised they haven't put this into place already.

 

[AlMc]

Short interest numbers as of August 31st due out at market close: tomorrow

 

[Rarity]

Supercharging Cities

New 72 kW Supercharger for cities!

This appears to be a major initiative. The "find us" map on the Tesla web site now shows quite a few more planned chargers in my city.

 

[MartinAustin]

@FredTMC @MartinAustin ,

Thanks for the replies. It seems to me that the stalls should be able to report to Tesla the current used by each stall, and then have your car "assigned" to the smartest stall choice. So if your battery is at 10% then you need an unused stall. If your battery is at 80% and can only accept 50kW, then you should be assigned to a stall that has another car already on it that is charging at 70kW, leaving the higher kW stalls available for those who need it the most. This makes me really surprised they haven't put this into place already.

Definitely would be the way to go once autonomous supercharging is implemented.

Speaking of which, I'm surprised the "robot arm" has not made more progress since the reveal video.

 

[erthquake]

Speaking of which, I'm surprised the "robot arm" has not made more progress since the reveal video.

Probably not worth allocating significant resources toward that project until FSD more imminent.

 

[MartinAustin]

Probably not worth allocating significant resources toward that project until FSD more imminent.

Well you think they'd be installing them anyway if the tech was workable.

Imagine - heavy rain, you don't want to get out of your car, you pull up to the Supercharger, and assuming your car is within a range of acceptable positions relative to the Supercharger, the robot arm comes out and plugs in.

As it is now, they will have to go around upgrading all the stalls. Expensive.

Right now, an FSD car can drive across the country as long as there is an occupant, or someone standing around to plug the cable in. "Full Service Driving" LOL

But until there are robot arm Superchargers, FSD cars will not be able to drive across the country unoccupied - which I reckon will become a new car delivery option. (offered at a discount based on the miles that will be driven)

 

[Curt Renz]

About a half hour ago I bought shares of a trucking company that may benefit from Tesla semi-trucks. I provide more details in the Tesla Semi thread: Tesla Semi

 

[ValueAnalyst]

Michael Tomson
Comments (210) |+ Follow |Send Message
What is so revolutionary about Tesla that other auto companies can not catch up if electric indeed becomes standard automobile of the world.
Tesla is in debt up to their behind while Ford and others have a ready cash to throw into production capacity if the market becomes real.
With such a forward looking president like Mr. Trump we might be going back to the steam powered automobiles!
I hope China will act as a leader in electrics so that other countries will follow.
But as of now there is no money to be made in electric cars and Tesla might go belly up before they learn how to do it profitably.

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How do you even BEGIN to respond to this...

 

[jimmyjohn]

Just smile; that's your beginning and end.

Michael Tomson
Comments (210) |+ Follow |Send Message
What is so revolutionary about Tesla that other auto companies can not catch up if electric indeed becomes standard automobile of the world.
Tesla is in debt up to their behind while Ford and others have a ready cash to throw into production capacity if the market becomes real.
With such a forward looking president like Mr. Trump we might be going back to the steam powered automobiles!
I hope China will act as a leader in electrics so that other countries will follow.
But as of now there is no money to be made in electric cars and Tesla might go belly up before they learn how to do it profitably.

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How do you even BEGIN to respond to this...

 

[kenliles]

VW announces massive $84 billion investment in electric cars and batteries

 

[MP3Mike]

Speaking of which, I'm surprised the "robot arm" has not made more progress since the reveal video.

How do you know there isn't more progress?

Take for example these new urban Superchargers. We didn't know anything about them until the day they were turned on. Tesla kept a very tight lid on the information. That could be part of why they chose to put the first ones in spots that required significant parking charges to get at them. (Fewer looky-loos taking pictures of the in-progress install.)

 

[Fallenone]

VW announces massive $84 billion investment in electric cars and batteries

VW means business with this announcement. Let's see if its CEO has put other managers in line to take actions that follow.

 

[RobStark]

Michael Tomson "Tesla is in debt up to their behind while Ford"

 

[DurandalAI]

This appears to be a major initiative. The "find us" map on the Tesla web site now shows quite a few more planned chargers in my city.

As an anecdote, I've noticed Tesla Destination chargers popping up all over the place the past 3 months in my city as well. Usually 2 or 3 Tesla chargers along with one standard J1772 charger at hotels.

 

[Reciprocity]

VW announces massive $84 billion investment in electric cars and batteries

Its interesting that VW seems to finally get that it is about the batteries in terms of the limiting factor. Sure you need a lot of tech in the drive train and BMS but you just cannot build enough cars to make them profitable without massive battery factories. There is no OEM that could or would bail them out, its to big of an investment.

Lets see just how serious VW really is. If they break ground on multiple battery factories in the $5B price range at the same time, then you will know that they are serious about trying to catch up and be competitive with Tesla. Tesla has about a 5 year lead and will undoubtedly do a significant amount of damage to market shares of many of VW's most profitable vehicles. To me, this announcement is nothing more then self defense as these companies would be dead in 10 years if they didn't take this serious. These big German companies have strong balance sheets and tons of cash, but they rely on cash flow just like every other company and having their market shares cut in half for the top margin cars can cause the kind of pain that could send them spiraling down, though I highly doubt the German government would allow that. It is still to be determined whether they can or will react fast enough. I know it might seem crazy to think of a 77B and 120B like Daimler and VW could be hurt by little ol Tesla, but its not the size of the market share that Tesla is taking, its the quality. Tesla isnt selling any Smart cars or mini cooper competitors, they are selling S Class and E Class and C class level cars. This goes right to the sweet spot for those companies.

BTW, watched a lot of football yesterday and saw an ad for a Matt Black BMW M7. If that's not a reaction to the Model S P100D, then I don't know what else it could be. It must be $150k+.

 

[ValueAnalyst]

First, your snip makes it look like I uttered that nonsense.

Second, you have to adjust ford's debt for credit co. Read my article: Ford May Be In Trouble.

 

[JRP3]

Well you think they'd be installing them anyway if the tech was workable.

Huge expense compared to the regular cable and plug, plus likely maintenance issues. No, now is not the time, especially as they may be designing better options.

 

[RobStark]

First, your snip makes it look like I uttered that nonsense.

Second, you have to adjust ford's debt for credit co. Read my article: Ford May Be In Trouble.

First, added Michael Tomson to quote.

Second, that is where you start.