Adaptive Suspension Damping… Real or Ruse? Which one do you have? Find out fast!

[aerodyne]

Ok, so looking at the first update of 2023, release notes indicate changes to the suspension menu.

Seems to be limited to new placement of control box, but might be more, as it was an "undocumented change"

Who wants to be first to find out if it does anything else?

 

[WilliamG]

Ok, so looking at the first update of 2023, release notes indicate changes to the suspension menu.

Seems to be limited to new placement of control box, but might be more, as it was an "undocumented change"

Who wants to be first to find out if it does anything else?

What dis? You have any pictures of this change?

*Edit*

I found it.

2023.2.0.5 Official Tesla Release Notes - Software Updates

Tesla software update 2023.2.0.5 includes Auto Steering Wheel Heat, Sentry Mode Lighting, Speed Assist, Thai Voice Navigation, Handwriting Keyboard, WeChat Mini Programs, Mango TV, Improvements to Service Mode, Supercharger Prices, View Cabin Camera, Seat Heater Icons, Suspension Menu.

www.notateslaapp.com

Dubious there’s any actual suspension changes. After all, many of us (most?) do not have any suspension issues, indicating a potential fault on cars that do.

Reads like the heated steering wheel and Sentry headlights improvements aren’t coming to our cars with this update? Hopefully that’s not true.

 

[aerodyne]

What dis? You have any pictures of this change?

*Edit*

I found it.

2023.2.0.5 Official Tesla Release Notes - Software Updates

Tesla software update 2023.2.0.5 includes Auto Steering Wheel Heat, Sentry Mode Lighting, Speed Assist, Thai Voice Navigation, Handwriting Keyboard, WeChat Mini Programs, Mango TV, Improvements to Service Mode, Supercharger Prices, View Cabin Camera, Seat Heater Icons, Suspension Menu.

www.notateslaapp.com

Dubious there’s any actual suspension changes. After all, many of us (most?) do not have any suspension issues, indicating a potential fault on cars that do.

Reads like the heated steering wheel and Sentry headlights improvements aren’t coming to our cars with this update? Hopefully that’s not true.

I'm not in any hurry to find out.. hopefully nothing broke on .30

 

[Blue Stuff]

This thread is so aggravating. So much completely off-target "scientific" analysis. Why would you even bother looking at what is clearly a software-only datapoint (the commanded duty cycle or damping %) and drawing a conclusion about the actual physics? The only way someone's readings would be different for the same situation is if they had different software, and yet it's like talking to a brick wall suggesting that we take a step back and look at the physical examples.

Mine is noticeably different. Sport is stiff, Comfort is softer/smoother, and Track mode is bone-jarringly stiff. I can tell instantly within 500 ft of driving which mode I'm on and go remember to switch it back if needed. It works exactly as designed in my opinion. So did my Raven. FAR more noticeable than all the other adaptive suspension cars I've owned - Corvettes, M3s, AMGs, etc.

Nobody doubts that Steve's and other cars may not be working as expected - it's a Tesla, it's shocking that so many of us are working. But we are. It's not a design flaw - there's just something wrong with some peoples' cars apparently. OR, maybe, just maybe, their cars are working fine and they just aren't noticing the differences. Who knows, but it's like pulling teeth getting someone to just go sit in a working car and stop posting the same drivel in these threads.

My console lights are reversed and my ARNR seems to sit on Calibrating for hours, then randomly decide to be calibrated and working, and at some point it will start generating a drone sound that reminds me to go turn it off until it decides to turn back on and calibrate again. I'm no apologist for these wonky cars, which are still the best I've owned...

Since you have what you believe is a working car can you volunteer to let someone that believes they have a problem test yours? One with the same wheel/tire package and drives over the same roads.

 

[SteveSchweer]

Since you have what you believe is a working car can you volunteer to let someone that believes they have a problem test yours? One with the same wheel/tire package and drives over the same roads.

