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Another Price Increase? 11/11

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First of all there is no contract. Second the ordering system exists only for the dealers (not the consumer) because of US laws that prevent direct ordering from manufacturers. With Ford you place a reservation using the website but it is the dealer who submits the production order and from there on you can NOT change dealers on that order because that order doesn’t belong to you. Third… Ford has no direct control over dealers and can not force them to do anything due to US regulations. There are cars/orders where the dealer refused to back down from ADM even with Ford nudging them. Dealers are independent entities. This both a negative and positive.

It’s not as simple as you think. Americans love their bureaucracy and middle men. Dealerships are these middle men. Once they provided valuable distribution and repair services for ICE vehicles but are becoming hindrances for EV sales.

I was speaking about the transaction between a dealer and customer. If a customer orders a car from the dealer at an agreed upon price, the dealer honors that price (and possibly a lower price if rebates happen to increase by delivery time) if/when the customer takes delivery.
 
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I was speaking about the transaction between a dealer and customer. If a customer orders a car from the dealer at an agreed upon price, the dealer honors that price (and possibly a lower price if rebates happen to increase by delivery time) if/when the customer takes delivery.
The problem is.. there is no contract just a nebulous "suggested price" (no out the door price) and neither party signs anything in these online orders. The dealer submits a purchase order with the config you built on the website to Ford or VW. Essentially they are taking the risk because they will be stuck with the car if you don't buy it. In this market, they can find another buyer easily thought. The dealer is free to tack on add-ons like tint, 3 year extended warranties, $899 dealers fee (they do this in Florida), doc fees, prep fees (hello random $300 for nothing).
 
I was speaking about the transaction between a dealer and customer. If a customer orders a car from the dealer at an agreed upon price, the dealer honors that price (and possibly a lower price if rebates happen to increase by delivery time) if/when the customer takes delivery.
If you hop on the Ford Bronco forums, you'll see many tales where the customer ordered a Bronco from a dealer and when they showed up to pick it up, the dealer wanted an extra $20k+. There's one story where the customer ordered a First Edition and got a call ahead of time requiring an extra $25k. A take it or leave it kind of thing. He was mulling it over and while he was at the dealer the next day to make his final decision, someone was out test driving "his" Bronco. They sold it out from under the original customer before he gave them a final yes or no.

It's super sleazy on the dealer's part, but it's not that uncommon since the order documentation is not a binding sales contract.
 
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If you hop on the Ford Bronco forums, you'll see many tales where the customer ordered a Bronco from a dealer and when they showed up to pick it up, the dealer wanted an extra $20k+. There's one story where the customer ordered a First Edition and got a call ahead of time requiring an extra $25k. A take it or leave it kind of thing. He was mulling it over and while he was at the dealer the next day to make his final decision, someone was out test driving "his" Bronco. They sold it out from under the original customer before he gave them a final yes or no.

It's super sleazy on the dealer's part, but it's not that uncommon since the order documentation is not a binding sales contract.
I have heard these stories too on Ford Mach-E forums, and believe this is why Ford shows the ADM on the online order agreement once the dealer submits the order (listed as “Dealer Selling Price”). Customers are informed in advance that they will be charged ADM, and the customers who are surprised often never looked at that line or even talked to the dealer before the car arrives. Conversely, there are plenty of dealers who do not charge ADM for an online order, though this should be arranged in advance before the online order is placed. There may be a few isolated incidents of customers having their online order changed out from under them just before delivery with undisclosed ADM added, but I believe this is rare or reports would be much more widespread. But strange stuff does happen from time to time.
 
I don’t understand why people still want to buy the “5 second “ fast car
Well, when a car can go from 0-60 in 3.5 seconds, 5 seconds of flat out acceleration will get you into reckless driving territory. So I think the limitation you are referencing will not be a limitation for most drivers. Plus, there are other reasons for buying the Ford. But if that’s your most important criteria for choosing a car, have at it. I think we’re getting off topic though…
 
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Isn't that basically all Teslas? We all hammer the accelerator for a bit. Few of us drive on the Autobahn or the track.

EVs need to get away from the speed obsession. RWD is fine for the majority of us.
Very happy with Sub-5 second accelleration on my Model Y. I‘m not obsessed with it, but I live on a busy highway and need to turn left into traffic to get into town so being able to get up to speed quickly is good. It is also quite nice for passing on hills.

I’m not chasing faster cars, but I’ve gotten quite used to go-fast and don’t want to go backwards on my next car.
 
I don’t understand why people still want to buy the “5 second “ fast car
I understand why some see that as a limit. It is. However its not a realm a majority of purchasers will ever get into. If you decide to race a Mach-E GT and you're holding the accelerator more than 5sec in your MYP, you're likely going WAY over the speed limit. Even worse on the highway.

Its like how the MYP removes the 130(?) MPH limit of the MYLR.... how many people are actually going to take this car to 155? Even when I took my CTS-V out on road courses I'd only hit ~125mph on the straights before having to get on the brakes. I suppose a better driver than me can get up there, but then again, they'd likely be in an actual track car, not some small SUV. It will absolutely make a difference at a dragstrip.... which I imagine a small segment of owners will go to.

