2019.16- rural speed limit update?

[astrowunder]

After updating to 2019.16 I noticed a stretch of rural road that previously had no speed limit shown in the car that is now working with the correct speed and autopilot is now working properly there as well.

Correlation does not imply causation, but did anyone else notice this? I hope this applies to a lot more rural areas.

 

[TomT]

I suspect that more to do with a map update then software.... I've noticed no change in my rural roads...

After updating to 2019.16 I noticed a stretch of rural road that previously had no speed limit shown in the car that is now working with the correct speed and autopilot is now working properly there as well.

 

[astrowunder]

Thanks I thought it was probably coincidence, but was hoping for a broader fix.

 

[Zirak]

Really can't wait for the speed sign recognition to make it's way into our cars..

 

[Knightshade]

Map update.

I got it a few days before 16.2 and now there's a stretch of road near my house with a speed limit that didn't have one at all previously (and it's even a correct speed limit!)


Sadly only like the middle 2/3rds of the road got it... once I pass a certain spot, still staying on the same road, same speed limit, it's gone again and TACC drops back to 45.

 

[Big Earl]

Really can't wait for the speed sign recognition to make it's way into our cars..

Speed limit sign recognition by camera is patented by Mobileye.

US20080137908A1 - Detecting and recognizing traffic signs - Google Patents

 

[Zirak]

Speed limit sign recognition by camera is patented by Mobileye.

US20080137908A1 - Detecting and recognizing traffic signs - Google Patents

If that's the case, how does Tesla plan on releasing FSD? They must have some sort of patents which permits them to accomplish this..?

 

[WileyTheMan]

I've seen improvements in earlier versions, so they (Tesla, Google, whoever) seem to be working on it in general. I live near a small outlet road that is posted at 25mph but the car always reported it at 30mph until I got 12.1.2, where it started correctly reporting 25.

 

[Trips]

Speed limit sign recognition by camera is patented by Mobileye.

US20080137908A1 - Detecting and recognizing traffic signs - Google Patents

Correct me if I am wrong (I'm sure someone will) but the patent is for a simple process and using one chip. Tesla has two independent processes and chips that then meet to confirm the result. Lidar is patented but there are different ways that you can design it that are your own.

 

[GolanB]

Speed limit sign recognition by camera is patented by Mobileye.

US20080137908A1 - Detecting and recognizing traffic signs - Google Patents

Its a pretty straight forward patent, and it has been extended until 2030; does anyone here know whether or not Intel / Mobileeye has attempted to enforce this patent, and whether anyone else has callenged the patent in court, or used an alternate method that would not violate the patent? It seems extremely broad to me to assume that no one else can use sensor technology to detect speed limit signs.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Its a pretty straight forward patent, and it has been extended until 2030; does anyone here know whether or not Intel / Mobileeye has attempted to enforce this patent, and whether anyone else has callenged the patent in court, or used an alternate method that would not violate the patent? It seems extremely broad to me to assume that no one else can use sensor technology to detect speed limit signs.

A good patent attorney will probably say there are sometimes ways of getting around a patent by making substantial improvements on the process. I've done it and beat Hewlett Packard out of one of their patents (long ago).

 

[SomeJoe7777]

It seems extremely broad to me to assume that no one else can use sensor technology to detect speed limit signs.

This was my read on it as well -- the patent seems extremely broad. A particular algorithm or hardware design that detects the signs and generates usable informational output should be patentable, but trying to say that any device that accomplishes the same task is covered by the patent seems overreaching. It's like saying that because I've patented my camera, no one else is allowed to print any reproduction of a scene by any method, even if you hand-paint it.

 

[afadeev]

Its a pretty straight forward patent, and it has been extended until 2030; does anyone here know whether or not Intel / Mobileeye has attempted to enforce this patent, and whether anyone else has callenged the patent in court, or used an alternate method that would not violate the patent? It seems extremely broad to me to assume that no one else can use sensor technology to detect speed limit signs.

Option 1: license it from Mobileye/Intel.
Option 2: rely on GPS + maps to look up speed limits
Option 3: challenge Mobileye patent in court

Or any combination of the above.

 

[GolanB]

A good patent attorney will probably say there are sometimes ways of getting around a patent by making substantial improvements on the process. I've done it and beat Hewlett Packard out of one of their patents (long ago).

I woudl imagine that the last thing Tesla wants to do is get into a protracted battle with Intel. I would assume they know what they're doing here.

 

[GolanB]

Option 1: license it from Mobileye/Intel.
Option 2: rely on GPS + maps to look up speed limits
Option 3: challenge Mobileye patent in court

Or any combination of the above.

It may be that if Tesla decides not to set their speed limits based on visual reco alone, but use it in a way that modifies existing speed limits they've defined through GPS/Maps it could be considered a unique enough use to avoid getting hung up on prior art.

 

[NedH]

Mobileye's patent uses pretty old, brute force detection. Basically looking around an image for shapes and colors resembling a sign and then looking at the found shapes for matches. Tesla will be using their neural network to find the signs and thus will be quite different and will not infringe on the Mobileye patent.

 

[outdoors]

My 3 different speed limit issues were resolved prior to the 2019.16 update. I did have a map update about three weeks prior. Was happy to see some rural roads that have nothing posted used to be at 45 mph. Now at 55 mph which is what unposted/rural roads are here in MI.

 

[JBT66]

Most of my speed limit issues were fixed when I received 2019.12.x a couple weeks ago.

 

[SunCharged]

It may be that if Tesla decides not to set their speed limits based on visual reco alone, but use it in a way that modifies existing speed limits they've defined through GPS/Maps it could be considered a unique enough use to avoid getting hung up on prior art.

What about construction zone speed limit signs just put out on a whim to patch the road? Or for a special event? Cameras are going to need to read signs in real time.

Perhaps the workaround is the fact that Tesla is using their own neural network to identify signs correctly? Camera only acts as the eye, like a human?

 

[GolanB]

What about construction zone speed limit signs just put out on a whim to patch the road? Or for a special event? Cameras are going to need to read signs in real time.

Perhaps the workaround is the fact that Tesla is using their own neural network to identify signs correctly? Camera only acts as the eye, like a human?

Chances are this will become a non-issue. There are so many patents in the automotive industry, and many from manufacturers that you'd be surprised even have self-driving divisions, and so far we haven't heard about any significant battles. As we've come to learn, Tesla's implementation is it's own, built from an entirely new code base, and based on entirely new hardware. I think competition will be an excellent way to accelerate the migration to automation, but demonstrating its safety will be a challenge for each implementation.

In five years, this will likely become standardized, perhaps even mandated. Visualization of road conditions is still a primary source of information, and I wouldn't expect that to change!