This has been done. Read sub-thread 6 of this thread. They found that their cars were identical. The most current thinking on this subject is found in the thread “Physical measurements of variable ride control show that you’re NOT getting the ride you call for “. Everyone should move over to that thread and watch the new video.

 

[n2mb_racing]

This has been done. Read sub-thread 6 of this thread. They found that their cars were identical. The most current thinking on this subject is found in the thread “Physical measurements of variable ride control show that you’re NOT getting the ride you call for “. Everyone should move over to that thread and watch the new video.

I'll take a look. I could believe there's no difference between comfort and sport. But there definitely is a difference in track mode. It's night and day.

 

[Email]

So… if lower % means less damping, (ie. Softer) why does the % INCREASE when you encounter rough pavement?

More force = higher percentage.

If it didn't increase the force (%) resisting the input, you'd feel like you're driving a 1977 Buick Estate wagon with worn out shocks.

What is the issue with your car? What is the biggest symptom that something is wrong for you?

 

[Email]

When you get together, please try the old “shade tree mechanic’s” shock test: one of you sit in the car and activate the suspension, while the other simply bounces the fender up and down. This should give you a good “feel” for the damping rate. A low damping % will be noticeably easier to push and will allow the springs to oscillate longer after you stop. In this way you can compare different settings in the same car and make car to car comparisons for each setting.

You can also drive over those big speed humps and do the same thing.

Observations:

Comfort. Softish. But firms up if you go faster (feels like the shock is adapting to with additional resistance to the higher shaft speeds)
Sport. Firmish. No real difference when going over them faster, but it's already pretty firm. Very noticeable.
Track. Ouch. Don't do that again.

 

[serendipitous]

Since you have what you believe is a working car can you volunteer to let someone that believes they have a problem test yours? One with the same wheel/tire package and drives over the same roads.

Sure, but I've lowered my car and have aftermarket winter tires/wheels on now. Besides, it's supposedly been done, with laughably unscientific measurements, and still doesn't resolve any of the squawking.

 

[tangible1]

This thread is so aggravating. So much completely off-target "scientific" analysis. Why would you even bother looking at what is clearly a software-only datapoint (the commanded duty cycle or damping %) and drawing a conclusion about the actual physics? The only way someone's readings would be different for the same situation is if they had different software, and yet it's like talking to a brick wall suggesting that we take a step back and look at the physical examples.

Mine is noticeably different. Sport is stiff, Comfort is softer/smoother, and Track mode is bone-jarringly stiff. I can tell instantly within 500 ft of driving which mode I'm on and go remember to switch it back if needed. It works exactly as designed in my opinion. So did my Raven. FAR more noticeable than all the other adaptive suspension cars I've owned - Corvettes, M3s, AMGs, etc.

Nobody doubts that Steve's and other cars may not be working as expected - it's a Tesla, it's shocking that so many of us are working. But we are. It's not a design flaw - there's just something wrong with some peoples' cars apparently. OR, maybe, just maybe, their cars are working fine and they just aren't noticing the differences. Who knows, but it's like pulling teeth getting someone to just go sit in a working car and stop posting the same drivel in these threads.

My console lights are reversed and my ARNR seems to sit on Calibrating for hours, then randomly decide to be calibrated and working, and at some point it will start generating a drone sound that reminds me to go turn it off until it decides to turn back on and calibrate again. I'm no apologist for these wonky cars, which are still the best I've owned...

welcome to the Black Hole known as suspension. it is art as much as science. I spent a decade building and modifying race cars / suspension bits.
this is not something many people have any real understanding of, beyond car magazines and YT videos maybe.
consequently your expectations of this thread might be a bit unrealistic

 

[SteveSchweer]

Check out this petition.

Can you spare a minute to help this campaign?

Make Tesla fix Variable Suspension bug. It should perform as advertised.

chng.it

 

[Blue Stuff]

Check out this petition.

Can you spare a minute to help this campaign?

Make Tesla fix Variable Suspension bug. It should perform as advertised.

chng.it

Blocked by Elon. I get the message "There was an error submitting your signature."