I think the thermal issues are something Ford should have worked out as to not have that 5s limit, but they were gunning to beat the MYP. The didnt get there, but they came close enough. That 5-sec limit is something you can tease the Mach-E ppl about, but it really wont make a difference in most peoples buying decisions or driving styles.
 
Very happy with Sub-5 second accelleration on my Model Y. I‘m not obsessed with it, but I live on a busy highway and need to turn left into traffic to get into town so being able to get up to speed quickly is good. It is also quite nice for passing on hills.

I’m not chasing faster cars, but I’ve gotten quite used to go-fast and don’t want to go backwards on my next car.

Meh. I'm done with the extra speed.

If I buy the red/white MYLR I have on order... I will miss three things from the Mach-E: 360 camera, blind spot monitor, cross-traffic monitor. They been AMAZING in busy parking lots. I can park again with only an inch of space in tight parking spots (I'm a curb hugger lol). The Model Y was never easy to get into narrow spots. Those things I rather have than an extra 1.5 seconds less from 0 to 60.
 
Meh. I'm done with the extra speed.

If I buy the red/white MYLR I have on order... I will miss three things from the Mach-E: 360 camera, blind spot monitor, cross-traffic monitor. They been AMAZING in busy parking lots. I can park again with only an inch of space in tight parking spots (I'm a curb hugger lol). The Model Y was never easy to get into narrow spots. Those things I rather have than an extra 1.5 seconds less from 0 to 60.
if you actually pay attention and learn how to use mirrors and look for any obstacles and surroundings, you don't need any of those features to safely park or get out of parking spot or parallel park.
Again, I understand that most Tesla owners are NOT car people who will understand my point.
 
if you actually pay attention and learn how to use mirrors and look for any obstacles and surroundings, you don't need any of those features to safely park or get out of parking spot or parallel park.
Again, I understand that most Tesla owners are NOT car people who will understand my point.

I thought like you too but then I experienced the benefits of these three systems. It’s like ICE lovers who say EVs need sound and gas smells. You will see the light soon my friend.

Also the Model Y has a terrible rear view visibility and small side mirrors.
 
I thought like you too but then I experienced the benefits of these three systems. It’s like ICE lovers who say EVs need sound and gas smells. You will see the light soon my friend.

Also the Model Y has a terrible rear view visibility and small side mirrors.
99.99% cars on the roads today have oversized mirrors including all Tesla cars. You cannot/should not try to see the entire car and surrounding with the mirrors which is simply not possible or designed for it. Rear visibility is no issue since the back up camera is mandatory for 2018 and newer cars in the U.S.
Again, proper adjustment of the side mirrors and situational awareness is key even with all the gadgets.
 
Meh. I'm done with the extra speed.

If I buy the red/white MYLR I have on order... I will miss three things from the Mach-E: 360 camera, blind spot monitor, cross-traffic monitor. They been AMAZING in busy parking lots. I can park again with only an inch of space in tight parking spots (I'm a curb hugger lol). The Model Y was never easy to get into narrow spots. Those things I rather have than an extra 1.5 seconds less from 0 to 60.
I agree with the cross-traffic alert. I have that in my prius and its amazing. Its just a nice added layer.

As for parking, I too am a curb hugger, but thats real easy to see with mirrors. I tend to hug the curb on the drivers side, that way if I do get a ding, its not on a side of the car I'm forced to look at every time I drive.
 
I’ve got to admit it took me a little while to dial in parking on the Model Y. It could definitely be a better experience. That said, once you get the hang of the rear camera, I can get within 6” of the curb pretty much every time now. I also back into parking spaces or pull through and likewise, the reversing camera does fine.

It could certainly be better, and perhaps if I didn’t live on a 2 lane highway I might agree with @voxel, but I do live on a highway.

Aside from pulling out on a busy day, probably my favorite thing about the acceleration is being able to make quick passes on busy roads. In my Subaru I rarely pass because it takes so long to get around the other car I feel exposed for way too long. In the Model Y, I’m up to speed and around them so fast I can make much safer passes. Trebly so on steep roads.
 
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99.99% cars on the roads today have oversized mirrors including all Tesla cars. You cannot/should not try to see the entire car and surrounding with the mirrors which is simply not possible or designed for it. Rear visibility is no issue since the back up camera is mandatory for 2018 and newer cars in the U.S.
Again, proper adjustment of the side mirrors and situational awareness is key even with all the gadgets.

I've had a backup camera in cars since 2012. It's not new to me.

The problem is partially two fold. 1) The turning radius of the Y is poor. 2) General visibility on the Y using mirrors and windows is average at best so even with a backup camera (you aren't looking out the windows) you will miss cross traffic and also miss cars directly behind you that are also backing up.

The 3's visibility is great to me. With the Y, you have to learn it's size and turn radius and you still may never get it 100%. With the Mach-E, I was able to park one inch next to the curb on the second parking attempt with the 360 camera. This is like comparing super-easy Supercharging to pain-in-the-butt Electrify America charging.

Those who never had backup cameras, don't know what they are missing. Those who never experienced 360 cameras, don't know what they are missing.
 
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