 

[WilliamG]

Blocked by Elon. I get the message "There was an error submitting your signature."

I wouldn’t sign it anyway. It’s sensationalist and not true for many/most, yet it’s written like it affects all of us.

 

[Nieminenracing]

Def not trying to be argumentative so sorry if it's coming off like that...

It's important to flesh out the data we are seeing imo.

So I called Libertyville, IL Tesla and talked to someone in the sales department. They confirmed that my understanding is correct that the percentage reflects the amount of resistance the system is providing in a given direction with 0% being no resistance and 100% being maximum.

The suspension changes the resistance of each shock over the course of ONE bump.

The analogy is catching a baseball. When the baseball is coming your glove is open and ready. As the ball comes you move your hand back AWAY from the glove to absorb the balls inertial weight. Once it hits the glove you then SLOW DOWN the glove speed to prevent further travel. Another analogy is jumping and landing, how you use your knees to absorb OVER DISTANCE the shock of landing.

The adaptive system in the comfort setting is in a default SOFT (low resistance, 0-4%) state. Once a bump is encountered that is higher than the road surface the low resistance allows the wheel to rise up as easily as possible which prevents car body movement. This compression of the shock is then slowed in that direction by increasing the resistance (and is probably handled with the electrical impulse as Steve theorizes, default state is no voltage).

The bottom line is that the suspension resistance changes in the comfort setting from an initial-soft to more-firm for each bump.

I'm just trying to help you guys get good data to help solve this. I won't post anymore on it as I've said my peace!

Hello from Finland. I own 2017 model X 75D. I love the car but i had one problem that i wanted solve. This model year air suspension is only height adjustable, and it is way too stif on damping.. So i bouhgt used raven dampers and installed these! My problem was that i could not find any reliable data how these dampers are controlled. Now i have tested and come to conclusiin that damping rate is controlled with pwm controller and adjusting current going to valves. I can confirm that without any power to solenoids these dampers are fully soft! And when added current these fampers go stiffer. Tested this today. I found a post in BMW forum that someone had made controller for BMW edc dampers. BMW (billstein) dampers has 2amp max current for full SOFT setting. But these TESLA (billstein) dampers work opposite way. I found even one video on youtube for test driving Tesla adaptive suspension,and in this video there is Current percentage in the cars display. So less current is softer damping. Only thing that i dont know is the pwm frequency of Tesla signal and max current for Tesla dampers.. i assime it is about the same 2 amps than BMW Billstein.
I hope this brings more info in this conversation!
And sorry if my english is somewhat strance.. please feel free to comment.

 

[n2mb_racing]

Hello from Finland. I own 2017 model X 75D. I love the car but i had one problem that i wanted solve. This model year air suspension is only height adjustable, and it is way too stif on damping.. So i bouhgt used raven dampers and installed these! My problem was that i could not find any reliable data how these dampers are controlled. Now i have tested and come to conclusiin that damping rate is controlled with pwm controller and adjusting current going to valves. I can confirm that without any power to solenoids these dampers are fully soft! And when added current these fampers go stiffer. Tested this today. I found a post in BMW forum that someone had made controller for BMW edc dampers. BMW (billstein) dampers has 2amp max current for full SOFT setting. But these TESLA (billstein) dampers work opposite way. I found even one video on youtube for test driving Tesla adaptive suspension,and in this video there is Current percentage in the cars display. So less current is softer damping. Only thing that i dont know is the pwm frequency of Tesla signal and max current for Tesla dampers.. i assime it is about the same 2 amps than BMW Billstein.
I hope this brings more info in this conversation!
And sorry if my english is somewhat strance.. please feel free to comment.

That's great work! Someone with the raven suspension that has logged PWM duty cycle using an oscilloscope should also have the PWM frequency. I saw on this thread that someone did that... They could give you that info.

 

[12Pack]

Def not trying to be argumentative so sorry if it's coming off like that...

It's important to flesh out the data we are seeing imo.

So I called Libertyville, IL Tesla and talked to someone in the sales department. They confirmed that my understanding is correct that the percentage reflects the amount of resistance the system is providing in a given direction with 0% being no resistance and 100% being maximum.

The suspension changes the resistance of each shock over the course of ONE bump.

The analogy is catching a baseball. When the baseball is coming your glove is open and ready. As the ball comes you move your hand back AWAY from the glove to absorb the balls inertial weight. Once it hits the glove you then SLOW DOWN the glove speed to prevent further travel. Another analogy is jumping and landing, how you use your knees to absorb OVER DISTANCE the shock of landing.

The adaptive system in the comfort setting is in a default SOFT (low resistance, 0-4%) state. Once a bump is encountered that is higher than the road surface the low resistance allows the wheel to rise up as easily as possible which prevents car body movement. This compression of the shock is then slowed in that direction by increasing the resistance (and is probably handled with the electrical impulse as Steve theorizes, default state is no voltage).

The bottom line is that the suspension resistance changes in the comfort setting from an initial-soft to more-firm for each bump.

I'm just trying to help you guys get good data to help solve this. I won't post anymore on it as I've said my peace!

Hello from Finland. I own 2017 model X 75D. I love the car but i had one problem that i wanted solve. This model year air suspension is only height adjustable, and it is way too stif on damping.. So i bouhgt used raven dampers and installed these! My problem was that i could not find any reliable data how these dampers are controlled. Now i have tested and come to conclusiin that damping rate is controlled with pwm controller and adjusting current going to valves. I can confirm that without any power to solenoids these dampers are fully soft! And when added current these fampers go stiffer. Tested this today.

This makes sense and jives with what I experience with my ride quality and the % reading on the screen.

I will add though that at least in my Raven, the system is making no attempt to keep car level by increasing the resistance on the outer (in a corner) damper. Both sides go stiffer equally going around a corner.

As point of reference I also have a super series Mac that has a clever cross-linked hydraulic suspension that not only compensates side-to-side but also front-to-back and diagonally.

 

[zivac87]

I might be crazy but when I first noticed this thread it felt similar to what OP is noticing but i convinced myself there is noticable difference.

UNTIL I have switched my winter PA5 to PS4S. Not sure if jack mode / vehicle lifting / tires did something to my suspension. But now I can feel difference between Comfort/Sport/Track suspension within 1st 20 meters of drive. Its HUGE difference.

Comfort now feels like my W213 E class its swinging like im driving SUV - never felt this in my 5000 miles before tire switch (even in low setting)
Sport feels like before, pretty stiff and responsive
Track mode feels like gocart

I am not sure what exactly happened to my suspension when car was lifted but something is surely different, it cant be tire only, no way

 

[DerbyDave]

They're definitely working on improving suspension in the last few updates. My car now lifts based on GPS often and where Tesla has detected rough sections of the road, not where I have set it. It even adjusts coming onto my driveway (pretty rough). Comfort is much better than it was. I like the GPS based suspension adjustments made by all Tesla's reporting to the mothership when bad pavement is encountered.

 

[WilliamG]

They're definitely working on improving suspension in the last few updates. My car now lifts based on GPS often and where Tesla has detected rough sections of the road, not where I have set it. It even adjusts coming onto my driveway (pretty rough). Comfort is much better than it was. I like the GPS based suspension adjustments made by all Tesla's reporting to the mothership when bad pavement is encountered.

Except when it’s stupid. It put in its database to raise on the West Seattle Bridge back when the bridge was rough. It’s been fixed and super smooth for almost a year now and it’s still raising in the same place. Completely idiotic…

 

[12Pack]

Except when it’s stupid. It put in its database to raise on the West Seattle Bridge back when the bridge was rough. It’s been fixed and super smooth for almost a year now and it’s still raising in the same place. Completely idiotic…

Why don’t you just remove that raise setting from that location?